Purolator failure?

[Nyogtha]

I found lots of filter choices on RockAuto for this vehicle / engine.

RA LINK

The Ultra Power 51212 should be a Wix or Carquest Blue equivalent manufactured by Wix, for $2.42, so a 10K miles rated cartridge need not be expensive.

The Mann cartridge is only $7.35

The Premium Guard Extended Life cartridge is $3.95 and the Ecogard Synthetic+ cartrige is $5.27.

Personally I'd stock up on the Ultra Power 51212 (but not the R51212) at that price.

Originally Posted By: WellOiled
Porsche recommends Mobile 1 5W30 up to 10K miles / 1 year for the V6.


It's probably a pain tracking down a Mobil 1 product in 5W-30 that meets Porsche specs here in the US - suprised Mobil 1 0W-40 Euro isn't what's recommended as I'm confident that meets the Porsche specs, as would several other brands in one or more of their Euro oil flavors such as Castrol and Pennzoil for easy to find ones. The 0W-40 will be much kinder for cold starts in a colder climate than 10W-30.

Agree with others the bypass valve functionality needs to be checked out.

As for mising cartridge material, since the engine is still running, what are you gonna do about it other than live with it at this point?

 

[gtmaster303]

Originally Posted By: wemay
Originally Posted By: dlundblad
Originally Posted By: gtmaster303
Originally Posted By: wemay
There is way too little information about this situation, and the information known points towards questionable regimen.

What else do you want to know?


You started the whole thread with very little information.


Driving style?
Why M1 10w30?
Yours since new?
Any major engine repairs?

-Driving style really depends on who's driving, but for the most part moderate. Car does get opened up from time to time on the highway - I've personally gotten it up to 115mph
-Mobil 1 because it's what I had lying around at the time. Actually it was a mix of 5 and 10w Mobil 1
-Bought preowned at 30k
-No repairs thus far. Car runs like a top

 

[gtmaster303]

Originally Posted By: goodtimes
I would be really concerned where all that end cap went, and those tabs on the end cap end. If in the engine, that is not the best.
Humans have a tendency to not see details at first, like the fine print in oil change interval recommendations. That tendency to see only the large print is what the marketers take advantage of. I saw it on a nature show or something.

Tabs are all there, what you saw was the other side of the filter which is flat. However, end cap did split very clearly in the picture.

 

[Audios]

Cut your interval in half if youre going to use cheaper quality parts. Theres nothing wrong with the cheaper filters and oil, but when you ask them to do a very difficult interval, you can expect results like this. Otherwise get an OE Hengst/Mann/ Mahle and something A40 approved if you want to run the correct 10k one year interval, even the M1 0/40 would be a better choice in this case for the full run.

 

[gtmaster303]

Ok so from what I've learned here, if I want to use the same parts/setup, I should shorten intervals down to 7-8k
Oil is not really the issue here, it's the filter that's the limiting factor
and I should clean/replace the oil filter bypass valve - is there any way to actually determine/diagnose if this needs to be replaced?

am I missing anything?

What I find interesting is why Purolator would list the L25545 as a compatible part if it can't hold a 10k interval with some safety margin built in
I had a similar concern when I contacted Fram about using a base Extraguard for a 10k factory interval. What they told me was if it's a compatible part, it should be applicable for the factory interval. Maybe Purolator is different? I may contact them just to see
Here's the Fram thread for reference, if anyone is interested
https://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php/topics/3395186/Re:_Autolite_Oil_Filter#Post3395186

EDIT: I was right! (maybe) Purolator oil filters are engineered to meet original factory performance for your vehicle. Made for routine driving conditions, Purolator’s rugged construction provides proven filtration performance and protects engines against damaging dirt and debris for up to 5,000 miles (or as specified by your vehicles owner’s manual). So if they list it for my car, it should be able to handle a 10k interval...

 

[Nyogtha]

This site has the Porsche A40 approved oils list from 2015, which should be fine for a 2010 MY vehicle.

https://rennlist.com/forums/991-gt3-gt3rs-and-911r/929763-porsche-approved-oil-list.html

None of the oils on this list are xW-30. None of the oils listed there are 10W-xx. Most are xW-40 with a few xW-50.

A 0W-40 oil will have lower viscosity at low temperatures than a 10W or a 5W, therefore reducing startup pressure differential across the filter element during cold start conditions at low ambient temperatures. Mobil 1 0W-40 Euro is on the list, guaranteed for 10K miles use, and easily found in the USA. Pennzoil Platinum 0W-40 Euro is also on the list, is easily found in the USA, and currently has a rebate.

A filter element rated for 10K miles to start with would be my personal choice rather than pushing a filter element rated for 5K miles past 5K miles. The filter elements I listed in my prior post are all rated for 10K miles use, the Mann filter may even be rated further for 16K miles (30K km), none of those are expensive. All were under $8 before shipping, two were under $5 before shipping.

A bypass valve should open before filter media experiences enough pressure diffetential to compromise the element. Yours is built into your engine. If it were my vehicle I'd have it checked out.

YMMV

 

[goodtimes]

What does the manual say under severe service? Glad the tabs are there. All the filter makers say X miles or according to the manual. It's sort of a tricky interpretation. I think it has been argued many times.

 

[cronk]

I am not a Purolator fan and don't use them since the whole "tearolator" thing began. I hate to have to sort of defend hem here but...
What is Porsche's time limit? I bet its 10k or 1 year. I have always thought it a bad idea leaving a filter on over a year. Moisture that forms in the oil will degrade cellulose media.
Either way, I'd be looking for a better quality filter! Whatever Purolator says, that filter does not look like it is up to the task of extended drains. A filter with synthetic media will hold up much better over longer oci's. Moisture does not break down the synthetic fibers like cellulose.

 

[RooflessVW]

Your oil and your filter are the issue. Use an A40 approved oil and an OES filter, and change them at 10k/1yr.

 

[cronk]

I just checked NAPA, they list Mahle, Hengst, Mann and Wix (Napa Gold)for this application. I believe any of these would hold up better than that Purolator. If they don't have in stock at your local store, it could be had next day most of the time. All are $15 or less.

 

[gtmaster303]

Originally Posted By: goodtimes
What does the manual say under severe service? Glad the tabs are there. All the filter makers say X miles or according to the manual. It's sort of a tricky interpretation. I think it has been argued many times.

I'm pretty sure any oil filter MFR is not that stupid. They wouldn't clearly state something like that if it left them open for liability. Maybe I'll call Purolator just to confirm, but from what I've learned from Fram in the past if it's listed for your car, it should work for the factory interval
I agree in my case here, this is pretty severe use - so I'll shorten intervals or drive the car more in a shorter time span (have to look up if they even specify severe intervals

 

[ZeeOSix]

Originally Posted By: spasm3
Originally Posted By: gtmaster303
Originally Posted By: ZeeOSix
Yep, looks like too much delta-p going on. The cold weather start-ups with thicker than specified oil doesn't help. Internal bypass valve might not be working correctly either.

Have to look up what that is...


Change in pressure.

I'm thinking a really cold morning, the 10w rated oil, and some sudden acceleration. Big spike in pressure, maybe more than the bypass could handle.

+1... And hard to say, but possible oil ran that long could have thickened up even more (viscosity shift) making the cold starts even worse.

 

[wemay]

I don't think you've done anything terribly wrong here. Run a different filter brand next time and see how it holds up. The previous advise to check/clean the bypass valve is also helpful. You may also wish to run a couple UOA to see if anything is getting through, or is it just a filter at the ragged end of it's lifecycle.

 

[Nyogtha]

Looking into this further, the Porsche oil spec for this vehicle and engine is C30, which Mobil 1 5W-30 ESP meets. However, the other spec for oil for this vehicle / engine is VW 504.00, which many commonly available Euro spec oils meet in the USA. All the VW 504 spec oils listed are 5W-30 but I know Pennzoil makes a 0W-30 Euro LX that should qualify for the current Pennzoil rebate that meets Porsche C30 specs.

https://www.6speedonline.com/forums/cayenne-958/337716-use-0w-40-cayenne-v6.html

http://www.pedrosgarage.com/Site_3/Porsche-Approved_Oils.html

https://bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php/topics/3585110/Oils_with_Porsche_A30_specific

https://www.audiusa.com/help/maintenance

http://www.pennzoil.com/en_us/products/full-synthetic-motor-oils/pennzoil-platinum-euro.html

FWIW I don't see any severe service maintenance intervals listed - O/FCI is 10K miles / 15K km or 1 year

https://leithporsche.com/service/porsche-service-maintenance-schedule.html

 

[WellOiled]

Porsche 2010 owners manual states for Cayenne (V6):
Porsche recommends Mobil 1
Meets approval: Porsche C30 or VW 504 00
Viscosity Class: SAE 5W30

Mobil Oil states:
Based on what you've told us, your vehicle manufacturer recommends a 5W-30 viscosity and oil that meets Porsche C30 or VW 504 00. The manufacturer has factory filled your vehicle with Mobil 1 oil and also endorses Mobil 1 as the service fill oil. Your engine oil capacity is approximately 7.3 quarts. We offer these motor oils to help protect your vehicle.

Then offers one choice: Mobil 1™ ESP Formula 5W-30

Nyogtha, you and I are on the same page here. No mention of severe service either.

Just 15000 km or 1 yr whichever comes first. Porsche implies a certified mechanic does the minor and major service items and completes a check list.

There was a remark about needing to reduce the OCI when using low quality gasoline. Recommendation contact the dealer.

 

[MetalSlug]

Originally Posted By: AntsinmyEyes
looks like a maintenance failure not a filter failure to me


This

 

[vwalburn]

Like others said, why you using that filter/oil in a Porsche? I would stick with what is recommended for that vehicle.

 

[gtmaster303]

Originally Posted By: wemay
I don't think you've done anything terribly wrong here. Run a different filter brand next time and see how it holds up. The previous advise to check/clean the bypass valve is also helpful. You may also wish to run a couple UOA to see if anything is getting through, or is it just a filter at the ragged end of it's lifecycle.

Exactly my thoughts as well. Hence why I posted here. I used a filter that's listed for my car and a good oil. I don't know how the filter could perform so poorly when it's built for my car. Sure the short trips and extended time didn't probably help, but I wouldn't call what I've. Done extreme. Maybe I'm off base in that sense. Covering 10,500 miles in 17 months shouldn't have a filter like the one I had

 

[tig1]

My 2007 Ford Fusion takes a cartridge filter. The only one that doesn't twist that I have used is the MC FL2017 cartridge. Fram and M1 failed the twist test.