Patman
Staff member
The average consumer of their products will have no idea what they are looking at, and they don't exactly want to share their secrets with their competitors either, so you'll never see this happen.
Still having oil Detergents confusion....
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The average consumer of their products will have no idea what they are looking at, and they don't exactly want to share their secrets with their competitors either, so you'll never see this happen.
If they did, would you consider yourself technically capable to predict the future performance of motor oil based upon that?
No. But it gives us stuff to talk about....
But couldn't oil testing companies figure out the additives?
It made my nap hard. I was considering adding Tide to the oil.I'll bet you don't sleep well thinking about oil detergents and all.
Sure.
Just as soon as Coke releases their formula, we can expect the oil companies to divulge exactly what they use and in what proportions…
But they publish performance specifications. Why do you think you need to know the additive levels and which additives are used?
Are you a chemical engineer that can accurately asses the relative performance and the appropriate level of additive?
Not oil companies. The oil testing companies. They list other additives in their reports
OVERKILL
$100 Site Donor 2021
They have very high solvency.IIRC Alkylated naphthalenes (AN) (Grp 5) can remove varnish
Alkylated naphthalene | ExxonMobil Product Solutions
Synesstic™ AN is a synthetic base stock for step-out hydrolytic and thermo-oxidative stability. As a blend component with PAO or mineral oils, Synesstic AN can extend the performance of your lubricant.www.exxonmobilchemical.com
Edit: I'm not so sure anymore because AN are non-polar so I don't know how they should not be able to pull varnish off.
They list elements not complex compounds which is orders of magnitude more complex and difficult to do. If you want them to reverse engineer and detect specific chemicals, then it's going to cost you hundreds of thousands of dollars and take six months instead of 30 bucks and a week for the post office to deliver it.
OVERKILL
$100 Site Donor 2021
Detergents prevent contaminants from plating out; keep them in suspension. Dispersants prevent them from agglomerating, which would allow them to overwhelm the detergents and fall out of suspension. These two things work together to prevent deposits. If we are talking about an emulsification like sludge, which hasn't adhered to a surface (unlike varnish) then the action of agitation of the oil flowing over it is enough to break some of that up, which then gets put in suspension in the oil.
If something with high polarity and/or solvency is also in the oil, like some esters or AN's, then the oil can actually work to slowly remove existing deposits from surfaces.
I haven’t seen one yet that does.
If you, the original poster, are looking to clean out an old engine, OVERKILL gave you the answer. Use a high ester based oil.
Ali
Ali
Which would be what oils since most don't list what % ester they have.
Or the HPL engine cleaner eh?
Detergents (in this sense) are focused more on prevention than cure. They come in the form of calcium sulfonate and magnesium sulfonate (most commonly), the core of which is a calcium/magnesium carbonate salt. These are the same carbonate salts found in common OTC medications Tums and Milk of Magnesia. The same way they neutralize acids in your gut that cause heartburn and indigestion, they neutralize acids in the oil that cause oxidation and corrosion. They're primary purpose is to keep the oil clean, not to clean the engine. Along with dispersants, they also keep contaminants in suspension to prevent agglomeration somewhere harmful.
Certain esters are good at cleaning and is the preferred method. They do so slowly so as not to clog the pickup screen or oil galleys. Products like High Performance Lubricants SAE 30/40 Engine Cleaner use these esters for that purpose.
Certain esters are good at cleaning and is the preferred method. They do so slowly so as not to clog the pickup screen or oil galleys. Products like High Performance Lubricants SAE 30/40 Engine Cleaner use these esters for that purpose.
I was going to suggest to him to look up detergents and dispersants which might help but you explained it best.
So detergents are more like Scotchgard then a true detergent.
While technically true their source is still labeled by the labs who provide the UOA as "Detergents". We then remark how different formulations have different levels of these elements which people then infer as differences in the comparative amount of additive or differences in formulation (ex, SP vs SN). Without this segment of the UOA a lot of what is spoken and worried about on BITOG would vanish.
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