I think it's pinging

[Silverado12]

Try 89 octane and see if this cures the pinging. If it does, no need to use premium. An old trick was to use colder spark plugs. Keep in mind you'll be able to go back to 87 but may lose a little fuel mileage. Overall, best solution is better gas.

 

[KrisZ]

Using higher octane gas, in an engine that was designed to run on 87, to cure the pinging is like treating a broken arm with pain killers.

Address the issue and keep using 87. There is nothing magical about higher grades.

 

[krismoriah72]

If it were in my shop i would suspect one of three things..

1)Too much compression- buildup on the combustion chamber pistons/valves

2)knock sensor- bang a wrench on the manifold near the sensor (never hit the sensor itself). If there is no timing retard, the sensor may be bad.

3)EGR- least likely case but if its plugged or not working then the combustion chamber temps can cause pinging.

I would start with the easy stuff first- knock sensor wrench test...then move onto a top engine cleaner.

Try the CRC GDI service kit from NAPA https://www.napaonline.com/en/p/CRC05320

 

[Yah-Tah-Hey]

Use 91 octane fuel.

 

[OVERKILL]

Originally Posted By: MaximaGuy

The ping is from the coils, they are on their way out.


As Ducked already noted, pinging has nothing to do with the coils, maybe you are thinking of a misfire?

Pinging, or ignition knock, is often the result of, but not limited to, too much ignition timing relative to the knock resistance of the fuel in use. This is why knock sensors are used to keep an eye on it and retard the timing if pinging occurs.

Some OEM tunes, for the pursuit of fuel economy will allow "mild" (you can hear it...) ignition knock and claim it is OK. Ford is one I can think of, as I believe it was common with the 3V Modular.

Note that knock can also be mitigated by a richer mixture but generally, IIRC, ignition timing retard is commonly used the most as the control mechanism.

There are other factors that can contribute to an engine's propensity to knock, but that's not really relevant to the thread when were are talking about a stock vehicle/engine here.


Nick:
See if there's a TSB that deals with this, which may include an updated PCM map with revised timing tables. If not, and the OEM says it is "normal", then your only real option to mitigate it is an aftermarket tune or running higher octane fuel unfortunately

 

[wemay]

Originally Posted By: OVERKILL
Some OEM tunes, for the pursuit of fuel economy will allow "mild" (you can hear it...) ignition knock and claim it is OK.


On my 2014 (i keep saying 2012 in error) Sonata, Hyundai told me a light knock was "normal". It has nothing to do with LSPI for those looking in that direction. As i said, the plug change helped me a lot but it would still ping for a second on the on-ramps. The only thing that cleared it 100% was higher octane. Whether it was deposits or not, i don't know, we sold it with 80k+ miles. No other issues.

 

[Silverado12]

It's really not a big deal; I had similar issues with cars (one a new Dodge pickup truck) and midgrade/premium gas is made for a reason. Don't throw away money looking for a nonexistent problem. Minimum octane should be used that solves the pinging.

 

[Trav]

That is true unless the engine does have a carbon issue in which case it can become addicted to higher and higher octane levels.
The more carbon that accumulates the higher the compression goes and with it the octane requirement, carbon glowing in the combustion chamber doesn't do any good either.

If I had this engine I would ensure there was no excess carbon in the combustion chambers and intake valve stems, if not then just run the higher octane as you say but if there is it should be addressed.
At that point he could go back to 87 and perform a routine cleaning to minimize the deposit formations.

 

[Nick1994]

Would a borescope down the spark plug holes tell me anything? I think my dad has one

 

[JustinH]

Interesting how someone said new plugs solved the pinging issue.

I was wondering this myself, but haven't gotten around to ordering the $12 a piece spark plugs.

Mine has 60k I have been messing with different octanes.

Always use syn oil at 3750 severe intervals.

On Sams Club 93 octane it doesn't ping at all.

On Sams 87, it pings quite a bit when cold under light throttle. Does not ping under heavy throttle usually. Seems to ping most after the 1-2 shift.

I think the combination of carbon, and Hyundai tuning this thing so lean to save fuel is causing the issue.

I have messed with 89 octane a few times, and it pings less than 87 but still present.

I'm driving myself nuts with this stupid car. Its annoying to pump 93 octane into a korean economy car.

A lady my wife works with has a 2012 Kia Optima. Car runs like absolute junk and sounds like rocks being shaken in a coffee can.

I have tried those GDI cleaner aerosol can solutions, they did nothing. I agree with Critic, manual removal of carbon needs to be done. Doesn't sound like a fun job for a car with only 60k miles.

I'll try plugs next week and report back. I just did a PCV valve yesterday as well.

 

[JustinH]

The best thing that could happen is this thing develops a rod knock, and Hyundai will replace the longblock under recall.

Most 2.4L sonatas and kias built in Alabama have a 125k warranty on the engine due to debris in the engine during assembly.

 

[wemay]

JustinH, the displeasure with your Hyundai comes across loud and clear. Why not sell?

Our Hyundai's have been solid, reliable, excellent vehicles. Never had any issues with them. So one had slight pinging, meh...

Our Santa Fe Sport 2.0T is right at 100k miles.

 

[Ducked]

Originally Posted By: Nick1994
Would a borescope down the spark plug holes tell me anything? I think my dad has one


Of course.

It'd tell you if you have deposit buildup in the cylinders (mostly on top of the pistons).

If you have it'll allow you to monitor the effectiveness of cleanup eforts like piston soaks.

As I said I would start with distilled water.

I have a tube rigged which sucks water into the air intake at high revs, which create a vacuum in the air cleaner housing.

I don't, however, have a borescope, so I can't directly check effectiveness, but its stopped running-on after switch-off after only using about 300ml. I'll need to distill some more before I continue treatment.

You might also be able to use the borescope to check the state of your intake tract, esp the valves, though I'd think that's less likely to be contributing to your problem.

 

[Nick1994]

It doesn't bother me that much, I was just wondering if there were some solutions. I might do spark plugs this weekend.

I filled it up tonight with Costco 91 octane. The pinging is gone.

 

[wemay]

 

[das_peikko]

Originally Posted By: Nick1994
I filled it up tonight with Costco 91 octane. The pinging is gone.


Good move. Cheaper than buying a new engine.

 

[Eddie]

In addition: I would purchase a bottle of TECHRON FUEL SYSTEM CLEANER and follow the instructions. This has been effective in helping this type of problem. Ed

 

[BAJA_05]

As recommended earlier -- change the plugs and see if that eliminates the pinging. If not -- USE HIGHER OCTANE!!!


Dale

 

[B320i]

Look, I've discussed in the past what I think is either an issue with current fuel blends and/or modern vehicles. There is no reason for quite a number of late-model vehicles to be clattering away the way they do. This extends particularly to vehicles like Corollas & Camrys that still use multipoint fuel injection and have been made for 30+ years being designed to run on regular-grade petrol.

My suspicion is the fuel in the city I live is different to the fuel I used to buy in a remote, very hot (and arid) area. I recall on one trip to the city, the car was fine with no pinging, then I filled up with Caltex 98RON (same as what I bought in the remote area) and there was pinging. Once I left the city and was refuelling in regional centres, it stopped.
A further suspicion of mine is that the fuel that is supposedly high-octane is not. Several times I have filled up with supposed "98RON," only to hear my car begin to carry on as though I've filled it with 95RON, or even 91RON!

I understand the knock sensors can and do deteriorate, and don't necessarily trigger a CEL from the ECU. But when I'm seeing a majority of late-model vehicles ping, it begs the question about both the fuels we are being sold, and the OE's recommendations.
In the case of my car, at 24 years of age, sensors are much more likely to be the culprit, although I am quite perplexed about the observations noted above.

 

[wemay]

Some truth to that. My 2017 Corolla (PFI) pinged as well.