Flying the Boeing 757-200
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Wayne, a fantastic write-up. Very nice of Astro and United to get you in, twice, now ( all airlines are extremely busy with their simulators and training nowadays ).Thanks to @Astro14 I had the privilege of flying a Boeing 757-200 simulator at the United Airlines training center in Denver.
The simulator (SIM) is a spectacular example of human ingenuity and engineering. CAE is the SIM manufacturer. The cockpit was built by Boeing for the real 757, then sold to CAE. CAE starts with the Boeing 757-200 cockpit complete with all instrumentation, switches, levers, breakers, controls, seats, etc. and builds the SIM around the cockpit. There are many racks of computers and graphics engines behind the SIM in the computer room. The SIM requires an entire section of the building for the SIM itself and all the supporting computers, hydraulics, actuators, etc. I believe a new SIM today is in the neighborhood of $50,000,000.
You can see the three projectors that give you a visual outside the cockpit windows. They project onto mirrors the reflects the image to your eyes.
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The SIM is the most realistic simulation I have ever seen. You can't tell you are not flying the real airplane. The graphics are a bit less realistic than looking outside at the real vicinity of a real airplane, but when you are flying it doesn't detract from the realism. When taxiing, you feel bumps in the tarmac, you see cars on the freeways, you hear all the sounds of the airplane, if they would put a spritz of jet exhaust smell into the cockpit, you'd be even further convinced of the realism.
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From turning the master power switch on during the preflight to shutting the airplane down at the destination, every action is exactly like flying a revenue flight. All checklists and procedures are carefully followed. Crews are expected to do their part exactly and coordinate as they are taught in CRM training. Remember, in the SIM both pilots are undergoing qualification training to do their job safely while carrying real passengers behind them.
We walked through the entire preflight, which includes programming the flight plan into the FMS (Flight Management System) and verifying all flight data such as weights, winds, temp, fuel, etc). The hydraulic systems and about 15 other systems are checked before engine start. When you start the engines, you actually hear the sounds of the engines and feel the inertia rock the airplane just a bit, just like you do in the real airplane. You get pushed back from the gate, then start taxing to the active runway.
Taxi steering is controlled by a tiller close to the captains left hand. There is a lever with a knob that you turn the front wheel. The steering is pretty sensitive and if you over steer, the SIM will simulate the mass of the airplane rocking back and forth, which could make someone sensitive to airsickness, sick. It's that realistic. You need about 25% of N1 to get the airplane moving and the taxi speed limit is 20kts groundspeed. There is a ground speed indicator on the HSI (Horizontal situation indicator). I sat in the left seat (captain), so I did all the taxiing.
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When you are ready for takeoff, on the runway and lined up properly, you advance the throttles to about where you think they need to be for takeoff EPR (Engine Pressure Ratio), then you reach up above the throttles and push the auto throttles button, it sets exact takeoff power for you, so you aren't messing with it when you should be looking outside. The auto throttles can be used in every phase of flight and are very slick. The SIM tips back probably 20° giving you the feeling that you are accelerating down the runway. The reason the SIM feels so realistic is that it's full of feelings.The movement in concert with the visual changes looking out the cockpit windows convince you that this is real. It's incredibly convincing.
We did an entire flight from San Diego to Las Vegas, which included a SID (Standard Instrument Departure) from SAN, en route, a STAR (Standard Arrival Route) to the IAF (Initial approach fix) for a RNAV approach into LAS and landing. The whole flight there is so much going on that it's overwhelming because I'm not familiar with the airplane and I'm not used to going 500 MPH. My co-pilot did a great job of keeping me out of trouble. We flew both with the auto pilot and I hand flew the airplane with the flight director. The auto pilot is simply amazing. The 757 is a great flying and landing airplane. I believe it's easier to land than the 767-400.
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Next, we taxied back to the active runway and took off. Shortly after takeoff, I pulled the throttle for the left engine back to idle, as I wanted to simulate an engine out. I think we were still climbing at 1,500 fpm and Astro pointed out that I was going > 300 kts. Wow, that's performance! We climbed to about 25k feet and did a few stalls. The airplane stalls nicely without rolling over, which really surprised me. Some small airplanes I've flown love to roll over on their back when stalled. We simulated the Air France flight 447 crash where the crew inadvertently stalled the airplane in cruise. They didn't realize the plane was stalled and held full back on the joystick (Airbus) with full power and couldn't get out of the stall. The 757 is one of the highest thrust to weight ratio airliners ever built. While in a deep stall, man does the SIM try to shake your fillings out!, even with full power, you can't recover. Why? Because the wings make so much induced drag while stalled that even the raw power of the 757 can't overcome the drag. Push the nose down about 30° and it recovers quickly with only a couple thousand feet of altitude loss.
We shut the autopilot and flight director off and I hand flew the airplane for probably 45 minutes doing several different maneuvers, full power climbs, idle power descents, level flight, etc. In a Cessna 172 power controls altitude and pitch controls airspeed. It's the same in a 757, in many ways a 757 flies just like a single engine Cessna. It's just a lot heavier, has incredible power, goes a LOT faster, and is way way more complex. When I was done hand flying we were just south of Las Vagas at 25k feet and I asked Astro if we could make the airport. We used full speed brakes to increase our descent rate, then added flaps and gear as speed allowed. We did a visual approach and successfully landed from almost over the airport at 25k feet. That's some serious descent rate!
The autopilot and flight director, are wonderful tools to reduce pilot workload. The autopilot does an amazing job of flying the airplane. I can see how some pilots lose their flying skills because they become reliant on the automation. The autopilot is also very complex and it would take hundreds of hours of training and use to really know how use all of its capabilities.
The next landing was at my home airport close to where I grew up and did my initial flight training.
My hometown out the window, it's pretty realistic.
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RWY 12 at ALO (Waterloo, IA) 12 miles away.
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The last landing was at Goose Bay, Labrador. Astro has flown over it many times, just hasn't had to land there, think emergency.
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What a fantastic experience! Thanks Astro!
The 757 is an incredible aircraft in so many areas ( 767 also, but I never liked the look of it as much ), so it's no surprise to see airlines still flying them when they have other options.
Does the 757, only have a tiller steering on the Captain's side?
AF 447 was in such a deep stall ( and out of trim from the FO holding the stick fullback ), that they say it would have taken 10,000 feet to recover. Having the stick shaker go off on the 757 ( and buffetting ) is hard to ignore, not sure why AF447 pilots ignored the repeated audio "stall" warnings" while flying at a 10-degree pitch, nose up.
Never been to SAN but I have been to that airport in Labrador. That's a pretty short flight from SAN - LAS. Love the crowbar arrival into LAS description ( probably has VERY effective speed brakes, unlike the A321 ). Are there any flap-setting restrictions with speed brakes out?
That's a very interesting post, thanks for sharing it with us, and thanks to Astro and United.
Yes, captain does all the steering during taxi
The buffeting starts before the stick shaker and the buffeting is really harsh. It would be impossible to ignore.
I don't have anything to compare the speed brakes to, but the sure seem effective to me.
I'm surprised how much the stall speed decreases when the speed brakes are deployed, even at the first level. The 757 and 767 are similar in this respect. When you deploy full speed brakes, you'd better not be slow.
Not that I remember, but @Astro14 will know.
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Thanks
VLS increases on the PFD ( primary flight display ) when we extend the speed brakes on the Airbus ( VLS = lowest selectable speed )
We can't have full flaps out with speed brakes on the A321 ( 4 settings....only fap 2 with speed brakes out ).
When on a stabilized approach, would you ever used speed brakes in the Airbus?
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Not normally, but we have 3 gates with respect to our stable approach ( and landing/GA ) criteria ( 1000, 500, 200 then TDZ markings or shorter TPL ) and, in theory, a pilot could meet the SALGA requirement with the speed brakes out past the 1000 gate ( but "correcting" ) as long as the aircraft is in the final configuration, on speed, brakes stowed, normal ROD for the conditions, and in the slot ( GP/CL ) by 500.
It would be VERY rare.
If you need brakes, use them but most experienced pilots try to avoid using them unless they have to ( at least with me ) . Newer pilots rely on them more, a lot, I notice.
I always tell people to keep their one hand on them when out, even on the Airbus ( because ECAM will, eventually, caution pilots they are still out with power coming up meaning you don't need them out anymore )
I watched this movie once ,,,,
There are no specific restrictions for the use of speed brakes with landing flaps. There will be considerable buffet with flaps greater than 20 and speed brakes extended.
There is a flight manual restriction that prohibits their use below 1,000 feet.
You will get an EICAS caution with speed brakes extended if you have, 1. Either throttle above 15%, 2. Flaps great than 20, or 3. Radio altitude below 800 feet.
You would have to be quite far behind the airplane to need speed brakes with both flaps and gear down.
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Or, requesting a visual from 25,000 not far from the airport with gear and flaps out
Agreed, in real life, you would not have landing flaps and speed brakes out.
I was not aware pilots would also get a caution if they forgot the speed brakes out below 800 feet.
Many years ago, a B757 crew hit the tail during landing due to forgetting the speed brakes were out. Weird how they did not see that caution. I thought it was just a memory (keep hand on until stow ) and landing checklist thing.
C’mon now, we both know your max flap extension altitude is 20,000…Or, requesting a visual from 25,000 not far from the airport with gear and flaps out
Agreed, in real life, you would not have landing flaps and speed brakes out.
I was not aware pilots would also get a caution if they forgot the speed brakes out below 800 feet.
Many years ago, a B757 crew hit the tail during landing due to forgetting the speed brakes were out. Weird how the did not see that caution. I thought it was just a memory (keep hand on until stow ) and landing checklist thing.
I don’t remember the 757 tail strike with SB extended. I’ll have to look that one up.
Hard to imagine they missed the EICAS, because it includes sound, but they must have…
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Talking about your 757…..I have no clue what the max flap altitude is on the 757 , how would I know
?25,000 , is the landing gear extend speed on the Airbus.
I posted the report about the 757 tail strike incident not long ago.
Yeah, they missed it and hit the tail.
Speaking of the Airbus, if I was cleared a visual at 25,000 and close to the airport , I would put the gear down ( 249 KIAS, 24,999 feet ), accelerate to 280 ( max speed once it is out ) until 10,000 , slow to 250 KIAS, and keep it clean with full speed brakes. Different techniques for different planes.
Great energy mgt practice in the sim in case of an emergency one day.
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Thank you for that…quite a read… The reason they didn’t hear or see the speedbrake EICAS warning was the multiple GPWS and EICAS warnings caused by an atrociously unstable approach…
The speedbrake were lost in the multitude of warnings. They weren’t even in landing configuration until 250 feet. Not even close to being on profile at that point, but they continued. Just awful flying.
So, the approach looked like this:
He briefed a visual, but then selected approach, with the aircraft at flaps 5, gear up, and 210 knots at 2,000 feet.
He was way, way behind…
So, upon interception of glideslope, the aircraft nose lowered quickly, which resulted in an initial rate of descent of approximately 2,000 feet per minute (fpm); the descent rate eventually decreased and stabilized around 1,200 fpm. The captain selected speed brakes out in order to keep the speed from increasing. Approximately 41 seconds after the descent was started, an EICAS AUTOPILOT caution message appeared, and the master caution lights illuminated (indicating degraded autopilot operation).
Eleven seconds later, as the aircraft descended through 800 feet above ground level (agl), the CONFIG light on the centre panel illuminated along with the master warning lights (indicating that the landing gear was not down). (Note: gear up at 800 feet is way beyond any stabilized approach criteria, it should be down, and locked, at about 1,500).
Seven seconds later the ground proximity warning system (GPWS) emitted an aural "Glide Slope" warning, indicating deviation below the glide slope.
At this point, (which was about 700 feet) the landing gear was selected down, and the autopilot was disengaged. Six seconds after the first GPWS warning, the GPWS aural warning "Too Low Terrain" came on; the glide slope and terrain warnings continued until the landing gear was down and locked, which occurred at approximately 400 feet agl, with the aircraft 3.2 dots below the glide slope at a speed of 185 knots (so, at 400 feet, WAY below glideslope and still about 50 knots fast). The flaps were lowered 14 seconds later and reached position 30 when the aircraft was at about 250 feet agl.
What a train wreck of events…. This wasn’t really a speedbrake issue at all…
How did the flight crew get so far behind the airplane and the situation? Why didn't they go-around? I believe most airlines have a policy that if you are not stabilized, you go around?
I’ve touched on the “why didn’t they go around” subject before - and it’s complicated. Policy certainly said, go around. But pilots suffer from pressure to “complete the mission/task” and often, under stress, pilots cannot admit to themselves that they are out of acceptable parameters.
Post in thread 'All 9 aboard U.S. Navy plane that overshot runway escape injury, Hawaii official says'
https://bobistheoilguy.com/forums/t...jury-hawaii-official-says.376170/post-6704545
My understanding is that the stall alarm did not sound because the pitot tubes were all iced up. The computers did not have a usable airspeed reading.
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Audible stall warning ( “ stall, stall, stall” ) was working and it kept going off until it hit the water.
Stall warning comes from AoA, not the pitot system.
They got into a “deep stall” and were dropping like a rock with 10 degrees nose high pitch ( and zero airspeed ).
When the CA came into the cockpit from the bunk, one of the first things he said was….” 10 degrees pitch”.
It was too late.
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I notice the CA kept the AP on , even when behind the aircraft, in good weather.
Personally, I make it a habit of hand flying the approach ( RAW data ) when doing a visual, especially if caught high/fast.
Automation can decrease the workload, but not in that type of situation, in my view.
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If I'm correct, three take off thrust settings, with the second thr most used. My buddy flew these for years, LOVED being at the top of the runway in Minnesota in the dead of winter....
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