Water heater woes

[y_p_w]

Originally Posted by Ws6
Replace it!!!!

I lived in an apartment once where the hot water heater sprung a leak. It had flooded half of the tiny apartment within a very short period of time. You don't want that in your house.

Darn. I spent a lot of time explaining what I replaced it with and all the details. So yeah it's gone and a brand new Bradford White Eco Defender is in its place. I had a little puddle around it, but it never sprung a massive leak even after a couple of years.

I guess the "Eco" part is that it's low NOX system, and the "Defender" part is that it protects against external ignition. I guess they're saying that if there's some sort of flammable gas or vapor (like paint thinner) leaking around it, it has some special flame arrestor to keep it from igniting.

 

[dlundblad]

Funny this was brought up.

I was doing my 6 month cleaning in the basement of our 120 year old farm house over the weekend. The bottom of our water heater is looking pretty crusty.. I feel we're on borrowed time as well. I'd like to get an efficient hybrid model since they remove moisture from the air too.

Our water heater hogs electricity. Our bill was about $50 less when we were on vacation for a week. I'm sure it's not entirely to blame, but it certainly seems like it'd play a huge role in our high power bill.

 

[PandaBear]

This new Honeywell control is all we have these days. I got a Rheem Platinum last year with 10 year warranty and this is what we got on it too. I figure if they are good enough for a 10 year warranty heater it is good enough for me. Personally I won't waste time swapping water heater with permit, I have a plumber who will come and swap water heater for me for $500 but I have to do the buying, hauling, disposing myself. His work is more like a couple hours instead of a whole day.

Bradford White is a good brand, but I noticed they are selling 6 year warranty ones for only slightly less than a 10 year warranty Rheem Platinum, so I ended up picking the Rheem Platinum.

Eco is probably more about California's low Nox standard than saving natural gas.

 

[Triple_Se7en]

Looking for help....

I'll be getting a new one in a couple weeks. It'll be a 40 gal and 12 year warranty. With all the demise about Honeywell, maybe I need to shop a different brand of thermostat housing.

Do any of the gas water heaters have a thermostat housing that isn't Honeywell? Or should I just deal with having a Honeywell anyways, since it's likely covered for 12 years?

 

[Lubener]

Brands do not matter much when it comes to water heaters.. There are only a few companies actually making the water heaters for about a dozen different companies. All that matters is size, tank/tankless, cost, gas or electric. AO Smith probably makes more than anyone.

 

[y_p_w]

Originally Posted by Triple_Se7en
Do any of the gas water heaters have a thermostat housing that isn't Honeywell? Or should I just deal with having a Honeywell anyways, since it's likely covered for 12 years?

I think purely electromechinical gas valves are still being used. It doesn't require the more sophisticated electronics, although these newer units are supposed to be more precise than what's pretty much a simple thermostat. I looked up some photos, and the ones from White-Rodgers and Robert Shaw look pretty similar although many of the Robert Shaw valves have their Unitrol brand name on them.

White-Rodgers has this unit. It's not quite like the Honeywell units in that there's no dial or pilot starting setting. However, this one requires a power source (this guy's turning off a switch mounted on the vent) which is probably powering an AC-DC adapter somewhere. I think this one also has automatic electric ignition. The Honeywell electronic units aren't powered until the pilot is lit and the heat is powering the thermopile. But this one is reliant on an external power source.



Also - I found out that ultra-low NOX water heaters are required in California and Utah. I looked at Home Depot, and they have that warning on all gas water heaters when it doesn't meet state requirements.

 

[PandaBear]

Originally Posted by Triple_Se7en
Looking for help....

I'll be getting a new one in a couple weeks. It'll be a 40 gal and 12 year warranty. With all the demise about Honeywell, maybe I need to shop a different brand of thermostat housing.

Do any of the gas water heaters have a thermostat housing that isn't Honeywell? Or should I just deal with having a Honeywell anyways, since it's likely covered for 12 years?


Don't let that thermostat be a deciding factor. Your focus should be on the water heater and its warranty itself. Buy what you think will not leak for the longest time, or the feature you are looking for.

 

[Kruse]

Your new water heater has a Honeywell valve on it. I pity you. The local supplier around here got rid of the AOSmith water heater line because of constant problems with them. Once they do the "code 4" overheat, your valve needs replaced.
The local supplier now supplies Rheem water heaters that have another brand of valve. The owner of the local plumbing shop is a friend of mine and tells it like it it. No more valve warranty problems.
Just do a search for "Honeywell water heater valve problems" and have a few hours of reading.

 

[LoneRanger]

Hummmmm.... Just had a new State Proline "Commercial Grade" 50 gallon gas fired 40,000 btu unit installed yesterday. Has a Honeywell gas valve assembly. Hope it holds up ok. 10 yr warranty.

Plumber I know who installed it swears by State. State is owned by AO Smith. So is Bradford White. State is made in Tennessee. High efficiency burner, low nox technology. We'll see how it shakes out.

 

[doitmyself]

LoneRanger, I don't find any evidence that Bradford White has ties to A.O. Smith. Headquartered in Pennsylvania and touting employee owned, their water heaters are made in Michigan, if that influences any Michiganders here.

I'm a pretty good internet researcher and standard tank type water heaters rank right up with Ford vs. Chevy type debates. Many plumbers state their favorite brand because that's what they get the best deal on from their local jobber. Ask 10 plumbers and you will get 10 different recommendations. A lot of pros believe that the main difference of 6 yr warranty vs. 12 yr. is that you are paying more for the extra warranty. Many believe that they are commodities and very close to equal in build quality. Sometimes you might get a metal drain valve vs. plastic on a "better" model and sometimes you might get a better anode rod with a "better" model, but you really need to dig to find if these differences really exist, especially with big box store models. But the guts of the heater (tank, etc.) are the same, "according to the internet pros".

You can find haters of every brand and bad reviews of every brand. The Honeywell debacle is all over the net. I did find some evidence that there are Rheem models with other brands of controllers other than Honeywell. In my research, I thought that Rheem slightly edged out A.O Smith and Bradford White for value and reliability. Check warranties closely and ease of anode rod replacement too. I installed a Bradford White 3 years ago and will find out how well it lasts. The A.O. Smith before that was about 20 years old, but you can't compare the old products to the new.

Just my thoughts.

 

[Ws6]

Originally Posted by dlundblad
Funny this was brought up.

I was doing my 6 month cleaning in the basement of our 120 year old farm house over the weekend. The bottom of our water heater is looking pretty crusty.. I feel we're on borrowed time as well. I'd like to get an efficient hybrid model since they remove moisture from the air too.

Our water heater hogs electricity. Our bill was about $50 less when we were on vacation for a week. I'm sure it's not entirely to blame, but it certainly seems like it'd play a huge role in our high power bill.

Interesting. Mine is electric and I keep it on 140*f (I checked temp delta at the furthest indoor faucet up stairs from it, and it was a 6*F from 140, so...copper ain't too much of a loss). I wonder if me choosing a warmer temp is raising my bills?

 

[Skippy722]

Originally Posted by Ws6
Originally Posted by dlundblad
Funny this was brought up.

I was doing my 6 month cleaning in the basement of our 120 year old farm house over the weekend. The bottom of our water heater is looking pretty crusty.. I feel we're on borrowed time as well. I'd like to get an efficient hybrid model since they remove moisture from the air too.

Our water heater hogs electricity. Our bill was about $50 less when we were on vacation for a week. I'm sure it's not entirely to blame, but it certainly seems like it'd play a huge role in our high power bill.

Interesting. Mine is electric and I keep it on 140*f (I checked temp delta at the furthest indoor faucet up stairs from it, and it was a 6*F from 140, so...copper ain't too much of a loss). I wonder if me choosing a warmer temp is raising my bills?


According to some googling I just did, going from 140F to 120F could save $6-$20 a year.

 

[SHOZ]

Copper is a huge heat sink. Make sure the pipes are insulated good close to the heater at least.

 

[Kruse]

Originally Posted by doitmyself
LoneRanger, I don't find any evidence that Bradford White has ties to A.O. Smith. Headquartered in Pennsylvania and touting employee owned, their water heaters are made in Michigan, if that influences any Michiganders here.


The regular, consumer-grade 40 and 50 gallon A.O. Smith water heaters are made in Mexico. (Their larger, industrial models are made in USA)