Oil change - do you remove oil pan?

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This thread may be at the end of it's life, but I've only just seen.

About 3/4 years ago I dropped the pan on my 1937 engine, or after about 70 years, and I don't believe it had been done before.

The amount of congealed muck in the pan between the baffles was incredible! Only the area immediately around the drain plug was clear. It was about 1" thick and I had to dig it out with screwdrivers, chisels, paint scrapers etc. before washing with lots of paint thinner, gasoline, brake cleaner etc.

Assuming pan is about 18" long x 10" wide x 1" deep muck = 180 cubic inches, less 15% for baffles = 153 cu. in. = 85 fluid ounces = 2.65 quarts!

So although my engine oil was full on the oil level indicator, the amount of oil circulating was 2.65 quarts short!

Alas, cannot say that as a result the car ran smoother, faster or got better gas mileage, but I'm sure glad I went through the exercise.
 
Keep in mind the oil used 70+ years ago where nothing like the oils of today. If a layer of junk as you described forms from lousy oil, neglect, or anything else, nothing aside from what you did is going to fix it.

We had an oil pan down on my brothers F-150 with well over 150,000K severe service miles on it to replace a leaking pan gasket. The bottom end of that engine was spotless. It was properly maintained and used oil that was much better than anything a 1937 engine used back in the day. It was also a PITA job to do, and something I don't want to do again.
 
There are valid reasons to remove the oil pan....speaking oil related and not for some mechanical failure.

A big one would be to verify that the oil pump pickup screen is not clogged, as can be an issue on sludge prone engine.
Another would be in a engine known or suspected to have sludge buildup there.

I have the Toyota 1MZFE motor, but it is newer than the sludge prone years, had good maintenance before I bought it, and did not have sludge buildup under the valve covers.
So I have not removed the oil pan.
Some 1MZFE owners have needed to clean their pickup screen, if they realized it before they needed a replacement engine.
So if I was not comfortable about mine, I would be inspecting mine.

I see no issue with removing the oil pan for inspection.
One factor the OP mentioned......is the work involved.
Some vehicles are easier than others.
I have to consider the gain vs what I might mess up in the process.

I don't think that it is something that one needs to do very often as routine, but to check and give yourself confidence that all is OK.......
 
Originally Posted By: CaveatLector

I think some of you are taking this thread much too personally,


I think you are taking some of the answers much too personally. You asked a question, you got answers. Whether they lined up with what you think was going to be said.....well....
 
Originally Posted By: CaveatLector
I guess no one here has dropped an oil pan and found crud in the bottom of it or just dropped it to inspect or clean it during an oil change. People here analyze oil filter effectiveness and trace contaminants in oil, even pay for it and pour over minute differences in figures, yet dropping a pan to help clean out the sediment and residue is unheard of. Dropping a pan at some point just might tell you all something about your oil/engine and/or help clean it out at least. And judging by the hostility here at the mere thought of dropping a pan I would bet there's residue or sludge in your pans. Oh and here's some real world exprience for you all - I remember my oil staying cleaner longer after removing and cleaning the oil pan during an oil change.



Not my intent to be insulting; I really did think you were kidding. On a lot of the vehicles I've owned it is a major hassle to remove the oil pan; either it's blocked and you have to raise the engine, or it's a 2 sump design that goes over the axle and requires major surgery to remove.

Plus, to remove the oil pan and re-gasket every oil change is way too much work, not to mention the greater potential for leaks.

I don't disagree that dropping the pan each oil change may very well get more crud out; however with a reasonalbe OCI you're not going to have to worry about it sludging up. Our Wrangler recently needed a new head gasket, and at 156k the inside of the engine was spotless. I'd be surpised if there was any sludge in the pan.
 
I agree. Too much pain and not enough gain.

If there was a car with a very easy to get pan and a dirt-cheap gasket, it might be worth it.

But it is only worth it if you are going to take that pan off for some other reason, like if you lost a wedding ring down the fill hole.
 
Originally Posted By: Char Baby
The only time I have ever dropped the pan was to replace the pan due to damage!


LOL My Aerostar oil pan is rotted through in a few spots and I still haven't dropped it. I did everything you can imagine including making a lead plate with flashing and RTV sealant to try and stop it. I stopped it for a while and is now slowed down to a trickle, my hope is to get to summer/fall 2012 with it and buy a 2013 Wrangler. Some pans are a royal PITA to remove.
 
Originally Posted By: CaveatLector
I guess no one here has dropped an oil pan and found crud in the bottom of it or just dropped it to inspect or clean it during an oil change. People here analyze oil filter effectiveness and trace contaminants in oil, even pay for it and pour over minute differences in figures, yet dropping a pan to help clean out the sediment and residue is unheard of. Dropping a pan at some point just might tell you all something about your oil/engine and/or help clean it out at least. And judging by the hostility here at the mere thought of dropping a pan I would bet there's residue or sludge in your pans. Oh and here's some real world exprience for you all - I remember my oil staying cleaner longer after removing and cleaning the oil pan during an oil change.
Caveat,pardon some of the clowns on this site which by the way boast 99% experts on oil related matters.
gary
 
Its not in any OEM manuals as routine maintenance I know of.

I thought the oil filter was designed to keep the krapp out of the oil.

If you are really worried are you then you are talking about installing a bypass filter to get even more nasty particles, sediment etc out of the oil.

Plenty of engines done over 250,000 / 300,000 miles without removal of the oil pan.
 
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Originally Posted By: CaveatLector
Originally Posted By: Greggy_D
The entire subject is completely absurd. Billions of cars have been run trillions of miles without removing the oil pan during oil changes. Not a single bit of harm has fallen on engines because their pans were not removed during a routine oil change.


Absurd is how you came to the conclusion that that is what I meant. I never said such harm would occur without oil pan drops, did I? Would it remove a bit more oil and possibly other contaminants that settle to the bottom of the pan, the way some people take the time to flush out an oil cooler when they change the oil? Yes.

I think some of you are taking this thread much too personally, as if I accused you all of not dropping your oil pans. You don't do it? Fine. I really don't care. This whole thread has gotten tedious over a simple question that was immediately taken way out of context.

In fact, since my original question was so absurd, and that seems to be the general group consensus here, let's just delete this whole thread and I will refrain from posting such absurdities starting now.


Come on. There is no harm in sharing views. Just toughen up a bit.

I have copped a battering on some of my posts, thats OK. I know and have come to develop confidence in what I believe and do and not follow hype or a crowd, rather follow science, reasoning in truth.

If dropping the pan works for you, keeps the oil cleaner and helps you sleep better, makes you a better person etc go for it.

BTW it stirred up 6 pages of posting. Over the years I have seen other things posted that copped a hiding that I thought were fair to post.
 
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I have never done a pan drop for an OC but I could see if you had a real bad sludger or particles in the oil how it could be beneficial to do.
 
Originally Posted By: Char Baby
The only time I have ever dropped the pan was to replace the pan due to damage!


+1

The answer to this question is NO!

btw, oil pans arent easily removed!!

btw2, oil pans are about the ONLY thing that can be permanently fixed with J-B Weld, IMHO.
smile.gif
Ive done this WITHOUT removing the pan, but that was when i treated my car like a video game. (Somehow it got smashed and it lost its oil. I noticed it before it got TOO bad, it had a slow leak.)

Ive also never had to remove it to unclog an oil pick-up screen...
 
As stated, a pan from a car made in 1936-37 really isn't the best indicator of what's in a modern sump using modern detergent motor oils...

The one occasion I did replace a pan about 17 years ago on a 1987 Honda Accord (due to corrosion) showed almost nothing in the pan...
 
One time i had a car that would have eventually needed a new pan and not J-B Weld it was the one car i saw a drip coming from the actual pan not the bolt.. seems to have rusted through, and was juuust beginning to seep drops of oil.
shocked.gif
It never made it to the point of changing it.

Its also the first time i saw a "rusted through" oil pan that allowed seepage, but still let the car run fine. Wow!
 
Nice question!
cool.gif

Ask a SAAB 95er about it: it's a part of the preventive maintenance plan at intervals. Hard sludge prone 4-cyl turbo engines (early, non-AERO): oil pickup tube strainer easily blocked and kills the engine due to oil starvation.
sick.gif
 
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Originally Posted By: Gene K
Originally Posted By: JOD
no need for an oil pan drop--just use the water flush instead. Works every time.


Thats a great idea! Think I will try that on my new pickup.... NOT!

Is this guy serious? Water flushing into running engine? But he took care: it was just idling...
thumbsup2.gif
 
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