Can I use 0w40?

[CharBaby]

Car is not modified. I am 70 and need it to last as long as I can drive.

Any oil such as a 5W30 conventional or synthetic(based on price) oil from Walmart will do what you want. OR a 10W30 or 10W40!
If you can find a 0W40 at a good price than indeed use/buy it. But, you're most likely going to pay a higher price for a full synthetic 0W40 and there are NO conventional 0W oils.

 

[kschachn]

Saying that someone should only move one grade at a time and "take it easy" is indeed nonsense. But equally nonsensical is that a 40-grade gives better fuel economy than a lower grade, that defies physics. Besides you could never, ever attribute a small fuel economy difference to one variable in everyday driving. We've discussed that before on here, such a change is deep in the noise. Observing something is the easy part, ascribing it to one isolated variable is entirely another problem that's far more difficult.

 

[OilUzer]

Saying that someone should only move one grade at a time and "take it easy" is indeed nonsense. But equally nonsensical is that a 40-grade gives better fuel economy than a lower grade, that defies physics. Besides you could never, ever attribute a small fuel economy difference to one variable in everyday driving. We've discussed that before on here, such a change is deep in the noise. Observing something is the easy part, ascribing it to one isolated variable is entirely another problem that's far more difficult.

Since you are a spec guy, his car specs 5W30 and he wanted to jump to a3/b4 0W40.

by take it easy, I meant to try more of an incremental change to feel and test and observe ... and then decide. For example try a3/b4 xW30 or xW40 before jumping to a3/b4 xW40.
basically incremental hths changes.

Some people go up a grade or two and report sluggishness and bad fuel economy. It was just an advice based on my experience. For example I jumped from speced 0W20 to 10W30. Considering a3/b4 xW30 next but haven't pull the trigger yet. incremental hths changes ... Doing it one step at a time.

 

[dblshock]

0/40 is the new 5/30.

 

[OilUzer]

0/40 is the new 5/30.

I've noticed that and its kind of fashionable to use 0W40. lol

I'm not afraid of the 40 and I like 0W oils due to their superior base oil ... However, I wonder about the amount of vii required to achieve the spread. Same with 0W30 but not as bad. Was about to use it in one car but opted for 10W30 instead.

 

[joemo]

Most 10w40 have more vii than 0w40 a3b4.

 

[edyvw]

I've noticed that and its kind of fashionable to use 0W40. lol

I'm not afraid of the 40 and I like 0W oils due to their superior base oil ... However, I wonder about the amount of vii required to achieve the spread. Same with 0W30 but not as bad. Was about to use it in one car but opted for 10W30 instead.

It is not fashion. Any 0W40 coming from Mobil1, Castrol, Pennzoil is better than any 10W30. It is targeted for extremely demanding vehicles, unlike 10W30. Find 10W30 that has approvals like those oils?

 

[Oildudeny]

I'd use it if it's in my stash... but switch back to 5w30.. As mentioned you'll probably see a slight decrease in fuel economy

 

[kschachn]

Most 10w40 have more vii than 0w40 a3b4.

But on the other hand not all VII are the same. Some are more stable than others.

 

[Deleted member 89374]

Never said don't use 0W40. He lives in MO (that's not Montana btw) and I said why not 10W? It meets the state W rating and has less vii (vm).

My thinking was that 10W-40 has a cSt@40C of around 100, while 0W-40 has a cSt@40C of around 70. As for VII, that depends on oil by oil basis, so for example Castrol EDGE 0W-40 might have a hairless VII when compared to Mobil 1 FS 0W-40.

Saving a few bucks is not that big of a priority when the OP's main goal is to make his vehicle last. However, that is irrelevant here, because 10W-40 at Walmart is more expensive than any 0W-40 motor oil they sell: https://www.walmart.com/ip/Castrol-GTX-10W-40-Conventional-Motor-Oil-5-Quarts/17175670

Well, for the most part. Still, this is around $17, so not huge savings over the $22.38 for any 0W-40: https://www.walmart.com/ip/Castrol-...0-Synthetic-Blend-Motor-Oil-5-Quarts/34039138

While you research vii, can you please explain the "design flaws" of other oils (other than 0W40)? I am interested in for example "design flaws" of xW30 or a3/b4 xW30 ...

I didn't say that the other oils have any design flaws. If I had better and newer motors I would happily use other motor oils. Though, from the looks of it, motor oils are getting closer and closer in specifications. For example, I think that no matter how much I try to protect my 2.4 GDI motor in my Hyundai, the motor will not overcome its shortcomings and design flaws. There is a reason why you don't see many of these motors past the 200K mark on the road today, let alone any that reached 300K. At least I'm trying, right?

Also you get the same or "slightly better" fuel economy with thicker 40 oil? Since we are talking about nonsense

, can you explain that as well?

Again, I was thinking of my 2.4 GDI motor. In the 2017 Santa Fe 3.3L V6 I don't see better or worse fuel economy. As soon as you demand any kind of power from that engine, it will pig out on gasoline and guzzle it like a pickup truck. The same goes for the RAM 1500, fuel economy is the same as with 5W-20. To be fair, I also dumped 15 oz. of Lubegard Bio/Tech in the 2.4GDI motor. And I baby it and drive it softly. If I put my foot in it that good fuel economy goes away. The engine might have less blowby and slightly better compression with the 0W-40, so that might help. Realistically, a 1% up or down fuel economy is hard to notice. There are also slight variations in gasoline quality depending on where you get it and when, so the placebo effect is powerful with this one At least I sleep better at night knowing that I did my best to take care of my vehicle

0/40 is the new 5/30.

@OilUzer this is pretty much it. I wanted something around a thick 5W-30 for all my vehicles giving my climate and vehicle usage patterns and the engineering and manufacturing quality that went into my vehicles.

 

[madeej11]

But on the other hand not all VII are the same. Some are more stable than others.

This is probably one reason why we pay more for some boutique oils.

 

[OilUzer]

@YogiTheCat
I used to use 10W40 dino and still have some in the garage. I may try a 0W40 in one old car and see how it does. This car has seen its share of "plastics" over the years

Btw, if you are comparing cSt, it would be better to compare the KV100 (as opposed to 40C) as the oil spends most of its time in this zone.

My thinking was that 10W-40 has a cSt@40C of around 100, while 0W-40 has a cSt@40C of around 70.

 

[Deleted member 89374]

@YogiTheCat
I used to use 10W40 dino and still have some in the garage. I may try a 0W40 in one old car and see how it does. This car has seen its share of "plastics" over the years

Btw, if you are comparing cSt, it would be better to compare the KV100 (as opposed to 40C) as the oil spends most of its time in this zone.

I completely agree with you on the KV100. My thinking was engine startup, especially when it's cold outside. You know, the one thing that I'm wondering about is what are the downsides of using 0W-40 motor oil in my vehicles, especially in the RAM 1500. Don't get me wrong, it runs great. On Friday I checked out two new RAM 1500 trucks, one with E-Torque and one without. The 5.7 HEMI with E-Torque started up really nicely and sounded great. No weird noises, no injector noises, nothing, just smooth as butter. I said to myself that this is a motor that I would not run out of spec oil in. Then I checked out a Big Horn with a 5.7 HEMI, no E-Torque. I used the remote start on the keyfob and sure enough, it ticked like hell when it started. I was like "yep, this is the HEMI tick". It went away after a few seconds. This is a 2020 truck mind you with 125 miles on the odometer. I asked the sales guy about the tick, and he said that because it's been sitting for a while, it's normal. I told him my 2016 never made that tick on startup. In 4 years my 2016 RAM 1500 accumulated an astonishing 25000 miles, so it isn't driven a lot. Sometimes it sits for weeks, still, no tick. The injectors are loud, but that's another story. Anyway, I was told that as the oil goes back into the pan, over time, the top part of the engine is dry, so this is normal, "they all do it". Well, the problem with that statement is that it had 125 miles on it, and from the way it was parked it was recently driven. Not very confidence inspiring for a $44,000 truck. I just looked out of curiosity and to listen to these newer HEMIs. Apparently, nothing has changed, except maybe for E-Torque on some trucks. Sorry for the slight derail

 

[OVERKILL]

I completely agree with you on the KV100. My thinking was engine startup, especially when it's cold outside. You know, the one thing that I'm wondering about is what are the downsides of using 0W-40 motor oil in my vehicles, especially in the RAM 1500. Don't get me wrong, it runs great. On Friday I checked out two new RAM 1500 trucks, one with E-Torque and one without. The 5.7 HEMI with E-Torque started up really nicely and sounded great. No weird noises, no injector noises, nothing, just smooth as butter. I said to myself that this is a motor that I would not run out of spec oil in. Then I checked out a Big Horn with a 5.7 HEMI, no E-Torque. I used the remote start on the keyfob and sure enough, it ticked like hell when it started. I was like "yep, this is the HEMI tick". It went away after a few seconds. This is a 2020 truck mind you with 125 miles on the odometer. I asked the sales guy about the tick, and he said that because it's been sitting for a while, it's normal. I told him my 2016 never made that tick on startup. In 4 years my 2016 RAM 1500 accumulated an astonishing 25000 miles, so it isn't driven a lot. Sometimes it sits for weeks, still, no tick. The injectors are loud, but that's another story. Anyway, I was told that as the oil goes back into the pan, over time, the top part of the engine is dry, so this is normal, "they all do it". Well, the problem with that statement is that it had 125 miles on it, and from the way it was parked it was recently driven. Not very confidence inspiring for a $44,000 truck. I just looked out of curiosity and to listen to these newer HEMIs. Apparently, nothing has changed, except maybe for E-Torque on some trucks. Sorry for the slight derail

E-torque and non e-torque, the engine is the same. The one that made noise could have been started, driven 4 feet and parked, so had some fuel wash. The e-torque one could have been driven a few hours earlier. Start-up noise is not a barometer for engine longevity. No part of an engine gets dry when it sits, there's always an oil film, albeit, probably a pretty thin one in areas. I've had engines sit for years and you crack a valve cover and there's still oil on the surfaces of the heads. As long as they aren't left exposed to the elements you'd be surprised as to how long that film persists.

Depending on the position of cam lobes and lifters, some may bleed down and make a bit of noise before receiving pressure to pump up. VCT solenoids/actuators can also cause a racket. A defective ADV on some engine designs can be enough to cause significant noise from hydraulic components on a cold start as significant bleed-down has occurred.

When the lifter(s) crapped the bed on our one work truck, it wasn't ticking. The noise that the failure made is a "chirp" sound, there was no tick present.

Cold viscosity should only be a concern when you are using an oil with a winter rating inappropriate for the temperatures encountered. A "Cold Start" in North Carolina has a vastly different meaning from the same term in northern Ontario.

 

[OilUzer]

@YogiTheCat
Curious what is e-torque and how does it impact the engine design? isn't that a transmission thing?

I've read some hemi guys like Red Line and it reduces or eliminates the tick. Have you had any experience with high moly oils in your old trucks?

Edit:
I see that OVERKILL explained the e-torque. Btw, my co-worker and I had the same year Tundra and were both using the same oil (0W20). Mine still had the factory oil and his was changed by dealer once. I don't have a history before his oil change but his truck sounded like a diesel compared to mine. Not sure if the oil (factory oil has more moly?) has anything to do with it or just a different car but the ticking noise was definitely more on his car.

 

[OVERKILL]

@YogiTheCat
Curious what is e-torque and how does it impact the engine design? isn't that a transmission thing?

I've read some hemi guys like Red Line and it reduces or eliminates the tick. Have you had any experience with high moly oils in your old trucks?

E-torque is a small electric assist that's supposed to reduce the fuel consumption of starting and stopping. Probably the only thing that plays into the engine is the stop/start function.

A nice synopsis here:

2019 Ram 1500 eTorque system: What it is and how it works

Ram's eTorque provides an extra push before gas engine can, then backs away when the time is right

www.autoweek.com

 

[Surestick]

Saying that someone should only move one grade at a time and "take it easy" is indeed nonsense. But equally nonsensical is that a 40-grade gives better fuel economy than a lower grade, that defies physics. Besides you could never, ever attribute a small fuel economy difference to one variable in everyday driving. We've discussed that before on here, such a change is deep in the noise. Observing something is the easy part, ascribing it to one isolated variable is entirely another problem that's far more difficult.

This is probably pedantic but...
Going from a 10w30 to a 0w40, if you're doing a lot of short trips, especially in the winter, could improve fuel economy.
Of course, so would a 0w30...

 

[Deleted member 89374]

Curious what is e-torque and how does it impact the engine design? isn't that a transmission thing?

E-Torque is a system comprised of a 48 smart battery and an alternator that can also provide upwards of 130 FT-LBS of torque when needed. The guys in this short video explain it way better than I can:

This is probably pedantic but...
Going from a 10w30 to a 0w40, if you're doing a lot of short trips, especially in the winter, could improve fuel economy.
Of course, so would a 0w30...

Too bad there aren't a lot of 0W-30 oils to pick from, unless money is no object of course. M1 AFE 0W-30 is probably the cheapest option and easiest to find. Good call!

 

[kschachn]

This is probably pedantic but...
Going from a 10w30 to a 0w40, if you're doing a lot of short trips, especially in the winter, could improve fuel economy.
Of course, so would a 0w30...

Only if the majority of your operation does not allow the oil to ever warm up. And then only if the temperature is cold, no change in the summer.

 

[partspro]

Nope!

A good Euro 0w40 will meet a host of tough specs a run of the mill 5w30 couldn't possibly touch. Not that you need it, but why not run the better oil? Isn't that what half the discussions here are about anyway?

remember those specs are for 'new engine' is a worn engine at 200,000 loose in the mains, rods rings etc sure. the so called heavier, becomes just right.