Just put in a 502, LL-01, A40, 229.5 A3/B4 oil and be done with it. Your manual says to use it, sans the addendum. I really think you’re over thinking this. Hard to find a better oil than EDGE 0W-40 and it’s $21 a jug right now at WM. No need to shell out the extra money for low saps with a gas engine.
VW 508 Spec-0w20
- Thread starter BTLew81
- Start date
Not overthinking it, it’s a brand new car that calls for the 508 spec. The addendum is quite clear that 508 oil is required, same as several new Audi’s. Just throwing a 502 in there might not be the best. 508 is not just thinner, it appears from some uoa and voa that it’s a pretty unique animal.
Originally Posted By: edyvw
Originally Posted By: weasley
Originally Posted By: edyvw
VW508.00/509.00 is rally unremarkable comparing it to MB229.71
Can you outline by what measure the 229.71 is remarkable compared to VW 508 00/509 00?
I already posted lubrizol chart tool few pages back.
You can compare both specifications very easily. However, this is third time I am mentioning that I POSTED lubrizol chart and it seems that some here expect that someone write full details for them.
You could Google lubrizol tool easily. Still, I posted it here, and apparently it is not enough.
OK, so just the LZ chart then.
The VW spec has quite a challenging wear requirement for example, in the OM 646LA test (more than the MB spec). Both specs have OEM-specific tests in them, so are difficult to compare back-to-back but VW do require quite a lot of fuel economy testing, whilst retaining that need for better wear protection.
Originally Posted By: weasley
Originally Posted By: edyvw
VW508.00/509.00 is rally unremarkable comparing it to MB229.71
Can you outline by what measure the 229.71 is remarkable compared to VW 508 00/509 00?
I already posted lubrizol chart tool few pages back.
You can compare both specifications very easily. However, this is third time I am mentioning that I POSTED lubrizol chart and it seems that some here expect that someone write full details for them.
You could Google lubrizol tool easily. Still, I posted it here, and apparently it is not enough.
OK, so just the LZ chart then.
The VW spec has quite a challenging wear requirement for example, in the OM 646LA test (more than the MB spec). Both specs have OEM-specific tests in them, so are difficult to compare back-to-back but VW do require quite a lot of fuel economy testing, whilst retaining that need for better wear protection.
Originally Posted By: edyvw
I already posted lubrizol chart tool few pages back.
You can compare both specifications very easily. However, this is third time I am mentioning that I POSTED lubrizol chart and it seems that some here expect that someone write full details for them.
You could Google lubrizol tool easily. Still, I posted it here, and apparently it is not enough.
Really? Where? When? Can you post it again please?
I already posted lubrizol chart tool few pages back.
You can compare both specifications very easily. However, this is third time I am mentioning that I POSTED lubrizol chart and it seems that some here expect that someone write full details for them.
You could Google lubrizol tool easily. Still, I posted it here, and apparently it is not enough.
Really? Where? When? Can you post it again please?
Originally Posted By: 1JZ_E46
The same exact engine calls for 502. They added the 508 addendum to meet mpg specs. 502 is clearly appropriate for that engine.
I’m really not gonna argue much more as this thread turned into exactly what I didn’t want it to. This EXACT engine has called for 508 since it was introduced. It’s a lower hp Miller cycle version of the 2.0t. I’m not familiar with what exact changes there are internally, but this engine code has been 0w20 since introduced on the Audi A4 ultra last year.
All of you “it’s under warranty” folks sure change your tune when the factory suggests a thinner oil.
The same exact engine calls for 502. They added the 508 addendum to meet mpg specs. 502 is clearly appropriate for that engine.
I’m really not gonna argue much more as this thread turned into exactly what I didn’t want it to. This EXACT engine has called for 508 since it was introduced. It’s a lower hp Miller cycle version of the 2.0t. I’m not familiar with what exact changes there are internally, but this engine code has been 0w20 since introduced on the Audi A4 ultra last year.
All of you “it’s under warranty” folks sure change your tune when the factory suggests a thinner oil.
Originally Posted By: BTLew81
Not overthinking it, it’s a brand new car that calls for the 508 spec. The addendum is quite clear that 508 oil is required, same as several new Audi’s. Just throwing a 502 in there might not be the best. 508 is not just thinner, it appears from some uoa and voa that it’s a pretty unique animal.
Concur with your approach.
VW 50200 is NOT long life oil.
VW 50400 and VW 50800 are both long life oils, possibly with similar long life additives package (if produced by one particular oil company) and potentially subject to similar engine tests requirements, no evidence though.
VW 50400 being thicker typically in 5W30 and VW 50800 being thinner in 0W20.
Hence, VW 50800 is NOT unremarkable vis-a-vis VW 50200.
IDK about MB 229.71 though.
Not overthinking it, it’s a brand new car that calls for the 508 spec. The addendum is quite clear that 508 oil is required, same as several new Audi’s. Just throwing a 502 in there might not be the best. 508 is not just thinner, it appears from some uoa and voa that it’s a pretty unique animal.
Concur with your approach.
VW 50200 is NOT long life oil.
VW 50400 and VW 50800 are both long life oils, possibly with similar long life additives package (if produced by one particular oil company) and potentially subject to similar engine tests requirements, no evidence though.
VW 50400 being thicker typically in 5W30 and VW 50800 being thinner in 0W20.
Hence, VW 50800 is NOT unremarkable vis-a-vis VW 50200.
IDK about MB 229.71 though.
Originally Posted By: BTLew81
Originally Posted By: 1JZ_E46
The same exact engine calls for 502. They added the 508 addendum to meet mpg specs. 502 is clearly appropriate for that engine.
I’m really not gonna argue much more as this thread turned into exactly what I didn’t want it to. This EXACT engine has called for 508 since it was introduced. It’s a lower hp Miller cycle version of the 2.0t. I’m not familiar with what exact changes there are internally, but this engine code has been 0w20 since introduced on the Audi A4 ultra last year.
All of you “it’s under warranty” folks sure change your tune when the factory suggests a thinner oil.
Excellent response. As you know, Amsoil is not currently making a recommendation.
In my almost 20 years with Amsoil, it's always been crystal clear, using a non recommended viscosity is a direct warranty violation. Some of the stuff I read on BITOG lately is sketchy at best.
Originally Posted By: 1JZ_E46
The same exact engine calls for 502. They added the 508 addendum to meet mpg specs. 502 is clearly appropriate for that engine.
I’m really not gonna argue much more as this thread turned into exactly what I didn’t want it to. This EXACT engine has called for 508 since it was introduced. It’s a lower hp Miller cycle version of the 2.0t. I’m not familiar with what exact changes there are internally, but this engine code has been 0w20 since introduced on the Audi A4 ultra last year.
All of you “it’s under warranty” folks sure change your tune when the factory suggests a thinner oil.
Excellent response. As you know, Amsoil is not currently making a recommendation.
In my almost 20 years with Amsoil, it's always been crystal clear, using a non recommended viscosity is a direct warranty violation. Some of the stuff I read on BITOG lately is sketchy at best.
Originally Posted By: BTLew81
Originally Posted By: 1JZ_E46
The same exact engine calls for 502. They added the 508 addendum to meet mpg specs. 502 is clearly appropriate for that engine.
I’m really not gonna argue much more as this thread turned into exactly what I didn’t want it to. This EXACT engine has called for 508 since it was introduced. It’s a lower hp Miller cycle version of the 2.0t. I’m not familiar with what exact changes there are internally, but this engine code has been 0w20 since introduced on the Audi A4 ultra last year.
All of you “it’s under warranty” folks sure change your tune when the factory suggests a thinner oil.
The 1.8 TSI motor is not a modified Miller Cycle aka Budack, it's a regular ea888 gen 3, not a ea888-3B, ever since it was introduced around 2014-2015 timeframe. All the 1.8TSI engines I've seen at the dealership are not Budack motors.
The 2018 Passat and Beetles do get the ea888-3B engine, a detuned version of the 2.0 ea888-3B found in the Tiguan.
Originally Posted By: 1JZ_E46
The same exact engine calls for 502. They added the 508 addendum to meet mpg specs. 502 is clearly appropriate for that engine.
I’m really not gonna argue much more as this thread turned into exactly what I didn’t want it to. This EXACT engine has called for 508 since it was introduced. It’s a lower hp Miller cycle version of the 2.0t. I’m not familiar with what exact changes there are internally, but this engine code has been 0w20 since introduced on the Audi A4 ultra last year.
All of you “it’s under warranty” folks sure change your tune when the factory suggests a thinner oil.
The 1.8 TSI motor is not a modified Miller Cycle aka Budack, it's a regular ea888 gen 3, not a ea888-3B, ever since it was introduced around 2014-2015 timeframe. All the 1.8TSI engines I've seen at the dealership are not Budack motors.
The 2018 Passat and Beetles do get the ea888-3B engine, a detuned version of the 2.0 ea888-3B found in the Tiguan.
Originally Posted By: Pablo
Originally Posted By: BTLew81
Originally Posted By: 1JZ_E46
The same exact engine calls for 502. They added the 508 addendum to meet mpg specs. 502 is clearly appropriate for that engine.
I’m really not gonna argue much more as this thread turned into exactly what I didn’t want it to. This EXACT engine has called for 508 since it was introduced. It’s a lower hp Miller cycle version of the 2.0t. I’m not familiar with what exact changes there are internally, but this engine code has been 0w20 since introduced on the Audi A4 ultra last year.
All of you “it’s under warranty” folks sure change your tune when the factory suggests a thinner oil.
Excellent response. As you know, Amsoil is not currently making a recommendation.
In my almost 20 years with Amsoil, it's always been crystal clear, using a non recommended viscosity is a direct warranty violation. Some of the stuff I read on BITOG lately is sketchy at best.
Thanks, Pablo. This seems to be a tough spec to meet. It’s been around for a couple of years now and just a few oils meet it. It’s not a run of the mill 0w20. High standards on wear and other things that matter. It’s funny that when I’ve asked about subbing in oil Iin the past on my other vehicles I’ve gottwn a much different response from the thick is the way to go crowd. Lol. I’ve pretty much determined that I’m going with the factory required oil. I’ve got a long warranty on this car so vw can handle any issues if they arise.
Pablo, now get Amsoil to make an oil with this spec, ok?
Originally Posted By: BTLew81
Originally Posted By: 1JZ_E46
The same exact engine calls for 502. They added the 508 addendum to meet mpg specs. 502 is clearly appropriate for that engine.
I’m really not gonna argue much more as this thread turned into exactly what I didn’t want it to. This EXACT engine has called for 508 since it was introduced. It’s a lower hp Miller cycle version of the 2.0t. I’m not familiar with what exact changes there are internally, but this engine code has been 0w20 since introduced on the Audi A4 ultra last year.
All of you “it’s under warranty” folks sure change your tune when the factory suggests a thinner oil.
Excellent response. As you know, Amsoil is not currently making a recommendation.
In my almost 20 years with Amsoil, it's always been crystal clear, using a non recommended viscosity is a direct warranty violation. Some of the stuff I read on BITOG lately is sketchy at best.
Thanks, Pablo. This seems to be a tough spec to meet. It’s been around for a couple of years now and just a few oils meet it. It’s not a run of the mill 0w20. High standards on wear and other things that matter. It’s funny that when I’ve asked about subbing in oil Iin the past on my other vehicles I’ve gottwn a much different response from the thick is the way to go crowd. Lol. I’ve pretty much determined that I’m going with the factory required oil. I’ve got a long warranty on this car so vw can handle any issues if they arise.
Pablo, now get Amsoil to make an oil with this spec, ok?
Originally Posted By: BTLew81
I’m really not gonna argue much more as this thread turned into exactly what I didn’t want it to. This EXACT engine has called for 508 since it was introduced. It’s a lower hp Miller cycle version of the 2.0t. I’m not familiar with what exact changes there are internally, but this engine code has been 0w20 since introduced on the Audi A4 ultra last year.
All of you “it’s under warranty” folks sure change your tune when the factory suggests a thinner oil.
Not trying to argue by any means. I guess I'm just a bit confused why you asked the question in the first place then? By all means use the 0W-20. In fact if you look a page or so back I think I said it was completely fine to do so. Biggest concern I'd have is fuel dilution on an already thin oil. Not sure if VW's DI engines are prone to that.
I’m really not gonna argue much more as this thread turned into exactly what I didn’t want it to. This EXACT engine has called for 508 since it was introduced. It’s a lower hp Miller cycle version of the 2.0t. I’m not familiar with what exact changes there are internally, but this engine code has been 0w20 since introduced on the Audi A4 ultra last year.
All of you “it’s under warranty” folks sure change your tune when the factory suggests a thinner oil.
Not trying to argue by any means. I guess I'm just a bit confused why you asked the question in the first place then? By all means use the 0W-20. In fact if you look a page or so back I think I said it was completely fine to do so. Biggest concern I'd have is fuel dilution on an already thin oil. Not sure if VW's DI engines are prone to that.
Originally Posted By: BTLew81
But the 2.0 in my Tiguan is a miller cycle.
Miller cycle just means the intake valve is left open for part of the compression stroke. It's actually easier on the engine internals in terms of pressures versus a non-miller cycle.
But the 2.0 in my Tiguan is a miller cycle.
Miller cycle just means the intake valve is left open for part of the compression stroke. It's actually easier on the engine internals in terms of pressures versus a non-miller cycle.
Originally Posted By: BTLew81
Yes. Thanks for clarification on miller cycle.
I am sorry if the original post was misleading. I wasn’t asking if the oil was ok to use, I was asking about it. My bad I guess
No worries. I think you are making a good decision to use the 508 oil. Now it's just a matter of finding it for a decent price. Did your car come with any maintenance included?
Yes. Thanks for clarification on miller cycle.
I am sorry if the original post was misleading. I wasn’t asking if the oil was ok to use, I was asking about it. My bad I guess
No worries. I think you are making a good decision to use the 508 oil. Now it's just a matter of finding it for a decent price. Did your car come with any maintenance included?
That’s actually not a bad deal for such a rare oil. Motul’s 508/509 oil is $10 or more a quart.
From what I can find, your options are:
- VW oil
- Motul Specific
- Mobil 1 ESP x2 (not US available... for now)
- Liqui-Moly Top Tec 6200
- Castrol Professional LL IV FE (cant find it anywhere)
Hopefully more players step up. Sorry your engine calls for such a rare spec!
From what I can find, your options are:
- VW oil
- Motul Specific
- Mobil 1 ESP x2 (not US available... for now)
- Liqui-Moly Top Tec 6200
- Castrol Professional LL IV FE (cant find it anywhere)
Hopefully more players step up. Sorry your engine calls for such a rare spec!
Last edited:
Originally Posted By: weasley
Originally Posted By: edyvw
Originally Posted By: weasley
Originally Posted By: edyvw
VW508.00/509.00 is rally unremarkable comparing it to MB229.71
Can you outline by what measure the 229.71 is remarkable compared to VW 508 00/509 00?
I already posted lubrizol chart tool few pages back.
You can compare both specifications very easily. However, this is third time I am mentioning that I POSTED lubrizol chart and it seems that some here expect that someone write full details for them.
You could Google lubrizol tool easily. Still, I posted it here, and apparently it is not enough.
OK, so just the LZ chart then.
The VW spec has quite a challenging wear requirement for example, in the OM 646LA test (more than the MB spec). Both specs have OEM-specific tests in them, so are difficult to compare back-to-back but VW do require quite a lot of fuel economy testing, whilst retaining that need for better wear protection.
Do explain fuel economy part of VW508.00/509.00? If you compare to MB229.71 oxidation and economy are non-existant in VW508.00/509.00.
Granted 0W20 due to lower HTHS will use less fuel (whole 4%, worth engine I guess).
I have no doubt that engine will last warranty period. I highly doubt VW cares what happens after.
Originally Posted By: edyvw
Originally Posted By: weasley
Originally Posted By: edyvw
VW508.00/509.00 is rally unremarkable comparing it to MB229.71
Can you outline by what measure the 229.71 is remarkable compared to VW 508 00/509 00?
I already posted lubrizol chart tool few pages back.
You can compare both specifications very easily. However, this is third time I am mentioning that I POSTED lubrizol chart and it seems that some here expect that someone write full details for them.
You could Google lubrizol tool easily. Still, I posted it here, and apparently it is not enough.
OK, so just the LZ chart then.
The VW spec has quite a challenging wear requirement for example, in the OM 646LA test (more than the MB spec). Both specs have OEM-specific tests in them, so are difficult to compare back-to-back but VW do require quite a lot of fuel economy testing, whilst retaining that need for better wear protection.
Do explain fuel economy part of VW508.00/509.00? If you compare to MB229.71 oxidation and economy are non-existant in VW508.00/509.00.
Granted 0W20 due to lower HTHS will use less fuel (whole 4%, worth engine I guess).
I have no doubt that engine will last warranty period. I highly doubt VW cares what happens after.