Rotella T5 10w30 as Motorcycle Oil

[Jay Freddy]

I wanted to thank the good folks here at BITOG for turning me on to this oil for my CB1100.

I have tried the Honda Gn4 10w30, 10w40, and Rotella T6 15w40, and the Rotella T5 is by far the smoothest and quietest oil I have had in this bike.

I was hesitant at first since Shell didnt put the MA letters on the T5 labels, but they do include them on their T4 15w40 and T6.

I was surprised to learn that Honda motorcycle oil is not actually MA certified either. Like Rotella, they just put the letters on the bottle, none of them are actually registered with JASO...

The 15w40 is a great oil for a VT750 V Twin, but it's too stout for the CB1100, which apparently has very thin lines in the oil cooler, requiring a thinner oil.

Anyhow, I just wanted to say thanks, and encourage anyone else looking for a 10w30 weight oil to run in a shared sump machine.

The T5 is excellent oil, no shifting problems at all, and according to what I have read here on BITOG, is extremely shear resistant.

You can use Rotella T5 in a motorbike with confidence.

 

[Jim Rogers]

And thanks to you for taking the leap to make this discovery!

Would you (or anyone else) have any speculation as to whether Rotella T4 10w-30 which, like the T5 10w-30, is not labelled as JASO MA/2 compatible would also work in motorcycle applications?

I ask because I have 12 bikes, and I've always used SuperTech MC oil in all of them. I do a lot of oil changes given the number of bikes I have and the number of miles I put on them (I ride every day that it's over 32*F, rain or shine!).

Unfortunately, SuperTech has continually edged up in price such that it is getting relatively expensive, especially since it can't be purchased in larger (e.g., 1 gal) quantities. As such, I'm looking at switching to Rotella in an effort to save on cost.

All but two of my bikes take 10w40, so I'm looking at using Rotella T4 15w-40 on those, which should be fine given that it's close enough to the correct grade and is JASO MA/2 compatible.

However, my two Hondas spec 10w-30. One is a 2010 VT750RS and the other is a 2019 CBR300R. I know you stated that the 15w-40 is fine in a VT750, and you're probably right. But given the fact that 1) T4 is available in 10w30, 2) I do regularly ride in the winter down to 32*F (but not below!), and 3) I'd like to minimize pump drag on the CBR, and 4) I don't know that the CBR doesn't have similar internal oil flow restrictions as you describe for your CB1100, I think I'd prefer to go with 10w30 for both Hondas if I can.

Thus, I'm hoping that you (or anyone else) might have a clue as to whether Rotella T4 10w30 might actually meet the JASO MA/2 spec even if it's not labeled as such (just as you described for the T5 10w30).

Thanks!

 

[wpod]

As a general statement the 15W-40 HDEOS are some of the best oils on the market

 

[Jay Freddy]

And thanks to you for taking the leap to make this discovery!

Would you (or anyone else) have any speculation as to whether Rotella T4 10w-30 which, like the T5 10w-30, is not labelled as JASO MA/2 compatible would also work in motorcycle applications?

I ask because I have 12 bikes, and I've always used SuperTech MC oil in all of them. I do a lot of oil changes given the number of bikes I have and the number of miles I put on them (I ride every day that it's over 32*F, rain or shine!).

Unfortunately, SuperTech has continually edged up in price such that it is getting relatively expensive, especially since it can't be purchased in larger (e.g., 1 gal) quantities. As such, I'm looking at switching to Rotella in an effort to save on cost.

All but two of my bikes take 10w40, so I'm looking at using Rotella T4 15w-40 on those, which should be fine given that it's close enough to the correct grade and is JASO MA/2 compatible.

However, my two Hondas spec 10w-30. One is a 2010 VT750RS and the other is a 2019 CBR300R. I know you stated that the 15w-40 is fine in a VT750, and you're probably right. But given the fact that 1) T4 is available in 10w30, 2) I do regularly ride in the winter down to 32*F (but not below!), and 3) I'd like to minimize pump drag on the CBR, and 4) I don't know that the CBR doesn't have similar internal oil flow restrictions as you describe for your CB1100, I think I'd prefer to go with 10w30 for both Hondas if I can.

Thus, I'm hoping that you (or anyone else) might have a clue as to whether Rotella T4 10w30 might actually meet the JASO MA/2 spec even if it's not labeled as such (just as you described for the T5 10w30).

Thanks!

I used Rotella 15w40 in bikes back before it came in different flavors or had any inkling of MA compatibility on the bottle.

If you have a VT750, I would recommend the T4 15w40 for that. I tried the T6 15w40 for a year but went back to the T4. I can't tell you why, but the T4 is the best oil I've ever used in my VT750s, even better than the T6.

I too regularly ride down to 32F, and while the cold starts are a slightly lower pitch, the T4 15w40 starts fine and has no shifting problems due to temperature.

I started a thread concerning the T6 that talks about my thoughts and experiences, and has a lot of good info from the oil gurus.

https://bobistheoilguy.com/forums/threads/rotella-15w40-t4-t6-in-motorcycles.349233/

If I were in your situation, I'd stick with T4 15w40 in the VT750rs and use T5 10w30 in the CBR.

I'm sure you could use the T4 10w30 in the CBR, but if you're going to pay more, the T5 10w30 reportedly gives you added shear resistance.

 

[Jim Rogers]

I used Rotella 15w40 in bikes back before it came in different flavors or had any inkling of MA compatibility on the bottle.

If you have a VT750, I would recommend the T4 15w40 for that. I tried the T6 15w40 for a year but went back to the T4. I can't tell you why, but the T4 is the best oil I've ever used in my VT750s, even better than the T6.

I too regularly ride down to 32F, and while the cold starts are a slightly lower pitch, the T4 15w40 starts fine and has no shifting problems due to temperature.

I started a thread concerning the T6 that talks about my thoughts and experiences, and has a lot of good info from the oil gurus.

https://bobistheoilguy.com/forums/threads/rotella-15w40-t4-t6-in-motorcycles.349233/

If I were in your situation, I'd stick with T4 15w40 in the VT750rs and use T5 10w30 in the CBR.

I'm sure you could use the T4 10w30 in the CBR, but if you're going to pay more, the T5 10w30 reportedly gives you added shear resistance.

Thanks. I did read the other thread you created, and I agree that with the VT750 that there is little/no risk in running T4 15w40. In fact, in the service manual recommendations for oil, it never says that 10w40 is acceptable, but the chart with the allowable temperature ranges for oil does show 10w40 and also shows it having the same temp range as the 10w30. So, I think I'll go ahead and switch to T4 15w40 on that bike and not worry about it.

On the CBR300R, I did a little deeper searching for all the bikes with this engine (CBR300R, CB300R, Rebel 300, CRF300L/Rally) to see how many were using 10w40 oil. Turns out that there are a few, but it's not a high number.

Interestingly, it seems like the majority of those using 10w40 were doing so because they said the Honda dealers where they took their bikes to be serviced only used 10w40 and didn't even stock 10w30-- either for their own use or to sell to customers!

The bottom line of my findings was that, while the number of 10w40 users was small, no one reported any problems.

But then I did some searching on the 250cc predecessor of the 300cc engine, which was in the CRF250L/Rally and CBR250R. The 250cc engine differs from the 300cc only in stroke length.

In forums discussing these 250cc bikes, not only did I find many people using 10w40 oil, it turns out that the service manual (but not the owner's manual) for these bike indicates that both 10w30 and 10w40 are acceptable oils, and it even uses the exact same chart I mentioned above for my VT750RS.

To me, this is all evidence that the CBR300R engine is highly unlikely to use 10w30 due to anything like narrow oil passages as was the case with your CB1100. So, I think I'm just going to switch to T4 15w40 for that bike as well. With that, all my bikes will be using the same oil.

As I said, I do a lot of oil changes, and while I have used the specified grades (in full synthetic) for all my bikes for many years with no problems, I'm getting tired of the increasing costs of SuperTech as well as having to source two different grades when one or the other grades (and often both!) are out of stock at my Walmart for weeks (sometimes months!).

On the other hand, my local Menards always has Rotella T4 15w40 in stock in 1 qt., 1 gal., and 2.5 gal. sizes. They currently have a sale on the 2.5 gal. size plus an 11% rebate which puts the final price at $37.37 (or $14.95/gal), which is pretty cheap (and they currently have 18 jugs in stock!). Since I do a lot of shopping at Menards and use their credit card, I get an extra 2% off, which comes out to $36.53 (or $14.61/gal).

Finally, since I shop so much there, I get a ton or rebate money from my building material purchases, so I can by things like this oil basically for free with that rebate money.

So, with this compelling cost argument, I think I'm going to join the cult and become a full Rotella T4 guy! Thanks to all for the discussion, and I'll be interested to hear if anyone has any other comments on any of this.

 

[Jay Freddy]

Thanks. I did read the other thread you created, and I agree that with the VT750 that there is little/no risk in running T4 15w40. In fact, in the service manual recommendations for oil, it never says that 10w40 is acceptable, but the chart with the allowable temperature ranges for oil does show 10w40 and also shows it having the same temp range as the 10w30. So, I think I'll go ahead and switch to T4 15w40 on that bike and not worry about it.

On the CBR300R, I did a little deeper searching for all the bikes with this engine (CBR300R, CB300R, Rebel 300, CRF300L/Rally) to see how many were using 10w40 oil. Turns out that there are a few, but it's not a high number.

Interestingly, it seems like the majority of those using 10w40 were doing so because they said the Honda dealers where they took their bikes to be serviced only used 10w40 and didn't even stock 10w30-- either for their own use or to sell to customers!

The bottom line of my findings was that, while the number of 10w40 users was small, no one reported any problems.

But then I did some searching on the 250cc predecessor of the 300cc engine, which was in the CRF250L/Rally and CBR250R. The 250cc engine differs from the 300cc only in stroke length.

In forums discussing these 250cc bikes, not only did I find many people using 10w40 oil, it turns out that the service manual (but not the owner's manual) for these bike indicates that both 10w30 and 10w40 are acceptable oils, and it even uses the exact same chart I mentioned above for my VT750RS.

To me, this is all evidence that the CBR300R engine is highly unlikely to use 10w30 due to anything like narrow oil passages as was the case with your CB1100. So, I think I'm just going to switch to T4 15w40 for that bike as well. With that, all my bikes will be using the same oil.

As I said, I do a lot of oil changes, and while I have used the specified grades (in full synthetic) for all my bikes for many years with no problems, I'm getting tired of the increasing costs of SuperTech as well as having to source two different grades when one or the other grades (and often both!) are out of stock at my Walmart for weeks (sometimes months!).

On the other hand, my local Menards always has Rotella T4 15w40 in stock in 1 qt., 1 gal., and 2.5 gal. sizes. They currently have a sale on the 2.5 gal. size plus an 11% rebate which puts the final price at $37.37 (or $14.95/gal), which is pretty cheap (and they currently have 18 jugs in stock!). Since I do a lot of shopping at Menards and use their credit card, I get an extra 2% off, which comes out to $36.53 (or $14.61/gal).

Finally, since I shop so much there, I get a ton or rebate money from my building material purchases, so I can by things like this oil basically for free with that rebate money.

So, with this compelling cost argument, I think I'm going to join the cult and become a full Rotella T4 guy! Thanks to all for the discussion, and I'll be interested to hear if anyone has any other comments on any of this.

Yeah, apparently Honda revised their manuals from 10w40 to 10w30 across the board for the improvements in gas efficiency.

However, the CB1100 is unique in that it really does seem to prefer the 10w30. It's been 10w30 right from the start of it's model line.

I used Rotella T 15w40 in my Nighthawk CB750 for years and the bike had 40k miles on it and was still going strong when I sold it.

Wish I had never sold that one!

Seeing as Harleys recommend 20w50, and the VT750 is essentially a mini HD copy with Japanese reliability, it makes sense that they would like the 15w40.

I've never had a 10w30 in a bike until the CB1100. It was hard getting used to the idea!

I'm sure you'll be fine with T4 15w40 in the CBR300 as well.

 

[Jim Rogers]

I think so, too. I already did the spring oil change so and I still have some leftover SuperTech so it will be some months before I put T4 in the CBR. But when I do, I'll update here to let people know how it went (just like you did with your T5 experiment).

 

[twX]

I'm sure you could use the T4 10w30 in the CBR, but if you're going to pay more, the T5 10w30 reportedly gives you added shear resistance.

From the UOAs I've seen, T4 is more shear resistant than the T5 or T6, at least for the 40 grades.

In any case, I wouldn't worry too much about shearing or oil grade if using an HDEO. Most bikes will specify something like an API SJ 10w30 or 10w40, which both have a minimum HTHS of only 2.9 cP, and JASO MA has the same HTHS requirement.

Minimum HTHS for HDEOs is 3.5 cP for 10w30 and 10w40, and 3.7 for 15w40 and x-w50. So, even the Rotella T4 or T5 10w30 should provide better high temperature protection than the 10w40 oils typically specified for motorcycle engines.

 

[Jay Freddy]

Found this elsewhere on the forum, seemed like it would make sense here.

Rotella T5 10w30 VOA courtesy of HDOilDude and Blackstone Labs.

 

[Merek]

I know someone will correct me if I'm wrong but with JASO certifications all the manufacturers have to do is perform their own tests in house and if they pass they can then stick the JASO label on their product. Most likely Shell has not performed testing on the T5 as there are not that many motorcycle manufacturers even call for 10w30 so the demand is just not there and the only one I can even think of is Honda. I'm sure the reason they do with their 5w40 is being very similar to 10w40 which is very common in water cooled motorcycles.

 

[alarmguy]

@Jay Freddy
Texas is a warm climate, with that said it makes sense an oil with a low spread will hold up better but please update us in another month and once you get to around 2000 miles, that will be the test if the oil holds up, I suspect a 30 will be too little for Texas.

 

[ZeeOSix]

I know someone will correct me if I'm wrong but with JASO certifications all the manufacturers have to do is perform their own tests in house and if they pass they can then stick the JASO label on their product. Most likely Shell has not performed testing on the T5 as there are not that many motorcycle manufacturers even call for 10w30 so the demand is just not there and the only one I can even think of is Honda. I'm sure the reason they do with their 5w40 is being very similar to 10w40 which is very common in water cooled motorcycles.

You can download the JASO T 903:2023 (latest version, 2023) document and learn all about it.

JASO Engine Oil Standards Implementation Panel

Also, some discussion of JASO in this thread.

Fully synthetic 10w-30 Jaso mb oil required.

Just got a Honda sh 125. Honda recommended oil is 10w-30 Jaso mb. Would like a fully synthetic 10w-30 Jason mb. Cannot find one. Would prefer either Castrol or Mobil. Can anyone enlighten me?

bobistheoilguy.com

 

[Jay Freddy]

Well surprise surprise... I was looking at the API classifications for T5 10w30 (because Im a party animal... lol) and the new T5 jug has JASO MA2 written on it!

 

[Alain2]

Well surprise surprise... I was looking at the API classifications for T5 10w30 (because Im a party animal... lol) and the new T5 jug has JASO MA2 written on it!

Well it confirms what everyone was experiencing, no clutch issues with T5 10w30.