Toyota Hybrid Recommendations

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lone_hot_pocket

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Long time listener, first time caller. Recently purchased a Toyota Hybrid with the A25A-FXS engine and it's quickly approaching it's first oil change. The car specs an 0w-8 however in the reading I've done it seems there are some concerns with thin oil and this engine's propensity to dilute the oil with fuel. I don't plan to run any oil longer than 5k but given I live in the Midwest and my wife primarily drives the car, short trips when cold are a reality for a few months out of the year. My main goal with this car is long term reliability (200k+ miles) so that's top of mind when it comes to maintenance. Recommendations seem to be all over the place but I've noticed a few keep being mentioned: HPL 0w-16, TMGO 0w-16/20, PUP 0w-20, Any Euro spec 0w-40, or PUP 5w-30.

Any opinions/recommendations on viscosity and brand from those more knowledgeable?
 
I'm not sure I'd use 0W-8 oil in anything with a reciprocating engine, not even for funnel cakes (a little joke) . I posted a picture of a set of rod bearings operated on 0W-20 for 62,000 miles, normal OCI's in a high performance engine that the manufacturer altered to accommodate the lower viscosity by splitting the rod at an angle so the larger "big end" could fit down the bore.

The drive for better economy does sometimes come at the expense of engine component life. That may depend on how the vehicle is driven and where it is operated.

While a hybrid engine is not a performance engine, the Prius world is full of oil burners, mostly due to worn low tension rings. But more surprisingly, bad rod bearings. It's pretty clear that these problems can be avoided by choosing a quality synthetic oil and changing it frequently.

Take a look at Page 28 for wear rate vs viscosity.

 
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A 500cc, 67HP cylinder with XL rod bearings and a 6500RPM redline (rod bearings sized and designed to handle the load using 0W-20). Clearly, not up to the task. Unsurprisingly, 5W-40 results in no rod bearing wear issues.

We can dismiss this as "not applicable", however, both sides of the bearing show wear. Meaning that the piston and rod's inertia at speeds 6500RPM and under, was enough to overcome the oil film strength on the cap side.

The wear is offset because the rod is split at an angle, to accommodate a larger bearing and thinner oil.


My thoughts are as follows: I'd look long and hard at Boutique Brand thin oils that have a higher HTHS than the competition, and/or I'd consider a step up in viscosity. Especially if it is a PAO based oil that is ultra thin at very low temperatures.

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lone_hot_pocket said:
Long time listener, first time caller. Recently purchased a Toyota Hybrid with the A25A-FXS engine and it's quickly approaching it's first oil change. The car specs an 0w-8 however in the reading I've done it seems there are some concerns with thin oil and this engine's propensity to dilute the oil with fuel. I don't plan to run any oil longer than 5k but given I live in the Midwest and my wife primarily drives the car, short trips when cold are a reality for a few months out of the year. My main goal with this car is long term reliability (200k+ miles) so that's top of mind when it comes to maintenance. Recommendations seem to be all over the place but I've noticed a few keep being mentioned: HPL 0w-16, TMGO 0w-16/20, PUP 0w-20, Any Euro spec 0w-40, or PUP 5w-30.

Any opinions/recommendations on viscosity and brand from those more knowledgeable?
Click to expand...
the good thing about a hybrid drivetrain is the engine just doesn't run under load like a traditional drivetrain, so it probably doesn't matter at all which brand you use, especially with your predicted change rate of 5k.
 
MSCH said:
the good thing about a hybrid drivetrain is the engine just doesn't run under load like a traditional drivetrain, so it probably doesn't matter at all which brand you use, especially with your predicted change rate of 5k.
Click to expand...
But it doesn't get warmed up often so it still stresses the oil.
 
A similar active thread here.


New 2023 Corolla and 0W-8 oil

So I just bought a gas 2023 Corolla with the 2.0 as a commuter. Toyota calls for 0W-8 oil for this. I’m fairly certain they made a change within the last month or so from 0W-16. I do my own oil changes and sourcing OW-8 seems about impossible. The manual does say you can use 0W-16 but it must be...
bobistheoilguy.com
 
UG_Passat said:
You either bought a Crown or a Grand Highlander.

I would consider HPL 0w-8, since Toyota's 0w-8 according to the Car Care Nut Youtube channel is something like $20 per quart right now

The jury is still out on 0w-16 with the A25A engine.
Click to expand...
Guilty, ended up with a new Grand Highlander. Your comment regarding the jury being out on 0w-16 with the A25A, what do you mean? I've discovered that prior MY A25A's were spec'ed with 0w-16 from Toyota.
 
PimTac said:
A similar active thread here.


New 2023 Corolla and 0W-8 oil

So I just bought a gas 2023 Corolla with the 2.0 as a commuter. Toyota calls for 0W-8 oil for this. I’m fairly certain they made a change within the last month or so from 0W-16. I do my own oil changes and sourcing OW-8 seems about impossible. The manual does say you can use 0W-16 but it must be...
bobistheoilguy.com
Click to expand...
Good find, I've been keeping my eye on that thread as well.
 
JohnnyG said:
On a Hybrid, can you go by miles for the oil change? Parallel hybrid, I guess, but series, not likely.
Click to expand...
Fair point, perhaps I've chosen to go by mileage since it's easy for a simpleton such as myself. That and some UOAs with this engine seem to show fuel dilution creeping up around that mileage so trying to err on the safe side.
 
lone_hot_pocket said:
Guilty, ended up with a new Grand Highlander. Your comment regarding the jury being out on 0w-16 with the A25A, what do you mean? I've discovered that prior MY A25A's were spec'ed with 0w-16 from Toyota.
Click to expand...
about long term wear with 0w-16 with the A25A and M20A engines vs 5k and 10k OCI's, as the Toyota Dynamic Force engines are still relatively new.

When 0w-8 was developed with the JASO standard, it was supposed to have wear equivalent to 0w-20
 
UG_Passat said:
about long term wear with 0w-16 with the A25A and M20A engines vs 5k and 10k OCI's, as the Toyota Dynamic Force engines are still relatively new.

When 0w-8 was developed with the JASO standard, it was supposed to have wear equivalent to 0w-20
Click to expand...
Which then would argue for just purchasing a less expensive 20-grade, unless the truly minuscule fuel economy difference was your sole objective.
 
kschachn said:
Which then would argue for just purchasing a less expensive 20-grade, unless the truly minuscule fuel economy difference was your sole objective.
Click to expand...
One does buy a hybrid for fuel economy benefits.

0w-16 is supposed to give you 2% better fuel economy over 0w-20
0w-8 is supposed to give you 2% better fuel economy over 0w-16

I prefer to follow the owner's manual during the warranty period. Then after that, when Toyota isn't on the hook, use whatever multi-grade suits your fancy
 
So you supposedly get a 4% fuel economy increase by using the 8-grade? Hmm. Not sure why I struggle with that massive of an increase but okay.
 
lone_hot_pocket said:
Long time listener, first time caller. Recently purchased a Toyota Hybrid with the A25A-FXS engine and it's quickly approaching it's first oil change. The car specs an 0w-8 however in the reading I've done it seems there are some concerns with thin oil and this engine's propensity to dilute the oil with fuel. I don't plan to run any oil longer than 5k but given I live in the Midwest and my wife primarily drives the car, short trips when cold are a reality for a few months out of the year. My main goal with this car is long term reliability (200k+ miles) so that's top of mind when it comes to maintenance. Recommendations seem to be all over the place but I've noticed a few keep being mentioned: HPL 0w-16, TMGO 0w-16/20, PUP 0w-20, Any Euro spec 0w-40, or PUP 5w-30.

Any opinions/recommendations on viscosity and brand from those more knowledgeable?
Click to expand...
I have 250,000 miles of experience with the 2.0L version of your engine, using plenty of 0W8.

I see you are in Indiana. Take a trip to Manteno or Kankakee and purchase a 5 gallon tub or two of High Performance Lubricants Premium Plus 0W8 motor oil.

Cut your costs even further by doing OCIs of AT LEAST 15k miles.

Any talk of fuel dilution is nonsense.

I state all of this unequivocally, based upon extensive personal experience.

Good luck.
 
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