What are the best options for 0W-20 synthetic?

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Preference orderfor a light 0W-20:
Toyota 1st
Idemitsu (that's Honda/Acura Canada, Mazda and Subaru) 2nd
Honda 3rd
M1 AFE 4th
Valvoline 5th
Need I go further!

In the 5W-20 all dino's are good especially PYB or any 5W-20 syn you can get for a dino price. If you're going to upgrade to a synthetic oil then go for a 0W-20 (see above).
 
Originally Posted By: CATERHAM
Originally Posted By: JAG
Different engine than buster's but oil temp reaches 106 C in around 15 minutes of highway driving in winter and summer in my BMW 135i. The 80-95 C oil temp range does not apply to a fair number of engines in use today. I would like for buster to try the oil and report back any findings/data.

A high output twin turbo is not likely the best example compared to the OPs hybrid that's "90% city and short commutes".
The reason I can run a 0W-20 in my Bimmer is because it's mostly short trips and the oil temp's rarely hit even 80C in the winter.
Last sunday I spent all day running short trips doing Christmas shopping; maximum oil temp was 80C but most of the time they hovered in the 60-70C range.

I goofed and thought this was buster's 0W-20 thread. My bad. Man, your BMW's oil temps are low!
 
Just wanted to thank everyone for their input since I am pretty much an oil moron. I have always changed my own oil but I think this car has a different filter than a screw on canister. If I can figure out how to do it myself it sounds like the Toyota 0w-20 is a good way to go. Most of you seem to like it best for my application and very few seem to think it would not be at least a "good" choice if not their first choice.

Thanks again.....I learned a lot reading your replies.
 
I cast my vote for "none of the above" mentioned 0W20s.

In the category for the most fuel efficient 0W20 at operating temperature, the nod goes to Chevron's Havoline 0W20. My reasons are, it has the lowest cst@100C of 8.0. This is lower than the Toyota 0W20, Honda 0W20 and Mobil 1 0W20. The cst@40C is also a low 41. VI is 172.

On the negative side, you will have to order it from your local Chevron distributor, since it is not sold on retail shelves. I have a case of 12 qts that was given to me (by Chevron), for writing a complaint letter that I could not find it. I will be using it in my 2011 Ford Taurus and 4 cylinder Ford Escape, this spring - just before gas prices spike for the summer. For the record, I am currently using the Honda 0W20 oil in the Escape (and noticed a 2 mpg increase over the previously used Motorcraft 5W20). Nothing scientific, but it is what I noticed.

Now I will go to my bunker and brace myself for the onslaught of attacks.
 
Originally Posted By: Best F100

In the category for the most fuel efficient 0W20 at operating temperature, the nod goes to Chevron's Havoline 0W20. My reasons are, it has the lowest cst@100C of 8.0. This is lower than the Toyota 0W20, Honda 0W20 and Mobil 1 0W20. The cst@40C is also a low 41. VI is 172.
Now I will go to my bunker and brace myself for the onslaught of attacks.

No attack but you are incorrect.
You can't rely on the kinematic viscosity spec's in comparing the actual operational viscosities of different oils. If two oils has the same HTHSV and the same VI they will have identical operational viscosities at all temp's at least as low as 0C.
The subject was explained at length in the following thread:
http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2276634&page=1

Assuming Havoline 0W-20 has the minimum HTHSV of 2.6cP for the grade it will be no lighter than any other 20wt with the same VI or lower. Since the Japanese OEM 0W-20's all have higher VIs than Havoline they will all be lighter at all temp's assuming they as well have the minimum HTHSV of 2.6cP.
Since the Toyota 0W-20 has a much higher VI of 216 it will be slightly lighter at normal operating temperature, about 20% lighter at room temperature and a full 30% lighter at 32F.
 
Originally Posted By: Best F100
I cast my vote for "none of the above" mentioned 0W20s.

In the category for the most fuel efficient 0W20 at operating temperature, the nod goes to Chevron's Havoline 0W20. My reasons are, it has the lowest cst@100C of 8.0. This is lower than the Toyota 0W20, Honda 0W20 and Mobil 1 0W20. The cst@40C is also a low 41. VI is 172.

On the negative side, you will have to order it from your local Chevron distributor, since it is not sold on retail shelves. I have a case of 12 qts that was given to me (by Chevron), for writing a complaint letter that I could not find it. I will be using it in my 2011 Ford Taurus and 4 cylinder Ford Escape, this spring - just before gas prices spike for the summer. For the record, I am currently using the Honda 0W20 oil in the Escape (and noticed a 2 mpg increase over the previously used Motorcraft 5W20). Nothing scientific, but it is what I noticed.

Now I will go to my bunker and brace myself for the onslaught of attacks.


Service Pro 0w-20 is thinner than the Chevron if 8.0 is correct. The sample I sent in tested at 7.8cSt at 100C and 39.9cSt at 40C. It has no moly, titanium or boron, but is still a good oil.

I very much want to try a case of Kendall GT-1 0w-20. Loads of moly, boron and titanium.
 
Originally Posted By: chevrofreak
Originally Posted By: Best F100


Service Pro 0w-20 is thinner than the Chevron if 8.0 is correct. The sample I sent in tested at 7.8cSt at 100C and 39.9cSt at 40C. It has no moly, titanium or boron, but is still a good oil.

Even if the KV 100 spec' of 8.0cSt is correct, Service Pro's KV100 spec' of 7.8cSt doesn't make it lighter since it's VI is lower although just marginally at 170.
But I guess you just don't get it; HTHSV trumps the KV100 spec'.
 
If I were in the OP's situation, I would go for the Toytota 0W-20.
If you get the FREE oil changes, I would verify with them that they are truely using the Toyota 0W-20 oil.
It is worth your while to pay more to use this than to use something else offered for less or for "free".
 
Originally Posted By: Bruce T
That's true, fuel dilution doesn't appear to be a common issue in Prius hybrids (unlike my Civic Hybrid). However, it's worth keeping an eye out for this issue in any hybrid vehicle due to the low operating temps of the engines and programmed fuel dilution: fuel bursts to warm up the cat for emissions, as well as bursts to burn off the NOx generated in lean burn mode. Fortunately, Prius engine temps are benefitted significantly by the use of a thermos to keep the coolant warm for 2-3 days between trips. I'm assuming the Lexus hybrid has this feature, too.

The two UOAs I saw posted for the third-gen Prius (same power train as CT200h) did have some fuel dilution.

http://priuschat.com/forums/gen-iii-2010...tml#post1437004

Also, my understanding is that the thermos is gone from the Gen III.

Originally Posted By: RF Overlord
Originally Posted By: Boss302fan
If dealer changes it, then make sure they use a 0W20 Toyota/Mobil and not any 5W20 or 30 weight oil... Be specific and have them list the oil brand and weight on the invoice.
The local dealer where I buy stuff for my sister's RAV4 sells Toyota-branded 0W-20 for $7 and change...that's certainly competitive with auto parts store prices for the other synthetics. It's also the only 20-weight oil they stock. I don't see why anyone would use anything else in a Toyota unless they could get it significantly cheaper. When sis's warranty runs out, I'm switching her RAV to this oil and 10,000 miles/1 year OCIs.


I paid $4.99/qt for it from my dealer. Dealer cost is in the low 4 dollar range per quart so you should be able to do better.
 
Originally Posted By: The Critic
Originally Posted By: Bruce T
That's true, fuel dilution doesn't appear to be a common issue in Prius hybrids (unlike my Civic Hybrid). However, it's worth keeping an eye out for this issue in any hybrid vehicle due to the low operating temps of the engines and programmed fuel dilution: fuel bursts to warm up the cat for emissions, as well as bursts to burn off the NOx generated in lean burn mode. Fortunately, Prius engine temps are benefitted significantly by the use of a thermos to keep the coolant warm for 2-3 days between trips. I'm assuming the Lexus hybrid has this feature, too.

The two UOAs I saw posted for the third-gen Prius (same power train as CT200h) did have some fuel dilution.

http://priuschat.com/forums/gen-iii-2010...tml#post1437004

Also, my understanding is that the thermos is gone from the Gen III.

Originally Posted By: RF Overlord
Originally Posted By: Boss302fan
If dealer changes it, then make sure they use a 0W20 Toyota/Mobil and not any 5W20 or 30 weight oil... Be specific and have them list the oil brand and weight on the invoice.
The local dealer where I buy stuff for my sister's RAV4 sells Toyota-branded 0W-20 for $7 and change...that's certainly competitive with auto parts store prices for the other synthetics. It's also the only 20-weight oil they stock. I don't see why anyone would use anything else in a Toyota unless they could get it significantly cheaper. When sis's warranty runs out, I'm switching her RAV to this oil and 10,000 miles/1 year OCIs.


I paid $4.99/qt for it from my dealer. Dealer cost is in the low 4 dollar range per quart so you should be able to do better.


Dealer cost is more like the low 3 dollar range.
 
Originally Posted By: chevrofreak

Dealer cost is more like the low 3 dollar range.


It was in the mid 3 range for bulk 0W20 a long time ago, but even then, I remember the bottled 0W20 price for substantially higher. Has this changed?
 
Critic, I hadn't heard about the coolant thermos being removed from the Gen III Prius. Thanks for the info. That's a bummer, but it makes sense. I noticed the Toyota website said the Gen III uses exhaust heat to warm the coolant, and I thought that sounded redundant with a thermos, too.
 
Originally Posted By: Bruce T
Critic, I hadn't heard about the coolant thermos being removed from the Gen III Prius. Thanks for the info. That's a bummer, but it makes sense. I noticed the Toyota website said the Gen III uses exhaust heat to warm the coolant, and I thought that sounded redundant with a thermos, too.


It's a less complex system and makes the cooling system far easier to service, not that it needs to be done more than once during the term of the ownership anyway. But I definitely miss the near-instant heat that you used to get from the Gen II.
 
Yes, it was probably a cost-cutting measure, but it's hard to blame Toyota wanting to avoid price increases in this economy. I'd be willing to pay extra for the thermos feature, but I'm not everyone.
 
I'm an "old school" guy when it comes to using what weight motor oils in an engine. I just traded in a 2007 Toyota RAV 4 with the V-6 motor. Used Mobil 1 and Pennzoil Platinum 5w-30 religiously in it as that's what Toyota called. Bought a new 2012 Toyota Venza today with the exact same 3.5 liter V-6 motor. Owner's Manual calls for 0-20w oil. This is new to me as I got a good supply of 5w-30 synthetic on hand but no 0-20w. I know nothing about this weight oil so any suggestions/info. any of you can provide will be appreciated. Is this the best weight oil to use and can/should I continue using synthetic oils? Is there a particular brand 0-20w that does best in a Toyota engine, specifically for this 2GR-FE, V-6? Sorry to
ask so many questions but I'm just not versed on this 0-20W oil situation. Thanks.
 
Weird how my 2008 Camry manual states, 5W-30 for the 3.5L 2GR-FE. Yet, my 2.4L 2AZ-FE Toyota recommendations are 0W-20/5W-20
 
What does the Toyota owners manual say for the given operating conditions and climate ?

What is the ambient temperature ?

Can the OP use a 5w30 with OEMs blessing for short trips under the climatic conditions in question.

I need to get the BITOG crystal ball in order to predict the oil recommendations in the absence of a full scenario setting.
 
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