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Tesla Crash (autopilot maybe) --Automatic Braking? #4644029
01/23/18 11:58 AM
01/23/18 11:58 AM
Joined: Jun 2016
Posts: 3,566
MN
oil_film_movies Offline OP
oil_film_movies  Offline OP
Joined: Jun 2016
Posts: 3,566
MN
Anybody know if Tesla Model S's have autonomous braking, active during autopilot or manual driving, like many cars have it active?
The driver *claims* the autopilot was active, but still, the car should have braked on its own, right?
One just hit a parked fire truck at 65 mph. Looks pretty good for a 65 mph hit, BTW. !!!!

Re: Tesla Crash (autopilot maybe) --Automatic Braking? [Re: oil_film_movies] #4644033
01/23/18 12:01 PM
01/23/18 12:01 PM
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 12,761
NH
supton Offline
supton  Offline
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 12,761
NH
Saw that article this morning. Impressive of the car to take the hit.

Not much of an autopilot if it can't detect a large red object with flashy lights on it though...

Maybe the car fixated on the truck and steered into what it was staring at?


2011 Toyota Camry, base, 2.5L/6MT, 170k, hers
2010 Toyota Tundra DC, 4.6L/6AT, 144k, ours
1999 Toyota Camry LE, 2.2L/4AT, 195k, his
Re: Tesla Crash (autopilot maybe) --Automatic Braking? [Re: oil_film_movies] #4644035
01/23/18 12:03 PM
01/23/18 12:03 PM
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 3,231
Where the wind comes sweepin'
Reddy45 Offline
Reddy45  Offline
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 3,231
Where the wind comes sweepin'
At least the emergency responders were there right away lol

Re: Tesla Crash (autopilot maybe) --Automatic Braking? [Re: oil_film_movies] #4644036
01/23/18 12:05 PM
01/23/18 12:05 PM
Joined: Mar 2017
Posts: 6,465
...
PimTac Offline
PimTac  Offline
Joined: Mar 2017
Posts: 6,465
...
They do have this technology but it’s either the same as other automakers provide or a bit more enhanced version. My thinking is that Tesla should not call it a autopilot. It sends the wrong message to drivers. In the end the driver is responsible for this accident and should be charged with driving without attention or distracted driving if that is the case.


Cannot see signatures any longer so it doesn’t matter.
Re: Tesla Crash (autopilot maybe) --Automatic Braking? [Re: oil_film_movies] #4644040
01/23/18 12:11 PM
01/23/18 12:11 PM
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 12,638
The Motor City
Kestas Offline
Kestas  Offline
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 12,638
The Motor City
At this stage these auto features are just toys. But enhanced braking is not. Anyhow, I doubt we can speculate until the investigation is finished. It'd be interesting to know if DOT or NHTSA are involved.

Re: Tesla Crash (autopilot maybe) --Automatic Braking? [Re: oil_film_movies] #4644047
01/23/18 12:28 PM
01/23/18 12:28 PM
Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 3,504
Wet side WA
JohnnyJohnson Offline
JohnnyJohnson  Offline
Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 3,504
Wet side WA
Autopilot LOL you ever see a car manufacturer that never built a car without recall issues.

Originally Posted By: Kestas
At this stage these auto features are just toys. But enhanced braking is not. Anyhow, I doubt we can speculate until the investigation is finished. It'd be interesting to know if DOT or NHTSA are involved.

This junk shouldn't be on the road without a validation like Aircraft have to go through.

Re: Tesla Crash (autopilot maybe) --Automatic Braking? [Re: JohnnyJohnson] #4644059
01/23/18 12:44 PM
01/23/18 12:44 PM
Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 21,915
Orlando, FL
Mr Nice Offline
Mr Nice  Offline
Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 21,915
Orlando, FL
Originally Posted By: JohnnyJohnson
This junk shouldn't be on the road without a validation like Aircraft have to go through.

I agree 10000%

That's why the self driving trucks won't be seen on the road for the next 20 years.

Re: Tesla Crash (autopilot maybe) --Automatic Braking? [Re: JohnnyJohnson] #4644062
01/23/18 12:47 PM
01/23/18 12:47 PM
Joined: Mar 2017
Posts: 6,465
...
PimTac Offline
PimTac  Offline
Joined: Mar 2017
Posts: 6,465
...
Originally Posted By: JohnnyJohnson
This junk shouldn't be on the road without a validation like Aircraft have to go through.

Exactly. Otherwise the NHTSA or whoever regulates this stuff should have told Tesla not to call it Autopilot. That is deceiving.

My Mazda has that stuff too. LDW with intervention, autonomous braking, radar cruise control etc, but the manual is explicit ( as it should be) that the driver should not depend on these systems because of too many variables.

Re: Tesla Crash (autopilot maybe) --Automatic Braking? [Re: oil_film_movies] #4644071
01/23/18 01:05 PM
01/23/18 01:05 PM
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 12,638
The Motor City
Kestas Offline
Kestas  Offline
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 12,638
The Motor City
Instead of vigorous testing of new product, the automakers are relying on field testing to gather data. All too often I see automakers rushing product to market without proper testing. Every manufacturer to be first and one-up the competition in this rat race. If something goes bad... oh well!

I wouldn't be surprised if they change the name from "autopilot." Remember that auto manufacturers came up with the name "supplemental restrain system" instead of "air bag," because they didn't want the public relax on seat belt use.

Re: Tesla Crash (autopilot maybe) --Automatic Braking? [Re: oil_film_movies] #4644091
01/23/18 01:34 PM
01/23/18 01:34 PM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 19,104
Dallas,Tx USA
aquariuscsm Offline
aquariuscsm  Offline
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 19,104
Dallas,Tx USA
More proof that with all the fancy nanny gadgets,nothing beats old school "human driving".


1996 Nissan 300ZX 5-speed,Arctic Pearl(#175 of 300)
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Re: Tesla Crash (autopilot maybe) --Automatic Braking? [Re: oil_film_movies] #4644103
01/23/18 01:55 PM
01/23/18 01:55 PM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 8,448
Illinois
mrsilv04 Offline
mrsilv04  Offline
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 8,448
Illinois
So glad that there isn't a fire fighter who is missing a pair of legs because of this jerk.

This is what happens when morons with more money than common sense discover technology, and they're too stupid to handle it.


2004 Silverado - on its 3rd Jasper engine in less than one year.
Re: Tesla Crash (autopilot maybe) --Automatic Braking? [Re: oil_film_movies] #4644104
01/23/18 01:56 PM
01/23/18 01:56 PM
Joined: Sep 2010
Posts: 7,485
S California
OneEyeJack Offline
OneEyeJack  Offline
Joined: Sep 2010
Posts: 7,485
S California
If these sensors are not behind the windshield like the Subaru what happens when the car gets dirty? Do the sensors display a warning message when they are obstructed?

Could this driver be acting as a field tester for as yet still developing technology?

Should cars using this immature technology be somehow marked so that others can stay away if possible?

Re: Tesla Crash (autopilot maybe) --Automatic Braking? [Re: oil_film_movies] #4644109
01/23/18 02:04 PM
01/23/18 02:04 PM
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 41,513
'Stralia
Shannow Offline
Shannow  Offline
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 41,513
'Stralia
The semi incident they blamed because the autopilot could see under the trailer, so therefore missed it.

This clearly refutes that.

Tesla claims that it's safer than a human, but that's based on when they allow it, which isn't twisty mountain curves (where according to local signs, 9/10 rural accidents occur on curves).

Tesla calims that the driver is still ultimately in control, but as can be seen in industrial automation, the more removed the driver is from the regular operation, the slower he is to parse the alarm screens, identify the issue, and take correct corrective action.

I second (or third, or 4th) the statement that this junk shouldn't be being tested on public roads (google cars or other).

And it should be either full autopilot, or off.

And Tesla, or the worker who wrote the algorythms should be charged as appropriate for every accident that they have partaken in. (Oz law is that if I see my wife heading for an accident, and grab the wheel, I own 50% of the outcome)...should be exactly the same here.

Re: Tesla Crash (autopilot maybe) --Automatic Braking? [Re: oil_film_movies] #4644141
01/23/18 02:47 PM
01/23/18 02:47 PM
Joined: Jun 2009
Posts: 430
New England
555 Offline
555  Offline
Joined: Jun 2009
Posts: 430
New England
Person behind the wheel at fault.
Driver is always supposed to be observant and attending to the controls. How does one not see a fire truck and slow down?
Not a big fan of this technology but once we start blaming the car for something that a human is supposed to be doing, this type of occurrence will just turn into lotteries for the sue happy.
Remember how the Audi 5000(100 outside the U.S.)unintended acceleration lawsuit got started? Mom runs over her kid. Sues Audi, years later admits she stepped on gas pedal. Suddenly various manufacturers facing lawsuits over unintended acceleration. Manufacturers became the scapegoats for peoples mistakes.


84 XJ6 M1
92 Mustang 5.0 Redline
99 Tahoe 2 door Castrol Edge
99 MX5 Miata Anniversary Edition M1
04 Subaru STi Motul
Re: Tesla Crash (autopilot maybe) --Automatic Braking? [Re: oil_film_movies] #4644150
01/23/18 03:09 PM
01/23/18 03:09 PM
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 14,552
Silicon Valley
PandaBear Offline
PandaBear  Offline
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 14,552
Silicon Valley
All new tech like these will go through teething period. Unfortunate that some people will die because we don't know what we are building until then, but in the long run it will be safer for the rest of us survivors.


"You keep asking questions PandaBear and you'll end up a vegetarian like my wife" - Camu Mahubah
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