Originally Posted By: tommygunn
Recent developments are for these "all weather" tires, of which the best known example is probably the Nokian WRG2 (and now the WRG3)
But of course there are others that cost much less, such as
Vredesetain Quatrac 3
Kumho Solus Vier
Falken EuroAll
Are these just performance winter tires in Europe being marketed as all-weather over here? I ask because I know that in some countries like Germany, they are really strict about this stuff, so how could a tire be approved for year-round use? Doesn't most of Europe frown on all-seasons, or is that stigma disappearing?
The all-weather tires do have UTQG ratings, though.
Since they also have the severe snow approval to be used as winter tires, is it OK to use a lower-than-original speed rating outside the winter season? I emailed Vredestein about this, and they said it's OK because it has the severe snow symbol (so the tire shops can treat it as a snow tire)
The first two (Vredestein and Kumho) are sold in Germany under these names, there is also a Falken all season tire that is sold as "Euro all season".
These are marketed as all season tires. German winter tire regulation actually is quite lax, it just states that when driving under winter road conditions (snow, slush, ice...) your vehicle has to be equipped with appropriate tires, that is with winter tires. Winter tires are defined as M+S. The snow flake has no legal implication in Germany, although media and consumer advice centers constantly warn that the M+S sign alone does not make a usable winter tire, and consumers are constantly told to look for both M+S and the snow flake.
So yes, an all-season tire marked M+S does qualify as a winter tire in Germany. Until just some years ago, the market was divided: people in the Rhine and Ruhr area, used to very mild winters and nearly no snow, would buy all seasons. The same applied to big cities in northern germany, even Berlin (tempertures in cities usually are several degrees higher than the surrounding countryside). There, winters usually tend to be rather nasty, but mostly wet. (In northeastern Germany, snow is uncommon, but if it happens to snow, it snows A LOT.) In southern Germany and in mountaineous middle Germany, people would expect harsher winters and snwo and thus buy winter tires.
This would work fine, except for the few days when even the northern cities and Rhine/Ruhr got winter conditions, then all held would break loose. The last few years, weather has changed a bit, and has brought extreme cold and lots of snow also to typical "wet winter" areas, with the corresponding chaos. (The last winter was rather mild, with the exception of some weeks - but on these weeks, you had real winter).
So perceived harsher winters have driven people mor towards dedicated winter tires. On the other hand, all seasons have greatly improved during the last years. All seasons tended to be [censored] in Winter and [censored] in summer, now we see the first all seasons take part in winter tire tests and managing to keep up with winzer tires at least traction- and braking-wise. (Keep in mind I talk of what you would call "performance winters" - central european winter tires have harder compound and less aggrressive thread than scandinavian tires. During most winter days, roads are cleared and either dry or wet, "white" roads are the exception in middle europe.) Still, these more winter-oriented tires of course cannot keep up with summer tires regarding handling, cornering speeds and braking on dry tarmac.
OSo on one hand, we have more demand for winter tires, on the other hand, all-seasons have gotten more "wintery". I have driven Goodyear Vector AS and Pirelli Cinturato AS on rental cars, even on light snow and slush, and they worked ok-ish. Not good, but manageable. On dry tarmac, especially the Goodyear became annoyingly loud and felt nearly as squishy as a winter tire.
With tire pressure sensors now being mandatory on any new car in the european union (thus inducing additional cost when buying a second set of wheels), I expect the market share for all seasons to grow.
From my own personal experience, I am a strong advocate of dedicated summer and winter tires. Just let it snow in the Ruhr area or Berlin and watch: complete chaos erupts. Traffic comes to a standstill. Why? because everybody is sliding (or feels he might be sliding if he just went a tad faster.) I once had an experience in Berlin: I drove into town on my Michelin Alpin-eqipped Saab and did not find a single problem, even with unplowed side roads. Then I parked the car and walked towards my destination, when I encountered a girl that had problems getting her stuck econobox moving (she could not get out of her parking space). So I pushed her on the road (luckily, both girl and car were rather light) and she insisted on giving me a ride (no, not what you think! You dirty old men!). That was quite frightening. We drove exactly the same way I had just driven with my Saab, only in the opposite direction, we would drive at walking pace, and she would brake 10-15 meters before the corner and the little fiat would just slide and slide forever... She had all seasons (with lots of thread left). Very scary indeed!
On the other hand, I myself have just bought all seasons. The above mentioned Vredestein Quatrac 3. The reasoning is as follows: when I bought the car, it had quatrac 3 on one axle and Uniroyal rain expert (belgian Uniroyal, belonging to Continental) on the other, the Q3 being younger and sporting full thread depth. The car is intended as a fair weather toy, and, being a classic, is driven gently. But I intend to take part in this years Intsaab (international Saab meeting, to be held in a different european country every year), which is to be held in Norway, and will also take some trips to the alps or top northern Italy (which means crossing the Alps). Both in the Norwegian mountains or on th emore scenic routes of the Alps I might be surprised by bad weather, even if there is "summer" at the start of the journey. I figured all seasons, while not adequate winter tires, would still be much better than summer tires in such a situation. On the other hand, as the car is NOT intended to be driven in winter conditions, winter tires "just in case" would also be inapropriate (and winter tires DO have serious handling and braking drawbacks on dry roads).
So I figured I look for an all season tire that is biased more towards summer, and according to most german and austrian test, the Vredestein has the best summer and one of the worst winter performances of the tested all seasons.
I have just driven approx 1500km. The Vredestein Quatrac 3 handle surprisingly well on dry road (at medium temperatures, no "summer temperatures yet), much better than a winter tire. I obviously have not had the chance to test them on snow or ice (and I'd not like to have to.) They are rather noisy at 120 km/h and they are not the most comfortable tires, they ride bit firm.
On my daily driver, I still have dedicated winter and summer tires, for a reason.
