My uncle just told me he picked up a mint 02 highlander with 43,000 miles on it. I was looking around online and it seems as if it falls into the sludger catagory? Is that the case? If so what oil do you folks think would be best for a known sludge engine? I was thinking either PU or maybe even amsoil?
02 Toyota highlander V6 a sludger? What oil to use
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Any brand name syn with 5k/6mo OCI will be good. But you may want to try PU for couple short OCI's of 3k to clean up any junk in there now.
PP 5W30 to start, change the PCV valve and then maybe PU.
In a 2001 Lexus RX300 I started with PP and 16 0z MMO. Next OCI I am thinking PU will be great choice. It has about 36,000 miles with a steady dealership diet of Pennzoil bulk oil. Using a Mobil 1 M-209 filter. Seems to be working fine. Easier to change than the smaller OEM filter.
Is the engine sludged up or has it been properly maintained?
I'm not that familiar with this engine. But have any of Toyota's engines ever really been sludgers as long as the owner followed the *proper* maintenance schedule? Owners running severe service who were following the normal service, 7500 mile, maintenance schedule and using conventional oils got themselves into trouble a while back. Of course, it all ended up in Toyota's lap.
Any SM/GL4 oil you like of the recommended viscosity changed at 5,000 mile intervals should be fine. I prefer synthetics. And with those you should be able to do 7,500 miles or more.
Mobil 1, and Penzoils Platinum and Ultra are good. But then so is Walmart's SUpertech synthetic.
Any SM/GL4 oil you like of the recommended viscosity changed at 5,000 mile intervals should be fine. I prefer synthetics. And with those you should be able to do 7,500 miles or more.
Mobil 1, and Penzoils Platinum and Ultra are good. But then so is Walmart's SUpertech synthetic.
Make extra sure that there is flow through the PCV line and don't push the Oil Change Interval.
In 2003, on the 1MZFE motor, they went to a different PCV valve....all metal that screws into the rear valve cover.
They also improved the baffel in the rear valve cover to reduce buildup between the baffel and the top of the valve cover.....which could block airflow TO the PCV valve.
A lack of flow through the PCV valve will give you "gelling" or sludge in short order.
The PCV valve is mounted in the rear valve cover......passenger side.....kind of hard to see, it is behind a vaccum actuator on the upper intake manifold.
I listed a few larger filters a while back.....the same filter that was used on my '96 3.8L windstar is a direct fit.....slightly longer
but the same bypass valve pressure and identical gasket and threads.
I am using the WIX on my 2003 Sienna with the 1MZFE, plenty of room for it.
WIX 51516
Fram XG3600
Purolator PL20195
Mobil 1 M1-209
K&N HP-2009
In 2003, on the 1MZFE motor, they went to a different PCV valve....all metal that screws into the rear valve cover.
They also improved the baffel in the rear valve cover to reduce buildup between the baffel and the top of the valve cover.....which could block airflow TO the PCV valve.
A lack of flow through the PCV valve will give you "gelling" or sludge in short order.
The PCV valve is mounted in the rear valve cover......passenger side.....kind of hard to see, it is behind a vaccum actuator on the upper intake manifold.
I listed a few larger filters a while back.....the same filter that was used on my '96 3.8L windstar is a direct fit.....slightly longer
but the same bypass valve pressure and identical gasket and threads.
I am using the WIX on my 2003 Sienna with the 1MZFE, plenty of room for it.
WIX 51516
Fram XG3600
Purolator PL20195
Mobil 1 M1-209
K&N HP-2009
Have a buddy that bought one new. 4 oil changes in 21,000 miles and it was so sludged you hardly could see a rocker arm.We pulled valve cover.OMG! Smoked on start up was the clue.Toyota gave him a bad run around.This is BEFORE they knew that they had a issue.Blamed it all on him and denied warranty.He took it to another Toyota dealer and traded it on a truck.Cost him a chunk plus time and aggravation.Bet after he traded it it got fixed under warranty.
My daughter han a new 99 Lexus RX300 and I changed the oil for her every 10K with M1 10-30. She sold it when it had 90K and there didn't seem to have any problems. Her friend that bought it kept using M1 and as far as I know she still has it.
Our 2000 1MZFE does well on Valvoline MaxLife; it's got a good add pack and the price is right...
+1 to changing the PCV valve regularly; some will say to clean it, but it's a $4 replacement part not worth the bother of soaking it in brake cleaner, IMHO.
+1 to changing the PCV valve regularly; some will say to clean it, but it's a $4 replacement part not worth the bother of soaking it in brake cleaner, IMHO.
Originally Posted By: hounddog
Have a buddy that bought one new. 4 oil changes in 21,000 miles and it was so sludged you hardly could see a rocker arm.We pulled valve cover.OMG! Smoked on start up was the clue.Toyota gave him a bad run around.This is BEFORE they knew that they had a issue.Blamed it all on him and denied warranty.He took it to another Toyota dealer and traded it on a truck.Cost him a chunk plus time and aggravation.Bet after he traded it it got fixed under warranty.
Flag thrown on this one. The MZ series is a DOHC (as in DOUBLE OVERHEAD CAM) engine. It has no rocker arms (and yes, I've seen one of mine with the cover off...). I've owned two 1MZ powered vehicles, a 2001 Highlander and a 2003.5 V-6 Camry. I did oil changes at 5k intervals, and surprise, surprise, no smoke, sludge or any other sign of malfunction.
Have a buddy that bought one new. 4 oil changes in 21,000 miles and it was so sludged you hardly could see a rocker arm.We pulled valve cover.OMG! Smoked on start up was the clue.Toyota gave him a bad run around.This is BEFORE they knew that they had a issue.Blamed it all on him and denied warranty.He took it to another Toyota dealer and traded it on a truck.Cost him a chunk plus time and aggravation.Bet after he traded it it got fixed under warranty.
Flag thrown on this one. The MZ series is a DOHC (as in DOUBLE OVERHEAD CAM) engine. It has no rocker arms (and yes, I've seen one of mine with the cover off...). I've owned two 1MZ powered vehicles, a 2001 Highlander and a 2003.5 V-6 Camry. I did oil changes at 5k intervals, and surprise, surprise, no smoke, sludge or any other sign of malfunction.
He had proof of oil changes.It was a mess.Valve springs and what not were buried in goo.It had built a dome in the valve cover.Under 25k on the odometer.The Toyota truck he got his wife he hated.It used oil,got poor fuel mileage.He traded it in on a new 03 Dodge SLT 2500 Quad cab 2wd auto etc.His wife and he loved it.Bright red.Wasn't that much more then the Toyota truck but was a LOT more truck with a LOT better fuel mileage.It wasn't until a couple years went by that the KNOWN sludge issues on that Toyota was made.You couldn't give him a Toyota to this day
Originally Posted By: hounddog
He had proof of oil changes.It was a mess.Valve springs and what not were buried in goo.It had built a dome in the valve cover.Under 25k on the odometer.The Toyota truck he got his wife he hated.It used oil,got poor fuel mileage.He traded it in on a new 03 Dodge SLT 2500 Quad cab 2wd auto etc.His wife and he loved it.Bright red.Wasn't that much more then the Toyota truck but was a LOT more truck with a LOT better fuel mileage.It wasn't until a couple years went by that the KNOWN sludge issues on that Toyota was made.You couldn't give him a Toyota to this day
Let's try and stay factual here. The FACT is that Toyota had two engines during the late 90 - early 00s that could be prone to sludge, and usually when inadequately maintained. Toyota's biggest mistake, IMO, in responding to the problem (engine changes eliminated the issue in 2002) was in trying to distinguish who had timely changed oil, and who had not. Later, they essentially stopped doing this.
Another fact: I put way more miles on my 01 Highlander than your friend put on his, I changed my oil, with 5k OCIs even, and had no hint of sludge at all, not even varnish. None. Perhaps your friend was not so careful about his maintenance after all...
Look, the original question was:
Quote:
My uncle just told me he picked up a mint 02 highlander with 43,000 miles on it. I was looking around online and it seems as if it falls into the sludger catagory? Is that the case? If so what oil do you folks think would be best for a known sludge engine? I was thinking either PU or maybe even amsoil?
Your "I hate Toyota" rant offered the OP nothing (perhaps before throwing any more stones around this glass house, you should check out THIS THREAD ) . He already has the vehicle and is asking for an oil rec. Please either address the OP's question, or move on.
Back to the question at hand. If this is an 02 vehicle, he's probably got one that was made after the corrections (so the whole rant is irrelevant...). Nevertheless, to be perfectly safe, and for peace of mind, I'd stay with a synthetic.
He had proof of oil changes.It was a mess.Valve springs and what not were buried in goo.It had built a dome in the valve cover.Under 25k on the odometer.The Toyota truck he got his wife he hated.It used oil,got poor fuel mileage.He traded it in on a new 03 Dodge SLT 2500 Quad cab 2wd auto etc.His wife and he loved it.Bright red.Wasn't that much more then the Toyota truck but was a LOT more truck with a LOT better fuel mileage.It wasn't until a couple years went by that the KNOWN sludge issues on that Toyota was made.You couldn't give him a Toyota to this day
Let's try and stay factual here. The FACT is that Toyota had two engines during the late 90 - early 00s that could be prone to sludge, and usually when inadequately maintained. Toyota's biggest mistake, IMO, in responding to the problem (engine changes eliminated the issue in 2002) was in trying to distinguish who had timely changed oil, and who had not. Later, they essentially stopped doing this.
Another fact: I put way more miles on my 01 Highlander than your friend put on his, I changed my oil, with 5k OCIs even, and had no hint of sludge at all, not even varnish. None. Perhaps your friend was not so careful about his maintenance after all...
Look, the original question was:
Quote:
My uncle just told me he picked up a mint 02 highlander with 43,000 miles on it. I was looking around online and it seems as if it falls into the sludger catagory? Is that the case? If so what oil do you folks think would be best for a known sludge engine? I was thinking either PU or maybe even amsoil?
Your "I hate Toyota" rant offered the OP nothing (perhaps before throwing any more stones around this glass house, you should check out THIS THREAD ) . He already has the vehicle and is asking for an oil rec. Please either address the OP's question, or move on.
Back to the question at hand. If this is an 02 vehicle, he's probably got one that was made after the corrections (so the whole rant is irrelevant...). Nevertheless, to be perfectly safe, and for peace of mind, I'd stay with a synthetic.
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Originally Posted By: hounddog
Have a buddy that bought one new. 4 oil changes in 21,000 miles and it was so sludged you hardly could see a rocker arm.We pulled valve cover.OMG! Smoked on start up was the clue.Toyota gave him a bad run around.This is BEFORE they knew that they had a issue.Blamed it all on him and denied warranty.He took it to another Toyota dealer and traded it on a truck.Cost him a chunk plus time and aggravation.Bet after he traded it it got fixed under warranty.
did it look like this?
this is a 3.4L out of a 4-runner and it wasn't even on the sludge list!
Have a buddy that bought one new. 4 oil changes in 21,000 miles and it was so sludged you hardly could see a rocker arm.We pulled valve cover.OMG! Smoked on start up was the clue.Toyota gave him a bad run around.This is BEFORE they knew that they had a issue.Blamed it all on him and denied warranty.He took it to another Toyota dealer and traded it on a truck.Cost him a chunk plus time and aggravation.Bet after he traded it it got fixed under warranty.
did it look like this?
this is a 3.4L out of a 4-runner and it wasn't even on the sludge list!
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Originally Posted By: caravanmike
...
this is a 3.4L out of a 4-runner and it wasn't even on the sludge list!
Since it's not a 1MZ (not even from the MZ family), how is this picture helpful?
Any engine at all, from any car maker, WILL sludge up eventually if it is mistreated and improperly maintained. Any engine. Let's not be pretending otherwise.
I do suppose that the picture is helpful in one way. This engine is also a similar DOHC design, in which there are NO rocker arms at all, and the valve springs are totally concealed from view under the lifter buckets (that is, you CAN'T see them at all without removing the buckets). Makes this look more and more like a hatchet (well, attempted) job...
...
this is a 3.4L out of a 4-runner and it wasn't even on the sludge list!
Since it's not a 1MZ (not even from the MZ family), how is this picture helpful?
Any engine at all, from any car maker, WILL sludge up eventually if it is mistreated and improperly maintained. Any engine. Let's not be pretending otherwise.
I do suppose that the picture is helpful in one way. This engine is also a similar DOHC design, in which there are NO rocker arms at all, and the valve springs are totally concealed from view under the lifter buckets (that is, you CAN'T see them at all without removing the buckets). Makes this look more and more like a hatchet (well, attempted) job...
Originally Posted By: ekpolk
how is this picture helpful?
you answered your own question below!
Originally Posted By: ekpolk
Any engine at all, from any car maker, WILL sludge up eventually if it is mistreated and improperly maintained.
the op's 1mz engine may/may not have sludge in it! if it does it is probably from lack of maintenance. but some manufactures do have engines that are gross offenders. i don't believe the 1mz was on that list! but it doesn't hurt to be on guard, and inspect the vehicle so you know what you have. Mike
how is this picture helpful?
you answered your own question below!
Originally Posted By: ekpolk
Any engine at all, from any car maker, WILL sludge up eventually if it is mistreated and improperly maintained.
the op's 1mz engine may/may not have sludge in it! if it does it is probably from lack of maintenance. but some manufactures do have engines that are gross offenders. i don't believe the 1mz was on that list! but it doesn't hurt to be on guard, and inspect the vehicle so you know what you have. Mike
Originally Posted By: caravanmike
Originally Posted By: ekpolk
how is this picture helpful?
you answered your own question below!
No, I didn't. Tossing up a picture of a sludged VZ-series engine in a discussion concerning the MZ series engines is no more pertinent or relevant than using a picture of a sludged Ford Windsor V-8 to stand for the proposition that the Ford modular is sludge-prone. Different engines, different designs, different outcomes. Very simple when you think about it.
Originally Posted By: caravanmike
Originally Posted By: ekpolk
Any engine at all, from any car maker, WILL sludge up eventually if it is mistreated and improperly maintained.
the op's 1mz engine may/may not have sludge in it! if it does it is probably from lack of maintenance. but some manufactures do have engines that are gross offenders. i don't believe the 1mz was on that list! but it doesn't hurt to be on guard, and inspect the vehicle so you know what you have. Mike
Yes sir, the the two engines involved in the Toyota "sludge debacle" were the 1MZ-FE V-6 and the 5S-FE I-4. Toyota cured the problem with the 5S-FE by terminating it and replacing it with the xAZ series I-4 engines (I'm sure that this was not their sole motive...). As for the V-6 engines (the 1MZs), there were updates to both the PCV system and the oil passages. With these changes, the xMZ series fought on, sludge-free, up to the present, wherein the 3.3L 3MZ-FXE lives on in the Highlander Hybrid (though it has been replaced in all other NA applications -- I don't know if Toyota is still using the xMZ series elsewhere in the world). Anyway, apart from the need for special attention to certain mid-series xMZ engines, and their annoying need for timing belts, the MZs are good engines.
With attentive care, even these "sludgemakers" will live a long and clean life. The OP has nothing to fear so long as he is willing to pay some attention to his car and its engine.
Originally Posted By: ekpolk
how is this picture helpful?
you answered your own question below!
No, I didn't. Tossing up a picture of a sludged VZ-series engine in a discussion concerning the MZ series engines is no more pertinent or relevant than using a picture of a sludged Ford Windsor V-8 to stand for the proposition that the Ford modular is sludge-prone. Different engines, different designs, different outcomes. Very simple when you think about it.
Originally Posted By: caravanmike
Originally Posted By: ekpolk
Any engine at all, from any car maker, WILL sludge up eventually if it is mistreated and improperly maintained.
the op's 1mz engine may/may not have sludge in it! if it does it is probably from lack of maintenance. but some manufactures do have engines that are gross offenders. i don't believe the 1mz was on that list! but it doesn't hurt to be on guard, and inspect the vehicle so you know what you have. Mike
Yes sir, the the two engines involved in the Toyota "sludge debacle" were the 1MZ-FE V-6 and the 5S-FE I-4. Toyota cured the problem with the 5S-FE by terminating it and replacing it with the xAZ series I-4 engines (I'm sure that this was not their sole motive...). As for the V-6 engines (the 1MZs), there were updates to both the PCV system and the oil passages. With these changes, the xMZ series fought on, sludge-free, up to the present, wherein the 3.3L 3MZ-FXE lives on in the Highlander Hybrid (though it has been replaced in all other NA applications -- I don't know if Toyota is still using the xMZ series elsewhere in the world). Anyway, apart from the need for special attention to certain mid-series xMZ engines, and their annoying need for timing belts, the MZs are good engines.
With attentive care, even these "sludgemakers" will live a long and clean life. The OP has nothing to fear so long as he is willing to pay some attention to his car and its engine.
Originally Posted By: ProStreetCamaro
My uncle just told me he picked up a mint 02 highlander with 43,000 miles on it. I was looking around online and it seems as if it falls into the sludger catagory? Is that the case? If so what oil do you folks think would be best for a known sludge engine? I was thinking either PU or maybe even amsoil?
Don't know about your choices, my sludger has 130k with 5k OCI using Castrol Syntec 0w30. (GC) Frequent PCV valve changes and also for oil changing, do let the oil drain a long time. Maybe it's me but I can get four to six ounces out of there by letting it drain for an hour or longer.
Good luck.
My uncle just told me he picked up a mint 02 highlander with 43,000 miles on it. I was looking around online and it seems as if it falls into the sludger catagory? Is that the case? If so what oil do you folks think would be best for a known sludge engine? I was thinking either PU or maybe even amsoil?
Don't know about your choices, my sludger has 130k with 5k OCI using Castrol Syntec 0w30. (GC) Frequent PCV valve changes and also for oil changing, do let the oil drain a long time. Maybe it's me but I can get four to six ounces out of there by letting it drain for an hour or longer.
Good luck.
I have had both valve covers off of my 1MZFE motor......2003 with about 86K miles on it.
There were some light deposits, NO sludge at all.
I have posted pictures of it on this forum.
As ekpolk said, NO rocker arms, so the sludged highlander story does not line up.
If it is true.....there is more to the story than is being told.
I am way overkill.....usind Redline 5W-30 oil and the oversized oil filter.
I tend to hand on to my vehicles for a long time, and am fully confident in my vehicle.
As with any vehicle....it pays to research and find out the weak points for that particular vehicle and then stay on top of any issues that can lead to those problems.
With the 1MZFE motor......making sure the PCV system has flow and not pushing the Oil Change Interval is pretty much all one needs to do to prevent the "sludge issue".
There were some light deposits, NO sludge at all.
I have posted pictures of it on this forum.
As ekpolk said, NO rocker arms, so the sludged highlander story does not line up.
If it is true.....there is more to the story than is being told.
I am way overkill.....usind Redline 5W-30 oil and the oversized oil filter.
I tend to hand on to my vehicles for a long time, and am fully confident in my vehicle.
As with any vehicle....it pays to research and find out the weak points for that particular vehicle and then stay on top of any issues that can lead to those problems.
With the 1MZFE motor......making sure the PCV system has flow and not pushing the Oil Change Interval is pretty much all one needs to do to prevent the "sludge issue".
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I might have missed on the rocker arms but I was in auto repair 30 years.He wanted to show me what he encountered,It was as bad as the one in photos above.He did have oil change receipts.One from a Toyota dealer.Others from a quickie lube.He is a air line captain.First hint of a issue was gray smoke on start up after sitting any length of time.Toyota(service manager at the dealer) was a real [censored] about the issue.It was much later the truth about those engines came out.Couple years later.Milton Martin Toyota in Gainesville Ga.gave the official denial.He traded it THAT night to a Toyota dealer in Buford Ga.and said at least he laid it back on a Toyta dealer being a Toyota issue.It had less then 25k on the odometer.I worked in a Chrysler dealer a few years later and encountered same storey on some of them.
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