Oil change - do you remove oil pan?
- Thread starter CaveatLector
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Originally Posted By: Quattro Pete
Originally Posted By: CaveatLector
Do you ever remove your oil pan during an oil change, just to clean out every last possible drop of old oil?
Heck no. I don't even remove the oil drain plug.
The last time I removed the drain plug to change oil was more than 10 years ago.
Originally Posted By: CaveatLector
Do you ever remove your oil pan during an oil change, just to clean out every last possible drop of old oil?
Heck no. I don't even remove the oil drain plug.
The last time I removed the drain plug to change oil was more than 10 years ago.
Here's a much simpler idea.
Buy 2x the oil you need.
Drain the old stuff and discard it.
Change filter.
Fill the engine with new stuff.
Run it for a few minutes to mix everything up.
Drain slightly dirty new stuff, but do NOT discard.
Drain filter.
Refill with new stuff.
You can use this 'flushing oil' several times before it starts to become significantly contaminated with old oil.
Buy 2x the oil you need.
Drain the old stuff and discard it.
Change filter.
Fill the engine with new stuff.
Run it for a few minutes to mix everything up.
Drain slightly dirty new stuff, but do NOT discard.
Drain filter.
Refill with new stuff.
You can use this 'flushing oil' several times before it starts to become significantly contaminated with old oil.
Originally Posted By: Kuato
You're obviously joking.
I used fluid extractor to siphon oil via dipstick tube, no need to remove drain plug ! No worry about over/under tighten the plug or cross threaded either.
You're obviously joking.
I used fluid extractor to siphon oil via dipstick tube, no need to remove drain plug ! No worry about over/under tighten the plug or cross threaded either.
I guess no one here has dropped an oil pan and found crud in the bottom of it or just dropped it to inspect or clean it during an oil change. People here analyze oil filter effectiveness and trace contaminants in oil, even pay for it and pour over minute differences in figures, yet dropping a pan to help clean out the sediment and residue is unheard of. Dropping a pan at some point just might tell you all something about your oil/engine and/or help clean it out at least. And judging by the hostility here at the mere thought of dropping a pan I would bet there's residue or sludge in your pans. Oh and here's some real world exprience for you all - I remember my oil staying cleaner longer after removing and cleaning the oil pan during an oil change.
Some cars like mine -- you need to drop axle in order to drop pan.Not worth it. Want to clean out pan-- fill your car with Carb cleaner or kerosene for several day, may use ultrasound too in addition
If your pan is easy to remove--go for it, cleaning ones a while will be beneficial. Using quality oil with right OCI, should not leave much residue on the bottom.
If your pan is easy to remove--go for it, cleaning ones a while will be beneficial. Using quality oil with right OCI, should not leave much residue on the bottom.
Originally Posted By: BGK
This question can't be serious. Yes, and I pull out the pistons and wipe them down too!
I take them out at each OCI and give them a run in the dishwasher. I hear Finish is great at preventing sticking rings.
In all seriousness, the only times I ever bothered with pulling the oil pan was when there was a legitimate reason to do so. Is it damaged or dented? Is the oil pickup screen clogged? Is the pan coated in sludge? Did the oil pump give up the ghost? If it isn't one of these things, why bother?
Yes, many of us are OCD enough that we'd love to get every last bit of old oil out of the engine. We also know that it's a fool's errand unless one wants to do an entire teardown. Heck, the oil cooler on the Maxda RX-8 holds what, two litres, that aren't drained at each OCI?
This question can't be serious. Yes, and I pull out the pistons and wipe them down too!
I take them out at each OCI and give them a run in the dishwasher. I hear Finish is great at preventing sticking rings.
In all seriousness, the only times I ever bothered with pulling the oil pan was when there was a legitimate reason to do so. Is it damaged or dented? Is the oil pickup screen clogged? Is the pan coated in sludge? Did the oil pump give up the ghost? If it isn't one of these things, why bother?
Yes, many of us are OCD enough that we'd love to get every last bit of old oil out of the engine. We also know that it's a fool's errand unless one wants to do an entire teardown. Heck, the oil cooler on the Maxda RX-8 holds what, two litres, that aren't drained at each OCI?
Originally Posted By: BGK
This question can't be serious. Yes, and I pull out the pistons and wipe them down too!
LOL this.
No problem turning a 10 minute task into an hour and change... berely even notice the extra work and time!
This question can't be serious. Yes, and I pull out the pistons and wipe them down too!
LOL this.
No problem turning a 10 minute task into an hour and change... berely even notice the extra work and time!
Originally Posted By: CaveatLector
I guess no one here has dropped an oil pan and found crud in the bottom of it or just dropped it to inspect or clean it during an oil change. People here analyze oil filter effectiveness and trace contaminants in oil, even pay for it and pour over minute differences in figures, yet dropping a pan to help clean out the sediment and residue is unheard of. Dropping a pan at some point just might tell you all something about your oil/engine and/or help clean it out at least. And judging by the hostility here at the mere thought of dropping a pan I would bet there's residue or sludge in your pans. Oh and here's some real world exprience for you all - I remember my oil staying cleaner longer after removing and cleaning the oil pan during an oil change.
Dropping the pan can (easily) involve removing the exhaust front pipe, removing axles, removing A/C compressor, subframe components, breaking the seal (requiring replacement) on a car made in the past 20yrs. You know, if you can find someone willing to do all that just to extract the 2 oz of oil left in the pan (not even the rest of the engine), then they deserve a pat on the back, a beer even. Perhaps a psychiatric test.
I guess no one here has dropped an oil pan and found crud in the bottom of it or just dropped it to inspect or clean it during an oil change. People here analyze oil filter effectiveness and trace contaminants in oil, even pay for it and pour over minute differences in figures, yet dropping a pan to help clean out the sediment and residue is unheard of. Dropping a pan at some point just might tell you all something about your oil/engine and/or help clean it out at least. And judging by the hostility here at the mere thought of dropping a pan I would bet there's residue or sludge in your pans. Oh and here's some real world exprience for you all - I remember my oil staying cleaner longer after removing and cleaning the oil pan during an oil change.
Dropping the pan can (easily) involve removing the exhaust front pipe, removing axles, removing A/C compressor, subframe components, breaking the seal (requiring replacement) on a car made in the past 20yrs. You know, if you can find someone willing to do all that just to extract the 2 oz of oil left in the pan (not even the rest of the engine), then they deserve a pat on the back, a beer even. Perhaps a psychiatric test.
I used to drop the oil pan occasionally in my Corvette way back in the '90's when I was doing 20 track days a year with it. Never found any sludge in the pan, and during those years, I was running Castrol GTX. On the hot days, I was seeing oil temps over 280F. With modern oils, I don't see any value in the exercise.
Originally Posted By: CaveatLector
I guess no one here has dropped an oil pan and found crud in the bottom of it or just dropped it to inspect or clean it during an oil change. People here analyze oil filter effectiveness and trace contaminants in oil, even pay for it and pour over minute differences in figures, yet dropping a pan to help clean out the sediment and residue is unheard of. Dropping a pan at some point just might tell you all something about your oil/engine and/or help clean it out at least. And judging by the hostility here at the mere thought of dropping a pan I would bet there's residue or sludge in your pans. Oh and here's some real world exprience for you all - I remember my oil staying cleaner longer after removing and cleaning the oil pan during an oil change.
I don't see any real hostility. In my case there are easier things to drop or pull on the cars that I own/owned to check for sludge than dropping the oil pan. YMMV. I also feel if you are the original owner of a vehicle, use sensible OCI's and do an occasional cleaning as preventative maint with a product like Kreen or MMO you don't have to drop anything unless you have a leak or engine problem. JMO
I guess no one here has dropped an oil pan and found crud in the bottom of it or just dropped it to inspect or clean it during an oil change. People here analyze oil filter effectiveness and trace contaminants in oil, even pay for it and pour over minute differences in figures, yet dropping a pan to help clean out the sediment and residue is unheard of. Dropping a pan at some point just might tell you all something about your oil/engine and/or help clean it out at least. And judging by the hostility here at the mere thought of dropping a pan I would bet there's residue or sludge in your pans. Oh and here's some real world exprience for you all - I remember my oil staying cleaner longer after removing and cleaning the oil pan during an oil change.
I don't see any real hostility. In my case there are easier things to drop or pull on the cars that I own/owned to check for sludge than dropping the oil pan. YMMV. I also feel if you are the original owner of a vehicle, use sensible OCI's and do an occasional cleaning as preventative maint with a product like Kreen or MMO you don't have to drop anything unless you have a leak or engine problem. JMO
Originally Posted By: CaveatLector
I guess no one here has dropped an oil pan and found crud in the bottom of it or just dropped it to inspect or clean it during an oil change. People here analyze oil filter effectiveness and trace contaminants in oil, even pay for it and pour over minute differences in figures, yet dropping a pan to help clean out the sediment and residue is unheard of. Dropping a pan at some point just might tell you all something about your oil/engine and/or help clean it out at least. And judging by the hostility here at the mere thought of dropping a pan I would bet there's residue or sludge in your pans. Oh and here's some real world exprience for you all - I remember my oil staying cleaner longer after removing and cleaning the oil pan during an oil change.
You won't win this one here. Unless you did a particle count analysis before and after, this board really doesn't go on 'the oil didn't turn dark until later' for real world experience. Yes, I'm sure you used the same oil, same milage, same driving but there's the argument that the oil would have gradually cleaned it out anyway. Additionally, if you found crud on the bottom you will need to explain what oil and OCIs you were using and if it soft crud, hard varnish, soft sludge or hard sludge.
Not trying to be **** to you but this is what your up against. You're chasing the ghost BITOG trying to find the most complete oil change.
My personal opinion is this is complete overkill and would be easier to install double bypass filters with the strongest magnets on it and use your pick of boutique oils at 5k miles with the time involved on most cars built in the last 20 years.
I guess no one here has dropped an oil pan and found crud in the bottom of it or just dropped it to inspect or clean it during an oil change. People here analyze oil filter effectiveness and trace contaminants in oil, even pay for it and pour over minute differences in figures, yet dropping a pan to help clean out the sediment and residue is unheard of. Dropping a pan at some point just might tell you all something about your oil/engine and/or help clean it out at least. And judging by the hostility here at the mere thought of dropping a pan I would bet there's residue or sludge in your pans. Oh and here's some real world exprience for you all - I remember my oil staying cleaner longer after removing and cleaning the oil pan during an oil change.
You won't win this one here. Unless you did a particle count analysis before and after, this board really doesn't go on 'the oil didn't turn dark until later' for real world experience. Yes, I'm sure you used the same oil, same milage, same driving but there's the argument that the oil would have gradually cleaned it out anyway. Additionally, if you found crud on the bottom you will need to explain what oil and OCIs you were using and if it soft crud, hard varnish, soft sludge or hard sludge.
Not trying to be **** to you but this is what your up against. You're chasing the ghost BITOG trying to find the most complete oil change.
My personal opinion is this is complete overkill and would be easier to install double bypass filters with the strongest magnets on it and use your pick of boutique oils at 5k miles with the time involved on most cars built in the last 20 years.
I have never removed the oil pan just for the heck of it in 51 years of driving and have never had an oil related failure yet.
And I used Pennzoil in the 60s and 70s. Yeah, I know, thats when every one swears it sludged up engines.
And I used Pennzoil in the 60s and 70s. Yeah, I know, thats when every one swears it sludged up engines.
Originally Posted By: NYSteve
You won't win this one here. Unless you did a particle count analysis before and after, this board really doesn't go on 'the oil didn't turn dark until later' for real world experience...
"Win this one?" What a group-think [censored] contest this has turned out to be. Sorry that I had the gall to relate to my experience that was not backed up by a lab report.
So NOT doing a physical cleaning/inspecting of the inside of an oil pan, cleaning the oil screen, and even the magnet for those who don't even remove the oil drain bolt... is something to be proud of here? I find that bizarre, and I sure haven't "lost" anything to anyone here.
How much are those "particle analysis" reports anyway? Maybe if I spent enough money on reports and enough time on these forums my entire oil pan and it's contents will clean itself.
You won't win this one here. Unless you did a particle count analysis before and after, this board really doesn't go on 'the oil didn't turn dark until later' for real world experience...
"Win this one?" What a group-think [censored] contest this has turned out to be. Sorry that I had the gall to relate to my experience that was not backed up by a lab report.
So NOT doing a physical cleaning/inspecting of the inside of an oil pan, cleaning the oil screen, and even the magnet for those who don't even remove the oil drain bolt... is something to be proud of here? I find that bizarre, and I sure haven't "lost" anything to anyone here.
How much are those "particle analysis" reports anyway? Maybe if I spent enough money on reports and enough time on these forums my entire oil pan and it's contents will clean itself.
Originally Posted By: Greggy_D
The entire subject is completely absurd. Billions of cars have been run trillions of miles without removing the oil pan during oil changes. Not a single bit of harm has fallen on engines because their pans were not removed during a routine oil change.
Absurd is how you came to the conclusion that that is what I meant. I never said such harm would occur without oil pan drops, did I? Would it remove a bit more oil and possibly other contaminants that settle to the bottom of the pan, the way some people take the time to flush out an oil cooler when they change the oil? Yes.
I think some of you are taking this thread much too personally, as if I accused you all of not dropping your oil pans. You don't do it? Fine. I really don't care. This whole thread has gotten tedious over a simple question that was immediately taken way out of context.
In fact, since my original question was so absurd, and that seems to be the general group consensus here, let's just delete this whole thread and I will refrain from posting such absurdities starting now.
The entire subject is completely absurd. Billions of cars have been run trillions of miles without removing the oil pan during oil changes. Not a single bit of harm has fallen on engines because their pans were not removed during a routine oil change.
Absurd is how you came to the conclusion that that is what I meant. I never said such harm would occur without oil pan drops, did I? Would it remove a bit more oil and possibly other contaminants that settle to the bottom of the pan, the way some people take the time to flush out an oil cooler when they change the oil? Yes.
I think some of you are taking this thread much too personally, as if I accused you all of not dropping your oil pans. You don't do it? Fine. I really don't care. This whole thread has gotten tedious over a simple question that was immediately taken way out of context.
In fact, since my original question was so absurd, and that seems to be the general group consensus here, let's just delete this whole thread and I will refrain from posting such absurdities starting now.
I can see dropping it if you thought that unwanted objects were in the sump, like the cap of an oil bottle, for instance, or those aluminum seals on bottles of MMO. But only then.
Originally Posted By: CaveatLector
Originally Posted By: NYSteve
You won't win this one here. Unless you did a particle count analysis before and after, this board really doesn't go on 'the oil didn't turn dark until later' for real world experience...
"Win this one?" What a group-think [censored] contest this has turned out to be. Sorry that I had the gall to relate to my experience that was not backed up by a lab report.
So NOT doing a physical cleaning/inspecting of the inside of an oil pan, cleaning the oil screen, and even the magnet for those who don't even remove the oil drain bolt... is something to be proud of here? I find that bizarre, and I sure haven't "lost" anything to anyone here.
How much are those "particle analysis" reports anyway? Maybe if I spent enough money on reports and enough time on these forums my entire oil pan and it's contents will clean itself.
LOL, just letting you know what I've seen happen on this board. Someone will say 'i found this great oil/technique/additive/whatever that cleaned/increased milage/made my car faster/whatever. First thing asked is prove it, then when it they don't have the the UOAs/particle analysis/strip slips it's discredited.
I think what threw people off was you only talked about getting the last bit of oil out every oil change by dropping the pan and nothing about cleaning oil pickup etc. I apologize if I missed it or anything else. I hope you stick around the board, there quite a bit to be learned.
Originally Posted By: NYSteve
You won't win this one here. Unless you did a particle count analysis before and after, this board really doesn't go on 'the oil didn't turn dark until later' for real world experience...
"Win this one?" What a group-think [censored] contest this has turned out to be. Sorry that I had the gall to relate to my experience that was not backed up by a lab report.
So NOT doing a physical cleaning/inspecting of the inside of an oil pan, cleaning the oil screen, and even the magnet for those who don't even remove the oil drain bolt... is something to be proud of here? I find that bizarre, and I sure haven't "lost" anything to anyone here.
How much are those "particle analysis" reports anyway? Maybe if I spent enough money on reports and enough time on these forums my entire oil pan and it's contents will clean itself.
LOL, just letting you know what I've seen happen on this board. Someone will say 'i found this great oil/technique/additive/whatever that cleaned/increased milage/made my car faster/whatever. First thing asked is prove it, then when it they don't have the the UOAs/particle analysis/strip slips it's discredited.
I think what threw people off was you only talked about getting the last bit of oil out every oil change by dropping the pan and nothing about cleaning oil pickup etc. I apologize if I missed it or anything else. I hope you stick around the board, there quite a bit to be learned.
Originally Posted By: NYSteve
LOL, just letting you know what I've seen happen on this board. Someone will say 'i found this great oil/technique/additive/whatever that cleaned/increased milage/made my car faster/whatever. First thing asked is prove it,
If somebody claims that a particular oil made their car go faster, would you expect a mildly intelligent person to just accept it at face value and not ask for details?
Let's face it, some people on BITOG make some ridiculous butt-dyno claims. Some of them aren't even worth responding to. All you can do is laugh. By the way, I am not saying that this particular thread is an example of this.
LOL, just letting you know what I've seen happen on this board. Someone will say 'i found this great oil/technique/additive/whatever that cleaned/increased milage/made my car faster/whatever. First thing asked is prove it,
If somebody claims that a particular oil made their car go faster, would you expect a mildly intelligent person to just accept it at face value and not ask for details?
Let's face it, some people on BITOG make some ridiculous butt-dyno claims. Some of them aren't even worth responding to. All you can do is laugh. By the way, I am not saying that this particular thread is an example of this.
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