Part of the problem with vehicle prices is that the trim packages cost more than the actual vehicle itself.
Example: 2024 F-150, XL, is $33k on the Ford website. Limited version of the same truck is $83k. You can literally buy two base-model trucks for less than the cost of one loaded truck - how is it that the add-ons for the Limited version are literally more than an entire separate truck?
And this tracks across all of the manufacturers and their trim packages. Toss in the fact that almost invariably you have to add an entire trim level to get one option (LED headlights - looking at you, Ford), and that base model minimum cost goes away real quick.
Part of the problem with vehicle prices is that the trim packages cost more than the actual vehicle itself.
Example: 2024 F-150, XL, is $33k on the Ford website. Limited version of the same truck is $83k. You can literally buy two base-model trucks for less than the cost of one loaded truck - how is it that the add-ons for the Limited version are literally more than an entire separate truck?
And this tracks across all of the manufacturers and their trim packages. Toss in the fact that almost invariably you have to add an entire trim level to get one option (LED headlights - looking at you, Ford), and that base model minimum cost goes away real quick.
Nice that you finally don't need a $10k (sorry - $15k now) trim package from XLT to Lariat to get modern headlights for the F-150s. Super Duty trucks still have to go to the Lariat trim to get them, not even an option on XLT.LED Headlights are now standard (2024)
Available LED fog lamps cut through the mist in murky conditions. Available LED Dynamic Bending Headlamps adjust for clarity around curves creating a wide beam to help you see what's off to the side. LED headlamps are standard on all F-150® models.
BTW-Ford (as I stated in another thread) has consolidated their option packages (and has raised prices to include these) to try to help their abysmal build quality.
And they blather on about cars not selling we dont need more 60-100k cars.. esp. ev's.This, so much! So stupid.
If I sum up the total of the last 5 vehicles I’ve owned, it’s STILL less than a single, well-appointed Expedition. No wonder new car sales are tanking. Part of it is due to inflation, but a big part of it is due to the costs incurred for the labor to build them…Doom and gloom. Cars have become obscenely expensive for what they are, repairs too… and dare you look at one funny in an accident, it’s likely to get totaled. Longer lasting used cars, coupled with these issues drive people to used. Keeping them longer. How does the average age of vehicles on the road, and the average inflation adjusted new car price correlate?
Maybe. But it’s likely a smaller bit than you think. Look at the example of a base vs limited F-150… $50k for stupid options over the actual vehicle?!? That’s not labor. As much as many would like to hate and blame the UAW, I suspect there’s more to the cost than that.If I sum up the total of the last 5 vehicles I’ve owned, it’s STILL less than a single, well-appointed Expedition. No wonder new car sales are tanking. Part of it is due to inflation, but a big part of it is due to the costs incurred for the labor to build them…
How does the average age of vehicles on the road, and the average inflation adjusted new car price correlate?
I’m not blaming labor itself directly; I think everyone’s aware of the tactics that were used, and I feel they were despicable. I don’t mind paying for a good product, but when it’s overpriced and full of issues, i feel that’s a big problem.Maybe. But it’s likely a smaller bit than you think. Look at the example of a base vs limited F-150… $50k for stupid options over the actual vehicle?!? That’s not labor. As much as many would like to hate and blame the UAW, I suspect there’s more to the cost than that.
I guess I need to run to the nearest BMW dealership and buy a 7 series tomorrow2005 Ford F150 XL Reg Cab 4WD MSRP: $25,750
2024 Ford F150 XL Reg Cab 4WD MSRP: $41,585
Inflation adjusted price: $40,664.30
2005 BMW 7-Series 760Li 4D Sedan MSRP: $117,300
2024 BMW 7-Series 760i xDrive 4D Sedan MSRP: $121,300
Inflation adjusted price: $185,239.70
2005 Audi A8 L 4D Sedan Qtro MSRP: $69,900
2024 Audi A8 L 55 4D Sedan Qtro MSRP: $90,900
Inflation adjusted price: $110,385.81
2005 Cadillac Escalade ESV 4D SUV AWD MSRP: $58,805
2024 Cadillac Escalade ESV Luxury 4D SUV 4WD MSRP: $87,895
Inflation adjusted price: $92,864.63
Despite the addition of more advanced technologies over the past 20 years it looks like inflation adjusted prices have remained below average in this small sample study.
I think the issue is earnings have not caught up with inflation.
That's how cars have always been... tack on a few stupid options and get 150% of base price.Maybe. But it’s likely a smaller bit than you think. Look at the example of a base vs limited F-150… $50k for stupid options over the actual vehicle?!? That’s not labor. As much as many would like to hate and blame the UAW, I suspect there’s more to the cost than that.
The biggest difference I see now - and I know it's been a gradual buildup over the past 10-15 years - is that you can't spec single options any more. If I buy an F-150, but want leather seats, I have to step up $15k to the Lariat version over the XLT; there's no single "leather seat" option any more. Forcing people into entire trim levels for a single thing (LED headlights on Super Duty trucks is a good one) is definitely beneficial for the manufacturer on margins, but not for the buyer.That's how cars have always been... tack on a few stupid options and get 150% of base price.
There's an assumption that they're making money at base... maybe, maybe not. And there's "Hollywood Accounting" with regard to "invoice" price, holdbacks, etc.
But a loaded *whatever* has been and always will be hugely profitable.
It costs more to make a manual window regulator, but it's worth if if they can (claim to) make a vaporware base model that you can't find, and can't order, if the base price meets their marketing target.
These days its actually cheaper to keep that tech, then to go back to manual everything albeit with a few caveats.I uses to drive <$3000 beaters. Now you have to spend $10000 to get a beater.
Get rid of the tech, what a total bunch of BS in a vehicle. Give me the basics. And I don't even care about LED headlights, I can get those aftermarket for $1500 if I really want them.
Manual transmission, manual windows too please.
But hey, I'm a dinosaur and I'm only 40.
They can't afford them. I work on a college campus, and have quite a few student workers. A few commute, and most live on campus. The ones who commute are on long-term car loans for either new vehicles their parents helped them purchase, or used vehicles, some of them quite old and breaking down. Those who are into cars are overwhelmed by the amount of debt they are currently in, their rent if they live off campus, etc. A car is a long way off from their priorities, and my student workers are probably some of the higher paid ones on campus working in Tech. I disagree with the whole "things have always been expensive and younger kids are lazy" mentality. Many of these kids are hard workers, harder than I worked in college for sure, and while I was in college I could afford a paid-for decent vehicle on a part-time job wage.
I LOVE it. How you would not bend or break and that is what they count on lots of times.Insane pricing along with higher interest. Wait for the repo’s that are inevitable……one thousand dollar truck payments are not uncommon.
The car makers have gotten too greedy. There is little to no margin from invoice to window sticker (thus turning many dealers greedy with add ons and mark ups). Of they don’t have the volume they will try and make it up by catching a buyer asleep and “working them over”.
My last purchase was a two year old Tacoma 4x4. It was originally listed for 40,000 usd. New it was barely 41k. I sat tight and eventually the selling VW dealer dropped the price to 34,500. Cargurus sent me a text telling me the price had dropped…..I literally left work and drove up there when I got the text. It was on the lot for 97 days so they wanted it gone. I gave the them a 42% down payment and the finance office tried to sneak an 8% loan under my nose (my bank was going to give me 4.75). I called out the finance guy and told he he better get me near 5% or I was going to pay cash……I told him you can make some money off me but my credit is an 840 and you won’t make a dime if you do not work with me. He was whining they were loosing money….not my problem you advertised it for that price so honor it or I walk in with cash. Then he told me the bank said I had to buy and extended warranty becuase the truck was out of basic warranty ( still had plenty of powertrain coverage).
That was the last straw, I walked in with a cashier check a day later and took the truck uncleaned and detailed it myself.