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wow, makes me want an EV even less now.
Tesla 1st world problems thanksgiving
- Thread starter Andrew1972
- Start date
Meanwhile, while running a morning errand in Atascadero, 18 miles from the Madonna Inn shown in the original post, a line of Teslas await a charge on a rainy December 1st morning. By the time that last Tesla gets a charge I'd be 100 miles closer to home with my ICE or Hybrid. At least those Tesla drivers can refuel their bodies at Dennys while they wait. Seeing this makes me want a Chevy Volt.
Scott
Scott
Originally Posted by smc733
But what is the luddite answer, ICE forever? .
Ya know, I'm no Luddite. I manage a flying network, with fly by wire flight controls and I love the technology!!
However, we must accept that customer demand is what matters. The EV's are fantastic in many ways and provide a driving experience that can only be described as perfect. Yet, they don't work for me and many others.
Cost
Range
Charge time
Remain the key issues.
Furthermore, we can only move so many Ions. Battery tech needs an order of magnitude improvement. Despite billions spent, we've accomplished little (nothing) in the way of improved specific energy.
But what is the luddite answer, ICE forever? .
Ya know, I'm no Luddite. I manage a flying network, with fly by wire flight controls and I love the technology!!
However, we must accept that customer demand is what matters. The EV's are fantastic in many ways and provide a driving experience that can only be described as perfect. Yet, they don't work for me and many others.
Cost
Range
Charge time
Remain the key issues.
Furthermore, we can only move so many Ions. Battery tech needs an order of magnitude improvement. Despite billions spent, we've accomplished little (nothing) in the way of improved specific energy.
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Originally Posted by Audios
Super cool hotel! How far away to the next charging station?
That is just the parking lot. It's a very interesting place with each room having a unique theme. The restaurant has a "world famous" urinal that someone might walk in and take a picture while you are using it. In reality you are peeing in a small waterfall
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Madonna_Inn
Super cool hotel! How far away to the next charging station?
That is just the parking lot. It's a very interesting place with each room having a unique theme. The restaurant has a "world famous" urinal that someone might walk in and take a picture while you are using it. In reality you are peeing in a small waterfall
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Madonna_Inn
dnewton3
Staff member
This is about the "refuel" time. The waiting line is due to two things:
- limited docking stations for recharge
- long recharge times
With the situation in the video, I would think you're in for about 2 hours or so; one hour waiting in line, another for charging? (this is a guess; I don't have direct experience).
I could wait an hour in line for gasoline, but it still only takes about 2 minutes to fill up my Taurus, then I'm good for another 500 miles.
- limited docking stations for recharge
- long recharge times
With the situation in the video, I would think you're in for about 2 hours or so; one hour waiting in line, another for charging? (this is a guess; I don't have direct experience).
I could wait an hour in line for gasoline, but it still only takes about 2 minutes to fill up my Taurus, then I'm good for another 500 miles.
This comment is directed to the "Royal You" , not the previous poster. Once again we fixate on long charge times. Most owners of electric cars will be charging at home and will rarely need to charge at a public station. So Thanksgiving caused them to use a public station, causing a two hour personal delay. So what, Thanksgiving caused more than a two hour delay for the people on the 600 flights that were cancelled in the USA due to weather last week. If you regularly drive outside your charge limit, don't bother buying an electric car. They won't miss you.
Originally Posted by Snagglefoot
Once again we fixate on long charge times. Most owners of electric cars will be charging at home and will rarely need to charge at a public station. .
Which means of course that the EV market is somewhat limited to those with easy access to charging at home. Which in most cases will be a garage space for all of the family cars. Some with a driveway may be able to set up an outdoor electric hookup I suppose. There are other options to charge, but not universal like a gasoline stations all over the place making it less convenient to those without garages or outside driveway hookups.
ICE cars are here to stay for a sizeable portion of the population for which charging is a hassle. Eventually the industry will find a way to eliminate the hassle, but that may be a ways away at the current pace.
Once again we fixate on long charge times. Most owners of electric cars will be charging at home and will rarely need to charge at a public station. .
Which means of course that the EV market is somewhat limited to those with easy access to charging at home. Which in most cases will be a garage space for all of the family cars. Some with a driveway may be able to set up an outdoor electric hookup I suppose. There are other options to charge, but not universal like a gasoline stations all over the place making it less convenient to those without garages or outside driveway hookups.
ICE cars are here to stay for a sizeable portion of the population for which charging is a hassle. Eventually the industry will find a way to eliminate the hassle, but that may be a ways away at the current pace.
For now, there are 95 million single family homes in America. They can start with those.
All good points.
All the EV owners I know have more than 1 car. I sure do.
Elon Musk knew EV success was dependent on a charging network; a huge undertaking and expense.
This is a key reason Tesla is far ahead of other EV manufacturers.
I wish the charging network used universal charge ports.
As pointed out, many people cannot charge at home.
I would not make this trip in our EV due to charger availability among other things. I would rent if i did not have another vehicle better suited.
EVs are in their infancy. Certainly they are not for everybody for a plethora of reasons.
Nor are EVs suited for every trip.
By the way, the cars do not need an hour to charge. They need enough charge to get to their destination.
The Tesla Model 3 Long Range can charge from 10-80% in as little as 30 minutes from a 120kW Tesla Supercharger, while the Standard Range Plus will do it in even less than that.
Having said that, 30 minutes is an eternity as compared to 3 to 4 minutes fill up at Costco.
All the EV owners I know have more than 1 car. I sure do.
Elon Musk knew EV success was dependent on a charging network; a huge undertaking and expense.
This is a key reason Tesla is far ahead of other EV manufacturers.
I wish the charging network used universal charge ports.
As pointed out, many people cannot charge at home.
I would not make this trip in our EV due to charger availability among other things. I would rent if i did not have another vehicle better suited.
EVs are in their infancy. Certainly they are not for everybody for a plethora of reasons.
Nor are EVs suited for every trip.
By the way, the cars do not need an hour to charge. They need enough charge to get to their destination.
The Tesla Model 3 Long Range can charge from 10-80% in as little as 30 minutes from a 120kW Tesla Supercharger, while the Standard Range Plus will do it in even less than that.
Having said that, 30 minutes is an eternity as compared to 3 to 4 minutes fill up at Costco.
dnewton3
Staff member
Originally Posted by JeffKeryk
... By the way, the cars do not need an hour to charge. They need enough charge to get to their destination.
The Tesla Model 3 Long Range can charge from 10-80% in as little as 30 minutes from a 120kW Tesla Supercharger, while the Standard Range Plus will do it in even less than that.
Having said that, 30 minutes is an eternity as compared to 3 to 4 minutes fill up at Costco.
That's true.
But your point is also true of gasoline/diesel. If you only need to travel 30 miles, then you may only need two or three gallons and not a "fill up". It's all relative.
But we're trying to compare apples to apples here; to "top off" to a level of "full" capacity of range. A full fill for a car/truck is FAR shorter than a full charge for a EV. And a "only gotta get 20 miles" gallon is far shorter in refuel time than perhaps 15 minutes on the charger for an EV. In a society that puts a premium on "gotta have it now", many see EV charging as taking too darn long. 300 miles of range takes far longer for EV than liquid fuel. And 30 miles of range takes far longer for EV than liquid fuel. The ratio may not be totally linear, but it's certainly close. In fact, it probably favors the liquid fuels because 30 miles in my Taurus would take about 1 gallon; that ain't long at the pump!
I have a friend whom has a Volt; he loves it. Charges it at home, drives to work and gets to charge it at work (for free, at least to him). But as you know, it's not a pure electric only vehicle. He would never have a pure EV by his own admission.
EVs make sense in some situations; I'll admit that. A small EV that is ONLY used in urban situations, and has the ability to recharge at consistent, convenient places and times might be a good choice for some folks. But they are NOT a one-size-fits-all solution for all drivers. Too many of us have a w-i-d-e variety of driving situations that defy the nature of EV use.
I have a 2018 F-250 6.2L truck. I can use it in winter for 4x4 driving to/from any destination, and it is a must-have because I live in a VERY hilly area that precluds FWD or RWD in winter. But I can also use that truck to pull my RV trailer to AZ and CO and such; long drives of 8+ hours, with only a few minutes fill up of it's 34 gallon tank. And I can haul my Kubota to various places with ease, because the torque produced is 100% from the first gallon to the last gallon; the power does not degrade as the miles pile on. Try that with an EV ...
We have a 2018 Taurus for commuting; generally 28mpg if easy on the throttle. But we can also drive it from IN to AZ and back for the holidays, and it only takes a few minutes to gas up, and we're back on the interstate. Try that with an EV ...
This is about energy density packaging; it speaks to range as well as force production relative to duration of exposure. Right now, EVs are great at light-duty tasks that do not call for long distance challenges. But they suck at being a "jack of all trades" vehicle. They are a precise, near-surgical instrument that makes sense in a very limited scope. And the challenges they have are not easily overcome; not today, nor the near future. Someday? Maybe so. They will become mainstream when they can solve ALL problems of the mainstream use factors. Until then, they are a sideshow effort I am not interested in.
... By the way, the cars do not need an hour to charge. They need enough charge to get to their destination.
The Tesla Model 3 Long Range can charge from 10-80% in as little as 30 minutes from a 120kW Tesla Supercharger, while the Standard Range Plus will do it in even less than that.
Having said that, 30 minutes is an eternity as compared to 3 to 4 minutes fill up at Costco.
That's true.
But your point is also true of gasoline/diesel. If you only need to travel 30 miles, then you may only need two or three gallons and not a "fill up". It's all relative.
But we're trying to compare apples to apples here; to "top off" to a level of "full" capacity of range. A full fill for a car/truck is FAR shorter than a full charge for a EV. And a "only gotta get 20 miles" gallon is far shorter in refuel time than perhaps 15 minutes on the charger for an EV. In a society that puts a premium on "gotta have it now", many see EV charging as taking too darn long. 300 miles of range takes far longer for EV than liquid fuel. And 30 miles of range takes far longer for EV than liquid fuel. The ratio may not be totally linear, but it's certainly close. In fact, it probably favors the liquid fuels because 30 miles in my Taurus would take about 1 gallon; that ain't long at the pump!
I have a friend whom has a Volt; he loves it. Charges it at home, drives to work and gets to charge it at work (for free, at least to him). But as you know, it's not a pure electric only vehicle. He would never have a pure EV by his own admission.
EVs make sense in some situations; I'll admit that. A small EV that is ONLY used in urban situations, and has the ability to recharge at consistent, convenient places and times might be a good choice for some folks. But they are NOT a one-size-fits-all solution for all drivers. Too many of us have a w-i-d-e variety of driving situations that defy the nature of EV use.
I have a 2018 F-250 6.2L truck. I can use it in winter for 4x4 driving to/from any destination, and it is a must-have because I live in a VERY hilly area that precluds FWD or RWD in winter. But I can also use that truck to pull my RV trailer to AZ and CO and such; long drives of 8+ hours, with only a few minutes fill up of it's 34 gallon tank. And I can haul my Kubota to various places with ease, because the torque produced is 100% from the first gallon to the last gallon; the power does not degrade as the miles pile on. Try that with an EV ...
We have a 2018 Taurus for commuting; generally 28mpg if easy on the throttle. But we can also drive it from IN to AZ and back for the holidays, and it only takes a few minutes to gas up, and we're back on the interstate. Try that with an EV ...
This is about energy density packaging; it speaks to range as well as force production relative to duration of exposure. Right now, EVs are great at light-duty tasks that do not call for long distance challenges. But they suck at being a "jack of all trades" vehicle. They are a precise, near-surgical instrument that makes sense in a very limited scope. And the challenges they have are not easily overcome; not today, nor the near future. Someday? Maybe so. They will become mainstream when they can solve ALL problems of the mainstream use factors. Until then, they are a sideshow effort I am not interested in.
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This does not scare me. As there is demand for charging stations, there will be a profitable solution. I firmly have a BEV in my 9-year plan at this point.
IF it was an issue for me today, I would be one of those guys who kept a small genset in the back in a bag for long trips as a "just in case." It would be a negligible irony for the convenience of charging at home and avoiding unleaded.
IF it was an issue for me today, I would be one of those guys who kept a small genset in the back in a bag for long trips as a "just in case." It would be a negligible irony for the convenience of charging at home and avoiding unleaded.
Originally Posted by dnewton3
Originally Posted by JeffKeryk
... By the way, the cars do not need an hour to charge. They need enough charge to get to their destination.
The Tesla Model 3 Long Range can charge from 10-80% in as little as 30 minutes from a 120kW Tesla Supercharger, while the Standard Range Plus will do it in even less than that.
Having said that, 30 minutes is an eternity as compared to 3 to 4 minutes fill up at Costco.
That's true.
But your point is also true of gasoline/diesel. If you only need to travel 30 miles, then you may only need two or three gallons and not a "fill up". It's all relative.
But we're trying to compare apples to apples here; to "top off" to a level of "full" capacity of range. A full fill for a car/truck is FAR shorter than a full charge for a EV. And a "only gotta get 20 miles" gallon is far shorter in refuel time than perhaps 15 minutes on the charger for an EV. In a society that puts a premium on "gotta have it now", many see EV charging as taking too darn long. 300 miles of range takes far longer for EV than liquid fuel. And 30 miles of range takes far longer for EV than liquid fuel. The ratio may not be totally linear, but it's certainly close. In fact, it probably favors the liquid fuels because 30 miles in my Taurus would take about 1 gallon; that ain't long at the pump!
I have a friend whom has a Volt; he loves it. Charges it at home, drives to work and gets to charge it at work (for free, at least to him). But as you know, it's not a pure electric only vehicle. He would never have a pure EV by his own admission.
EVs make sense in some situations; I'll admit that. A small EV that is ONLY used in urban situations, and has the ability to recharge at consistent, convenient places and times might be a good choice for some folks. But they are NOT a one-size-fits-all solution for all drivers. Too many of us have a w-i-d-e variety of driving situations that defy the nature of EV use.
I have a 2018 F-250 6.2L truck. I can use it in winter for 4x4 driving to/from any destination, and it is a must-have because I live in a VERY hilly area that precluds FWD or RWD in winter. But I can also use that truck to pull my RV trailer to AZ and CO and such; long drives of 8+ hours, with only a few minutes fill up of it's 34 gallon tank. And I can haul my Kubota to various places with ease, because the torque produced is 100% from the first gallon to the last gallon; the power does not degrade as the miles pile on. Try that with an EV ...
We have a 2018 Taurus for commuting; generally 28mpg if easy on the throttle. But we can also drive it from IN to AZ and back for the holidays, and it only takes a few minutes to gas up, and we're back on the interstate. Try that with an EV ...
This is about energy density packaging; it speaks to range as well as force production relative to duration of exposure. Right now, EVs are great at light-duty tasks that do not call for long distance challenges. But they suck at being a "jack of all trades" vehicle. They are a precise, near-surgical instrument that makes sense in a very limited scope. And the challenges they have are not easily overcome; not today, nor the near future. Someday? Maybe so. They will become mainstream when they can solve ALL problems of the mainstream use factors. Until then, they are a sideshow effort I am not interested in.
You make good points that I have made on many posts.
Another point: I charge at home when the car is in the garage. I never go to a gas station and start with a full tank every day.
Until you have experienced this, I believe you cannot understand what a great perk it is.
I charged at a Supercharger once, just to give it a shot.
If you disregard that 5 minute test (we went into Starbucks), your Taurus spends infinitely more of your time fueling then my Model 3.
Of course this speaks to one end of the spectrum. I have seen Teslas waiting in line to charge in downtown Los Gatos; I was shocked!
Again, EVs are not for everyone. I still consider my Tesla a toy. No one needs a Tesla, or a Vette, Poreche, MB, Beemer, etc. A Honda Civic is probably a better car than any of those.
Many cars are purpose built, not just EVs.
I am not sure I ever called the Model 3 a jack of all trades; in fact I have said our RX (or any suv) fits that bill pretty well.
If I could have only 1 car, it would not be an EV. In fact every owner I have spoke to has more than 1 car.
As for the partial charge, this speaks to EV fueling strategy. It is different than ICE cars; another point I have stated. You learn.
Is this as good as ICE cars for more than say, 200 miles? Of course not.
You are right, apples to apples the ICE car makes much more sense in so many ways.
EVs are not ICE; that's the point. "Apples to apples" misses the point.
You may not be interested in EVs; they don't make sense for you and your situation. I get it.
Totally understand and agree.
By the way, I pass lotsa Ford F-250 trucks (and other vehicles) in the commuter lane as they trudge along in traffic...
FYI, I love pickups; I will always have one. They are my personal favorite.
I am not sure EVs are a sideshow, at least for 100K new car sales per quarter. And growing in an otherwise generally declining car market.
I think you know the Model 3 has the highest customer satisfaction of any car, at least according to CR.
Owners flat out love their Model 3s. I know I do. These cars are exciting.
Again, you make good points; well said. EVs are in their infancy as mass production vehicles.
Originally Posted by JeffKeryk
... By the way, the cars do not need an hour to charge. They need enough charge to get to their destination.
The Tesla Model 3 Long Range can charge from 10-80% in as little as 30 minutes from a 120kW Tesla Supercharger, while the Standard Range Plus will do it in even less than that.
Having said that, 30 minutes is an eternity as compared to 3 to 4 minutes fill up at Costco.
That's true.
But your point is also true of gasoline/diesel. If you only need to travel 30 miles, then you may only need two or three gallons and not a "fill up". It's all relative.
But we're trying to compare apples to apples here; to "top off" to a level of "full" capacity of range. A full fill for a car/truck is FAR shorter than a full charge for a EV. And a "only gotta get 20 miles" gallon is far shorter in refuel time than perhaps 15 minutes on the charger for an EV. In a society that puts a premium on "gotta have it now", many see EV charging as taking too darn long. 300 miles of range takes far longer for EV than liquid fuel. And 30 miles of range takes far longer for EV than liquid fuel. The ratio may not be totally linear, but it's certainly close. In fact, it probably favors the liquid fuels because 30 miles in my Taurus would take about 1 gallon; that ain't long at the pump!
I have a friend whom has a Volt; he loves it. Charges it at home, drives to work and gets to charge it at work (for free, at least to him). But as you know, it's not a pure electric only vehicle. He would never have a pure EV by his own admission.
EVs make sense in some situations; I'll admit that. A small EV that is ONLY used in urban situations, and has the ability to recharge at consistent, convenient places and times might be a good choice for some folks. But they are NOT a one-size-fits-all solution for all drivers. Too many of us have a w-i-d-e variety of driving situations that defy the nature of EV use.
I have a 2018 F-250 6.2L truck. I can use it in winter for 4x4 driving to/from any destination, and it is a must-have because I live in a VERY hilly area that precluds FWD or RWD in winter. But I can also use that truck to pull my RV trailer to AZ and CO and such; long drives of 8+ hours, with only a few minutes fill up of it's 34 gallon tank. And I can haul my Kubota to various places with ease, because the torque produced is 100% from the first gallon to the last gallon; the power does not degrade as the miles pile on. Try that with an EV ...
We have a 2018 Taurus for commuting; generally 28mpg if easy on the throttle. But we can also drive it from IN to AZ and back for the holidays, and it only takes a few minutes to gas up, and we're back on the interstate. Try that with an EV ...
This is about energy density packaging; it speaks to range as well as force production relative to duration of exposure. Right now, EVs are great at light-duty tasks that do not call for long distance challenges. But they suck at being a "jack of all trades" vehicle. They are a precise, near-surgical instrument that makes sense in a very limited scope. And the challenges they have are not easily overcome; not today, nor the near future. Someday? Maybe so. They will become mainstream when they can solve ALL problems of the mainstream use factors. Until then, they are a sideshow effort I am not interested in.
You make good points that I have made on many posts.
Another point: I charge at home when the car is in the garage. I never go to a gas station and start with a full tank every day.
Until you have experienced this, I believe you cannot understand what a great perk it is.
I charged at a Supercharger once, just to give it a shot.
If you disregard that 5 minute test (we went into Starbucks), your Taurus spends infinitely more of your time fueling then my Model 3.
Of course this speaks to one end of the spectrum. I have seen Teslas waiting in line to charge in downtown Los Gatos; I was shocked!
Again, EVs are not for everyone. I still consider my Tesla a toy. No one needs a Tesla, or a Vette, Poreche, MB, Beemer, etc. A Honda Civic is probably a better car than any of those.
Many cars are purpose built, not just EVs.
I am not sure I ever called the Model 3 a jack of all trades; in fact I have said our RX (or any suv) fits that bill pretty well.
If I could have only 1 car, it would not be an EV. In fact every owner I have spoke to has more than 1 car.
As for the partial charge, this speaks to EV fueling strategy. It is different than ICE cars; another point I have stated. You learn.
Is this as good as ICE cars for more than say, 200 miles? Of course not.
You are right, apples to apples the ICE car makes much more sense in so many ways.
EVs are not ICE; that's the point. "Apples to apples" misses the point.
You may not be interested in EVs; they don't make sense for you and your situation. I get it.
Totally understand and agree.
By the way, I pass lotsa Ford F-250 trucks (and other vehicles) in the commuter lane as they trudge along in traffic...
FYI, I love pickups; I will always have one. They are my personal favorite.
I am not sure EVs are a sideshow, at least for 100K new car sales per quarter. And growing in an otherwise generally declining car market.
I think you know the Model 3 has the highest customer satisfaction of any car, at least according to CR.
Owners flat out love their Model 3s. I know I do. These cars are exciting.
Again, you make good points; well said. EVs are in their infancy as mass production vehicles.
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This is why the 2g chevy Volt is so great and underrated. You can do the bulk of your daily driving all electric and use a tank of gas when you need to cover hundreds of miles. You can even set it to keep your EV power in reserve. For example, leave fully charged but use gas until you arrive, then use electric in the dense city environment where it is far more efficient than gas, and the gas is more efficient at high speed.
Yet they sell less than 300 a quarter, and theres only about 100 left to be purchased.
Yet they sell less than 300 a quarter, and theres only about 100 left to be purchased.
dnewton3
Staff member
JeffKeryK - You make some valid counter points. And I think we're generally in agreement overall.
I have some additional comments, but I think they are fairly bland.
For example, my friend that has the 2g Volt, still has to connect his vehicle to the "free" charge at his workplace. And, he has to connect it upon arriving back at home, every single day. You mention that there is a "convenience" in that you don't have to stop at a gas station as I do; that's true. But I also don't have the constant and continual daily connect events, often twice a day. If I'm careful and frugal in my throttle use, my tank capacity means I only have to fill up once a week. So in my mind, your point is countered by mine. I would estimate the time spent is sort of a wash; about equal. If you spend 30 seconds per connect, twice a day, for a week, that's 7 minutes of time spent "fueling" your EV. I spend less than 7 minutes fueling my ride once a week. Sure, I have to drive to a gas station to do it, but those are so very prominent everywhere that it's by no means inconvenient for me to do so; they are right on my way, no matter which way I'm driving. In fact, each charge even in a EV is really dealing with the charge cord twice. Once to connect it; then once to disconnect it.
And there are things you don't deal with in sunny CA that others have to deal with. For example, if you are charging at a dedicated station, the cord stays with the station. But if you're using a mobile cord from the EV at a non-dedicated source (charging from a 110v source at a friends home), then you're dealing with a wet cord to put away back into the vehicle if it rains, or a snowy cord if it snows. And, what happens if you go to visit a buddy at an apartment complex, and have to drag out a 110v cord for an overnight stay, and the extension cord is stolen ...? These are small, rare issues; I admit that. But they are unique to EVs. For that matter, EV ownership at a home where you have a dedicated driveway and/or garage is nice, but I cannot fathom owning an EV in a apartment complex where constant issues with cord theft would be in the back of my mind. Or, just devious kids whom unplug your EV at 11:00 pm on a Wednesday summer night, because they are bored and think it's funny that you'll have no "juice" the next morning to go to work. At any place where you do not have secure charging options, you have to leave your charging cord exposed and are at the mercy of the kind and gentle folks around you. There was even a news story here locally a while back where someone unplugged all the EVs at the charging station at the mall garage on the north side of Indy; likely as a prank. People came out and the cords were just laying on the ground. It's easy for me to keep people from stealing my gas or contaminating my tank; I just put a locking gas cap on my car.
Everything comes with challenges; some common ones, some are unique.
I have some additional comments, but I think they are fairly bland.
For example, my friend that has the 2g Volt, still has to connect his vehicle to the "free" charge at his workplace. And, he has to connect it upon arriving back at home, every single day. You mention that there is a "convenience" in that you don't have to stop at a gas station as I do; that's true. But I also don't have the constant and continual daily connect events, often twice a day. If I'm careful and frugal in my throttle use, my tank capacity means I only have to fill up once a week. So in my mind, your point is countered by mine. I would estimate the time spent is sort of a wash; about equal. If you spend 30 seconds per connect, twice a day, for a week, that's 7 minutes of time spent "fueling" your EV. I spend less than 7 minutes fueling my ride once a week. Sure, I have to drive to a gas station to do it, but those are so very prominent everywhere that it's by no means inconvenient for me to do so; they are right on my way, no matter which way I'm driving. In fact, each charge even in a EV is really dealing with the charge cord twice. Once to connect it; then once to disconnect it.
And there are things you don't deal with in sunny CA that others have to deal with. For example, if you are charging at a dedicated station, the cord stays with the station. But if you're using a mobile cord from the EV at a non-dedicated source (charging from a 110v source at a friends home), then you're dealing with a wet cord to put away back into the vehicle if it rains, or a snowy cord if it snows. And, what happens if you go to visit a buddy at an apartment complex, and have to drag out a 110v cord for an overnight stay, and the extension cord is stolen ...? These are small, rare issues; I admit that. But they are unique to EVs. For that matter, EV ownership at a home where you have a dedicated driveway and/or garage is nice, but I cannot fathom owning an EV in a apartment complex where constant issues with cord theft would be in the back of my mind. Or, just devious kids whom unplug your EV at 11:00 pm on a Wednesday summer night, because they are bored and think it's funny that you'll have no "juice" the next morning to go to work. At any place where you do not have secure charging options, you have to leave your charging cord exposed and are at the mercy of the kind and gentle folks around you. There was even a news story here locally a while back where someone unplugged all the EVs at the charging station at the mall garage on the north side of Indy; likely as a prank. People came out and the cords were just laying on the ground. It's easy for me to keep people from stealing my gas or contaminating my tank; I just put a locking gas cap on my car.
Everything comes with challenges; some common ones, some are unique.
dnewton3 - Yes, EVs, especially Teslas, are different, no doubt. They are not for everyone.
I charge at home and have solar panels. CA has lotsa sunny days. Far different than most.
I can tell you pulling into the garage and plugging in the charge cable is really easy; similiar to getting in and out of a car. Heck, the charge port door even opens and closes itself. It does not have to be daily, just like an ICE car. I can tell you charging at work is great, far better than a gas station.
I believe if you experienced the convenience of a Model 3, under the right circumstances, you would be very happy with it.
You will have to learn the process; there is even a charging etiquitte. But that's another topic...
As far as pranks, well no car is immune.
To repeat, if I could have only 1 car, it would not be an EV. But as a second vehicle, under the right circumstances (including being able to afford an expensive car) a Model 3 will put a smile on your face. Ask anyone who owns one.
Thank you for your thoughts. When you visit Silicon Valley, we can take a spin.
Give 'er a little throttle and whoosh!
When you 1st switch into AP, I'm gonna watch your reaction...
The other day, on 280 North near Palo Alto, Sue moved into the slow lane at about 65 mph on AP. When a car entered the freeway at about 50 something, the Model 3 slowed to keep proper distance. Pulling the blinker down performed a lane change and accelerated back to 65.
This car is a trip...
I charge at home and have solar panels. CA has lotsa sunny days. Far different than most.
I can tell you pulling into the garage and plugging in the charge cable is really easy; similiar to getting in and out of a car. Heck, the charge port door even opens and closes itself. It does not have to be daily, just like an ICE car. I can tell you charging at work is great, far better than a gas station.
I believe if you experienced the convenience of a Model 3, under the right circumstances, you would be very happy with it.
You will have to learn the process; there is even a charging etiquitte. But that's another topic...
As far as pranks, well no car is immune.
To repeat, if I could have only 1 car, it would not be an EV. But as a second vehicle, under the right circumstances (including being able to afford an expensive car) a Model 3 will put a smile on your face. Ask anyone who owns one.
Thank you for your thoughts. When you visit Silicon Valley, we can take a spin.
Give 'er a little throttle and whoosh!
When you 1st switch into AP, I'm gonna watch your reaction...
The other day, on 280 North near Palo Alto, Sue moved into the slow lane at about 65 mph on AP. When a car entered the freeway at about 50 something, the Model 3 slowed to keep proper distance. Pulling the blinker down performed a lane change and accelerated back to 65.
This car is a trip...
Originally Posted by dnewton3
It's easy for me to keep people from stealing my gas or contaminating my tank; I just put a locking gas cap on my car.
Locking gas cap? They will drill a hole in your tank and drain from the bottom. Now your fuel and tank are gone. You're spot on about the time spent plugging/unplugging EVs tho!
It's easy for me to keep people from stealing my gas or contaminating my tank; I just put a locking gas cap on my car.
Locking gas cap? They will drill a hole in your tank and drain from the bottom. Now your fuel and tank are gone. You're spot on about the time spent plugging/unplugging EVs tho!
Best point you made.... EVs are not for everyone...
You did make a good number of very, very good points as well in addition to the one I mentioned above...
As long as I maintain a real choice in what I actually want to own and drive... I am perfectly ok with that.
However... If World Champions want to take that away from me and others.... I have a REAL problem with that.
You did make a good number of very, very good points as well in addition to the one I mentioned above...
As long as I maintain a real choice in what I actually want to own and drive... I am perfectly ok with that.
However... If World Champions want to take that away from me and others.... I have a REAL problem with that.
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Originally Posted by dareo
Originally Posted by dnewton3
It's easy for me to keep people from stealing my gas or contaminating my tank; I just put a locking gas cap on my car.
Locking gas cap? They will drill a hole in your tank and drain from the bottom. Now your fuel and tank are gone. You're spot on about the time spent plugging/unplugging EVs tho!
I highly highly doubt any one going to actually drill a hole in a tank... Now... Someone cutting out the extremely expensive parts to the exhaust system... I know that has and does happen... Happened to young lady I worked with at the hospital... Her Toyota truck had stuff cut out of it while sitting in the parking lot of the hospital... Did thousands of dollars of damage to her new truck...
Originally Posted by dnewton3
It's easy for me to keep people from stealing my gas or contaminating my tank; I just put a locking gas cap on my car.
Locking gas cap? They will drill a hole in your tank and drain from the bottom. Now your fuel and tank are gone. You're spot on about the time spent plugging/unplugging EVs tho!
I highly highly doubt any one going to actually drill a hole in a tank... Now... Someone cutting out the extremely expensive parts to the exhaust system... I know that has and does happen... Happened to young lady I worked with at the hospital... Her Toyota truck had stuff cut out of it while sitting in the parking lot of the hospital... Did thousands of dollars of damage to her new truck...
