Always be cautious about what you read into VOAs. The important things of T6 are in the spec, and one can also note it's a magnesium additive package, but that's a fairly common path to having SA at 1.0 or less while retaining a very high starting TBN, both of which are required by certain HDEO specifications. The starting TBN of the Shell Rotella T6 Multi-Vehicle 5w-30 is 11.0, which is significantly higher than any C3 I've seen. Both will have fairly similar HTHS and lower phosphorus content than an A3/B4 or most ordinary HDEOs.
Two versions of M1 5w30 ESP now?
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Originally Posted by Crobinson16
I tow occasionally with my truck and I'm a sprited driver, the power in the 6.2 Silverado makes them fun to drive. I've checked my oil temps and at times and I've seen 235-245 F I don't feel comfortable with 0w20.
Does seem strange GM specs an HTHS 2.7 oil while Corvettes get between 2.9 to 3.6 now. That LT1 6.2L V8 Gen V is about the same in a Corvette vs. a Silverado, except for the obvious changes you mentioned which make it get to a peak torque at a lower RPM. ... GM engineers must think the Silverado can limit oil temperature better than a Corvette. Going up a 7% grade towing a big boat or something would stress the Hades out of a Silverado engine running 0w20, you'd think, but oil cooling might be very effective in a Silverado, and its really all about temperature.
The ~240F oil temperature is a piece of cake for any full syn oil 0w20. Ford once had a chart on oil ageing stress vs. temperature, and their ideal for conventional Group II oil was 210F (see below). So 245F in a Silverado with dexos1 0w20, according to GM engineers, isn't enough to thin the oil down too far and/or age it too much.
Taking GM engineers word for it, and then allowing yourself a 10% HTHS safety margin would result in using an xw30 HTHS 3.0 oil. M1 5w30 ESP and T6 Multi-Vehicle is about a 25% margin, more than needed above spec. https://etda.libraries.psu.edu/files/final_submissions/392
I tow occasionally with my truck and I'm a sprited driver, the power in the 6.2 Silverado makes them fun to drive. I've checked my oil temps and at times and I've seen 235-245 F I don't feel comfortable with 0w20.
Does seem strange GM specs an HTHS 2.7 oil while Corvettes get between 2.9 to 3.6 now. That LT1 6.2L V8 Gen V is about the same in a Corvette vs. a Silverado, except for the obvious changes you mentioned which make it get to a peak torque at a lower RPM. ... GM engineers must think the Silverado can limit oil temperature better than a Corvette. Going up a 7% grade towing a big boat or something would stress the Hades out of a Silverado engine running 0w20, you'd think, but oil cooling might be very effective in a Silverado, and its really all about temperature.
The ~240F oil temperature is a piece of cake for any full syn oil 0w20. Ford once had a chart on oil ageing stress vs. temperature, and their ideal for conventional Group II oil was 210F (see below). So 245F in a Silverado with dexos1 0w20, according to GM engineers, isn't enough to thin the oil down too far and/or age it too much.
Taking GM engineers word for it, and then allowing yourself a 10% HTHS safety margin would result in using an xw30 HTHS 3.0 oil. M1 5w30 ESP and T6 Multi-Vehicle is about a 25% margin, more than needed above spec. https://etda.libraries.psu.edu/files/final_submissions/392
Last edited:
Originally Posted by Garak
Originally Posted by Patman
I really haven't considered that oil, it's more geared for diesel engines so it's kind of off my radar.
So is dexos2 oil, to hear it told here, sometimes.
Honestly, if we were able to leave GM's dexos program aside, I suspect an E6 lubricant would be a very suitable choice, and more cost effective right now, at least until we start seeing dexos2 oils appear in more suitable container sizes.
Pennzoil Euro L is dexos2, available at Walmart in both 5qt jugs and qt bottles. I just started using it in my 2000 Camaro LS1.
Originally Posted by Patman
I really haven't considered that oil, it's more geared for diesel engines so it's kind of off my radar.
So is dexos2 oil, to hear it told here, sometimes.
Pennzoil Euro L is dexos2, available at Walmart in both 5qt jugs and qt bottles. I just started using it in my 2000 Camaro LS1.
Patman
Staff member
Originally Posted by oil_film_movies
... GM engineers must think the Silverado can limit oil temperature better than a Corvette. Going up a 7% grade towing a big boat or something would stress the Hades out of a Silverado engine running 0w20, you'd think, but oil cooling might be very effective in a Silverado, and its really all about temperature.
The ~240F oil temperature is a piece of cake for any full syn oil 0w20. Ford once had a chart on oil ageing stress vs. temperature, and their ideal for conventional Group II oil was 210F (see below). So 245F in a Silverado with dexos1 0w20, according to GM engineers, isn't enough to thin the oil down too far and/or age it too much.
Taking GM engineers word for it, and then allowing yourself a 10% HTHS safety margin would result in using an xw30 HTHS 3.0 oil. M1 5w30 ESP and T6 Multi-Vehicle is about a 25% margin, more than needed above spec. https://etda.libraries.psu.edu/files/final_submissions/392
The funny thing is, I really don't see 240 degree oil temps in my Corvette at all, although I definitely would if I were racing it. For most of my driving, my oil temp stays in the 185-195 degree range. It only goes above that if I make a bunch of full throttle runs in a row or get stuck in traffic. But even then I don't think I've seen it go above 220 very often.
... GM engineers must think the Silverado can limit oil temperature better than a Corvette. Going up a 7% grade towing a big boat or something would stress the Hades out of a Silverado engine running 0w20, you'd think, but oil cooling might be very effective in a Silverado, and its really all about temperature.
The ~240F oil temperature is a piece of cake for any full syn oil 0w20. Ford once had a chart on oil ageing stress vs. temperature, and their ideal for conventional Group II oil was 210F (see below). So 245F in a Silverado with dexos1 0w20, according to GM engineers, isn't enough to thin the oil down too far and/or age it too much.
Taking GM engineers word for it, and then allowing yourself a 10% HTHS safety margin would result in using an xw30 HTHS 3.0 oil. M1 5w30 ESP and T6 Multi-Vehicle is about a 25% margin, more than needed above spec. https://etda.libraries.psu.edu/files/final_submissions/392
The funny thing is, I really don't see 240 degree oil temps in my Corvette at all, although I definitely would if I were racing it. For most of my driving, my oil temp stays in the 185-195 degree range. It only goes above that if I make a bunch of full throttle runs in a row or get stuck in traffic. But even then I don't think I've seen it go above 220 very often.
Patman
Staff member
So I've been looking over the specs of the two different versions of ESP 5w30 and perhaps the newer version could be slightly better in one respect. It's viscosity at 40c is quite a bit lower, at 62.6 compared to 72.8 for the version I'm currently using. The other aspects of it's viscosity are pretty close (now 11.8 instead of 12.1 and HTHS is 3.5 vs 3.58) I wonder if the fact that it'll be significantly thinner for most of my cold starts (which would mostly be in the 15C to 30C temperature range) will help keep engine wear a tiny bit lower in the long run?
Originally Posted by Patman
Originally Posted by oil_film_movies
... GM engineers must think the Silverado can limit oil temperature better than a Corvette. Going up a 7% grade towing a big boat or something would stress the Hades out of a Silverado engine running 0w20, you'd think, but oil cooling might be very effective in a Silverado, and its really all about temperature.
The ~240F oil temperature is a piece of cake for any full syn oil 0w20. Ford once had a chart on oil ageing stress vs. temperature, and their ideal for conventional Group II oil was 210F (see below). So 245F in a Silverado with dexos1 0w20, according to GM engineers, isn't enough to thin the oil down too far and/or age it too much.
Taking GM engineers word for it, and then allowing yourself a 10% HTHS safety margin would result in using an xw30 HTHS 3.0 oil. M1 5w30 ESP and T6 Multi-Vehicle is about a 25% margin, more than needed above spec. https://etda.libraries.psu.edu/files/final_submissions/392
The funny thing is, I really don't see 240 degree oil temps in my Corvette at all, although I definitely would if I were racing it. For most of my driving, my oil temp stays in the 185-195 degree range. It only goes above that if I make a bunch of full throttle runs in a row or get stuck in traffic. But even then I don't think I've seen it go above 220 very often.
What's even more strange is the fact gm engineer's used a 194 degree thermostat in your Corvette and a 206 degree in the truck, I have removed the 206 and replaced it with the 194, actually I just bought the complete water neck and thermostat housing from a Camaro and Corvette as they are a direct replacement . Funny how similar the engines are but yet call for a 0w20 . CAFE.....?
Originally Posted by oil_film_movies
... GM engineers must think the Silverado can limit oil temperature better than a Corvette. Going up a 7% grade towing a big boat or something would stress the Hades out of a Silverado engine running 0w20, you'd think, but oil cooling might be very effective in a Silverado, and its really all about temperature.
The ~240F oil temperature is a piece of cake for any full syn oil 0w20. Ford once had a chart on oil ageing stress vs. temperature, and their ideal for conventional Group II oil was 210F (see below). So 245F in a Silverado with dexos1 0w20, according to GM engineers, isn't enough to thin the oil down too far and/or age it too much.
Taking GM engineers word for it, and then allowing yourself a 10% HTHS safety margin would result in using an xw30 HTHS 3.0 oil. M1 5w30 ESP and T6 Multi-Vehicle is about a 25% margin, more than needed above spec. https://etda.libraries.psu.edu/files/final_submissions/392
The funny thing is, I really don't see 240 degree oil temps in my Corvette at all, although I definitely would if I were racing it. For most of my driving, my oil temp stays in the 185-195 degree range. It only goes above that if I make a bunch of full throttle runs in a row or get stuck in traffic. But even then I don't think I've seen it go above 220 very often.
What's even more strange is the fact gm engineer's used a 194 degree thermostat in your Corvette and a 206 degree in the truck, I have removed the 206 and replaced it with the 194, actually I just bought the complete water neck and thermostat housing from a Camaro and Corvette as they are a direct replacement . Funny how similar the engines are but yet call for a 0w20 . CAFE.....?
Originally Posted by neo3
Pennzoil Euro L is dexos2, available at Walmart in both 5qt jugs and qt bottles. I just started using it in my 2000 Camaro LS1.
It'll take us a while to get that, I'm sure.
You wouldn't believe how long it took us to get jugs of M1 0w-40. There was a reason HDEOs up here were used instead of A3/B4 for so long.
Pennzoil Euro L is dexos2, available at Walmart in both 5qt jugs and qt bottles. I just started using it in my 2000 Camaro LS1.
It'll take us a while to get that, I'm sure.
The GM powertrain warranty dept. doesn't want 0w20 Silverado 6.2L engines coming back to the dealership with spun bearings. 5yrs/60k miles is a lot of boat towing up the mountains for some folks. CAFE is a factor. Failures can't be tolerated though. Are Silverados and Sierras dropping like flies in Arizona heat these days? No.
Not to mention the PU truck reputation wars with Ford & others they would lose if trucks starting failing due to thin oil. All that said, Crobinson16 is right to ask for more HTHS. I just think going up 10% is enough, not the high amount in the dexos2 oils discussed here. Certainly racing a Corvette can elevate the oil temperature, which is why Chevy wants owners to use a 0w40 or 15w50. I guess they expect some hot-weather, extreme racing!
Not to mention the PU truck reputation wars with Ford & others they would lose if trucks starting failing due to thin oil. All that said, Crobinson16 is right to ask for more HTHS. I just think going up 10% is enough, not the high amount in the dexos2 oils discussed here. Certainly racing a Corvette can elevate the oil temperature, which is why Chevy wants owners to use a 0w40 or 15w50. I guess they expect some hot-weather, extreme racing!
Patman
Staff member
Originally Posted by Garak
Originally Posted by neo3
Pennzoil Euro L is dexos2, available at Walmart in both 5qt jugs and qt bottles. I just started using it in my 2000 Camaro LS1.
It'll take us a while to get that, I'm sure.
You wouldn't believe how long it took us to get jugs of M1 0w-40. There was a reason HDEOs up here were used instead of A3/B4 for so long.
Pennzoil Euro is sold in 5L jugs at Canadian Tire now:
http://www.canadiantire.ca/en/pdp/pennzoil-platinum-euro-synthetic-motor-oil-5-l-0289356p.html
Originally Posted by neo3
Pennzoil Euro L is dexos2, available at Walmart in both 5qt jugs and qt bottles. I just started using it in my 2000 Camaro LS1.
It'll take us a while to get that, I'm sure.
Pennzoil Euro is sold in 5L jugs at Canadian Tire now:
http://www.canadiantire.ca/en/pdp/pennzoil-platinum-euro-synthetic-motor-oil-5-l-0289356p.html
Originally Posted by loneryder
Don't forget Valvoline MST oils. They come in 5-30 and 5-40. Usually a little cheaper too. NAPA put them on sale several times a year @ 4.xx a qt.
I just looked at a bottle of Valvoline 5-40MST and it has the following approvals: Dex 2, MB 229.5 and .51, VW 505.01 502 505, BMW LL-04, Chrysler MS12991, and Porche A40.
In case anybody is interested.
Don't forget Valvoline MST oils. They come in 5-30 and 5-40. Usually a little cheaper too. NAPA put them on sale several times a year @ 4.xx a qt.
I just looked at a bottle of Valvoline 5-40MST and it has the following approvals: Dex 2, MB 229.5 and .51, VW 505.01 502 505, BMW LL-04, Chrysler MS12991, and Porche A40.
In case anybody is interested.
Originally Posted by Patman
Pennzoil Euro is sold in 5L jugs at Canadian Tire now:
Thanks! Will wonders ever cease?
Pennzoil Euro is sold in 5L jugs at Canadian Tire now:
Thanks! Will wonders ever cease?
Originally Posted by Garak
Originally Posted by Patman
Pennzoil Euro is sold in 5L jugs at Canadian Tire now:
Thanks! Will wonders ever cease?
And a few weeks back I picked up 2 of these 5 L jugs (PP EURO LX 0W30) for the "wonderous" price of $34.19 each at an Ontario CT.
Originally Posted by Patman
Pennzoil Euro is sold in 5L jugs at Canadian Tire now:
Thanks! Will wonders ever cease?
And a few weeks back I picked up 2 of these 5 L jugs (PP EURO LX 0W30) for the "wonderous" price of $34.19 each at an Ontario CT.
That is wondrous for here.
Want it boils down to for me is trying to determine which one of Mobil's oil has the best hths for during the towing trips and hard runs , up the mountains, but still has the best cold flow numbers for when I travel to up state NY in the winter for snowmobile season. I live in southern PA and it still get pretty darn cold at times in the winter.
I finally answered your email.
Patman
Staff member
Originally Posted by RogerBacon
I finally answered your email.
I finally answered your email.
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