Valvoline Synpower love?

[bbhero]

We'll look up Pennzoil Platinum and its latest via on the PQIA site. Compare it to the latest Lubrigold 5w30. Very similar images of each other. NOACK less than 10 for both is quite stout. Additives really quite similar. Quaker State Ultimate Durability is very similar except for the high molybdenum result..

And yes, I agree with your thinking here. Quaker State is a very good oil as well. Underrated a fair amount.

 

[Triple_Se7en]

Originally Posted By: Tony10s
Originally Posted By: Nick1994
Originally Posted By: bbhero
If you dont believe him then call Ashland yourself and see what they say... I'd bet Ashland will say exactly what aquariuscsm says here. They are different oils blended by Ashland.
I'm sure they don't come from the same pot, but they are very similar, he said they are completely different which if you look at PQIA's analysis they are very close.

If I cooked chili in 2 different pots on my stove, one had a dash of cayenne pepper and the other instead had a dash of black pepper, I could say they're 2 different recipes. Very very close, but very similar. That's what I assume the difference is like to SynPower and Napa Synthetic.



Nick1994, I agree. And besides, so what if they're different ... big deal, who cares. This NAPA Syn vs Valvoline SynPower nonsense is getting old. It's certainly not worth wasting one's time calling Ashland about it.


Depending on the length of your OCI, it sure is worth calling Ashland about it.

 

[chunt]

I have not used Valvoline Synpower but became a fan today when I ordered 3 five quart jugs for $36.22 from Walmart. That is a little cheaper than the sale price on Supertech synthetic. I did read through this thread before ordering.

 

[fdcg27]

Originally Posted By: Nickdfresh
Originally Posted By: ChrisD46
There are better synthetic oil options at the same or lower price point . Besides , Synpower is not a particularly long drain oil so two strikes against it for me ...


Some UOA's here may indicate otherwise with a strong TBN over longer intervals. But I take UOA's with a grain of sodium, er, salt...

+1
How many of us really test the life potential of oils anyway?
Yeah, there are a few members, some of whom do regular UOAs, who really do long drains.
Most of us use more conservative OCIs and some members even second guess the IOLMs their cars come with.

 

[69GTX]

Originally Posted By: chunt
I have not used Valvoline Synpower but became a fan today when I ordered 3 five quart jugs for $36.22 from Walmart. That is a little cheaper than the sale price on Supertech synthetic. I did read through this thread before ordering.


A decent value. A number of people got the $2.00/qts of Synpower 20/30 grades at the AutoZone sale. I haven't used Castrol Edge before but at $10.00/jug at AutoZone I had to buy 3 of them. And during the M1 rebates of 2016 you could buy Walmart jugs netted out at $10.85. In any case, there's never a reason for me to buy NAPA synthetic at $2.99/qt on sale. I'll buy Synpower jugs at $10.00 each too.

 

[SR5]

Originally Posted By: chunt
I have not used Valvoline Synpower but became a fan today when I ordered 3 five quart jugs for $36.22 from Walmart. That is a little cheaper than the sale price on Supertech synthetic. I did read through this thread before ordering.

Nice work mate.

 

[Al]

Cheap oil with no boron, titanium or Moly. Just sodium like the cheapest of dino oils. Works OK though. Just over priced.

 

[Garak]

Despite the lack of moly, I would assume they use some form of friction modification. Finding a non-FM ILSAC oil would be a rather unique find, I bet.

 

[Nitronoise]

in my unscientific trial and study in my Taurus,,,

I ran regular syn power synthetic with a good UOA after 5K miles

I am now going to 7K.,, at 4.5 k I fueled and checked my oil ir was still a light gold color on the dipstick even with more idling with winter starts.

I was able to cash in om 4 of the 28.00 3 pack of 5 qt jugs at wally world and have had no problem in a v-6 vulcan ,,, my winter beater with a heater, along with a fill in my wifes Freestyle so at 1.86 a quart I have no complaints on 5W30 syntech .

It seems to be a very serviceable oil and I was a QSUD user for a long time, and if I can get QSUD at a comparable price I'm good with that too just my 2 cents worth

 

[dave1251]

Originally Posted By: aquariuscsm
Originally Posted By: Nick1994
Originally Posted By: aquariuscsm
Valvoline Synpower and Napa synthetic are two completely different oils as stated by Ashland.
If you say so.


I didn't say so,Ashland said so. Please learn to read before responding. Use the *search* feature and you'll see my copy and paste from Ashland.


Where did the former Ashland state this? On a tech line? If so I don't buy it unless it is in writing. I am not talking about the email you received where the representative stated there "may" be a difference in additive packages. There "may" be differences between on production batches of M-1. A lot happens with "may".

 

[aquariuscsm]

Thank you for contacting Valvoline Product Support with your oil questions.

The NAPA Private Label Synthetic does carry a different formulation from our Valvoline SynPower. Though these formulation differences are not drastic, they are present. NAPA comes to Valvoline with a certain set of specifications that they want their oil to meet, and we formulate the oil per their request. These specifications however, are not as broad as the Valvoline standards, therefore the Valvoline will cover more applications.

 

[fdcg27]

Okay, but what standards does API Synpower meet that NAPA's syn doesn't?
There are the Euro grades of Synpower, but these resemble API Synpower in name only and are entirely different sodium free formulations.

 

[slacktide_bitog]

Originally Posted By: fdcg27
Okay, but what standards does API Synpower meet that NAPA's syn doesn't?
There are the Euro grades of Synpower, but these resemble API Synpower in name only and are entirely different sodium free formulations.

Even name brand API Synpower doesn't meet HTO-06 or any ACEA standards.

 

[Triple_Se7en]

Doesn't meet or didn't partake in the certification?
Some brands don;t want to pay the heavy fees associated with certifications they feel are either too expensive, non-important or unnecessary.

 

[slacktide_bitog]

Originally Posted By: Triple_Se7en
Doesn't meet or didn't partake in the certification?
Some brands don;t want to pay the heavy fees associated with certifications they feel are either too expensive, non-important or unnecessary.


Ashland/Valvoline used to do exactly what you describe with dexos1, when it first came out, when the fee was most controversial. Their bottles said dexos1 on the bottle but didn't have the official logo. (later, GM revised their fee structure and now Valvoline/Napa is officially licensed with the official logo)

But they don't do this with Honda's HTO-06. So that leads me to believe it doesn't actually meet the standards.

 

[fdcg27]

Originally Posted By: Triple_Se7en
Doesn't meet or didn't partake in the certification?
Some brands don;t want to pay the heavy fees associated with certifications they feel are either too expensive, non-important or unnecessary.


+1
The Honda turbo cert applies to only a miniscule number of Acura badged CUVs sold here several years back while ACEA is an irrelevance in oils aimed at an API/ILSAC market.
Valvoline does offer Synpower formulations that meet recognized Euro certs, but the NAPA look oils aren't among these.

 

[SR5]

Originally Posted By: aquariuscsm
Thank you for contacting Valvoline Product Support with your oil questions.

The NAPA Private Label Synthetic does carry a different formulation from our Valvoline SynPower. Though these formulation differences are not drastic, they are present. NAPA comes to Valvoline with a certain set of specifications that they want their oil to meet, and we formulate the oil per their request. These specifications however, are not as broad as the Valvoline standards, therefore the Valvoline will cover more applications.


Originally Posted By: fdcg27
Okay, but what standards does API Synpower meet that NAPA's syn doesn't?


I think they are referring to their own internal company quality standards, not a OEM specification. Notice their lack of weasel words too, they don't say "it may contain", rather they get off the fence and say in writing "does carry a different formulation".

To me it's clearly saying that Valvoline, through their own internal standards, try to make their oil a little better than Napa synthetic. Probably to justify the higher price. But they also say it's not a big difference.

Given how similar Napa and SynPower appear in a PQIA VOA, which only measures the inorganic or metal adds, this suggests three likely differences to me:
- different chemistry inorganic metal adds, but at the same concentration
- different organic or ashless adds used, like VII or PPD or dispersants
- different base oils used. Looking at the Pour Points published for SynPower and Napa, for the same grade oil, SynPower has better (lower) PP which suggests a touch of Group 4 PAO in the SynPower.

If Napa is a quality Grp 3 synthetic, it would be easy for Valvoline to add a touch of PAO to lower the PP, and use a slightly more shear stable VII, to create a similar but improved product which still appeared identical under a PQIA VOA. Not saying this is what Ashland have done, but I am saying a VOA is a simple tool that doesn't measure many oil metrics and that within SN/GF-5/Dexos1 there is ample wiggle room to make a better oil (with the same specs) if your internal company pride demands a better product than just the bare minimum to pass.

 

[Bighorn2500]

Just don't see the Valvoline Syn on sale as much as I do the Napa Syn.

When Pennzoil Platinum has rebate making it $2 a quart roughly I max out rebate at 24 quarts.

Not a fan of the sodium used either, but will run the Napa syn if on sale.

 

[slacktide_bitog]

Originally Posted By: fdcg27
The Honda turbo cert applies to only a miniscule number of Acura badged CUVs sold here several years back while ACEA is an irrelevance in oils aimed at an API/ILSAC market.
Valvoline does offer Synpower formulations that meet recognized Euro certs, but the NAPA look oils aren't among these.


Even cheap synthetics like Havoline and QSUD claim HTO-06

No excuses.

Synpower, which doesn't meet HTO-06 and ACEA, and isn't a long-drain oil, costs the same as long-drain oils that do meet them.

OTOH, Napa Synthetic gets a pass because its price *is* good

 

[fdcg27]

Doesn't mean that API Synpower couldn't or doesn't meet that spec, just means they don't bother to do the testing to claim it.
Also, unless you happen to own one of these quite rare turbo Acura CUVs, why would you even care?
How do you know that Synpower isn't a long drain oil?
Have you run and UOAed it over a variety of intervals?
While Valvoline may not claim that Synpower is suitable for long drains, SOPUS doesn't either for their API syn oils while there are users who've run both Valvoline and SOPUS syns to impressive mileages with UOAs to back them up.
XOM boldly makes mileage claims for the various M1 flavors, but the name doesn't necessarily define the game.