Looking to replace 2005 Sienna with SUV

[CKN]

Originally Posted By: JLTD
Originally Posted By: CKN



WE agree. But he asked for our perspectives......I also agree the 4Runner is extremely reliable. But it has several shortcomings-IMHO.


Yup....interested to hear your thoughts on the shortcomings. We've already spoken about handling; it does well for a body-on-frame SUV but fares poorly against a unibody SUV tuned for the street.



Well-you already own one. So-if I did wouldn't we disagree? I will ask you the following-You name your vehicle shortcomings.. (every vehicle has them) then I will come back and see if any of them is in my list.

 

[JLTD]

Originally Posted By: CKN
Originally Posted By: JLTD
Originally Posted By: CKN



WE agree. But he asked for our perspectives......I also agree the 4Runner is extremely reliable. But it has several shortcomings-IMHO.


Yup....interested to hear your thoughts on the shortcomings. We've already spoken about handling; it does well for a body-on-frame SUV but fares poorly against a unibody SUV tuned for the street.



Well-you already own one. So-if I did wouldn't we disagree? I will ask you the following-You name your vehicle shortcomings.. (every vehicle has them) then I will come back and see if any of them is in my list.


For what I do and where I go and how I get there the 4Runner is good to go. Perhaps rearward visibility could be better, but a little lean in the front seat covers the blind spots (as does folding the rear seats as it's the rear headrests that block the view). The dash vents aren't placed in the best position, have to work to get left side not to blow in my eyes. Some complain about only 5 speeds in the transmission but not me - less shifting equates to longer life - AND it's a proven design usually put behind a V8. Maybe a bit of fore-and-aft pitchiness in some conditions.

I am coming from an F150 and it's all what you are used to. I miss the bed once and awhile, and perhaps twice a year the extra 3800# of towing capacity. Parking is a breeze in comparison.

Handling is basically the same to me, acceleration also, although with a heavy load the truck would have more grunt. Brakes much better than the truck. At about 5mpg better in the 4Runner, fuel economy is good. Going off road it's easier to maneuver and fits or turns around in places the truck could not. Oil changes are more difficult as there are skid plates to remove and the Toyota housing rather than a spin on, so worse than the truck in that regard. I could never hook up my phone to the truck but it's Bluetoothed to the 'Runner with no issues.

As I mentioned in some thread earlier, I did tons of research and took lots of test drives before deciding on this SUV.

Your turn

 

[CKN]

Ergonomics-the dash vents are poorly placed-the entire dashboard is outdated. So-yes we are on the same page there-I think. The front seats become downright uncomfortable just after a trip of any extended length. Really feel it's under powered-compared to the V8 that was in it back in the mid-2000s.

Handling nor ride is not that great-but coming out of a truck just 4 or 5 years old would be equal. However-I can tell you first hand the 2018 Silverado and F150's are an extremely comfortable ride.

At a wheelbase of around 110"-it's not well suited for towing anything of any size-despite (I believe) it's 5,000 pound tow rating.

It's a great off-roader-not good for much of anything else. There are better choices in AWD/4 Wheel drive for occasional winter use-for that parking lot not cleared or when the streets are not plowed.

My wife's 1 year old Hyundai Santa Fe XL (AWD-on demand) handles the snow just fine-and we do live on a slight hill-I can't get up the hill in my Sierra w/o putting it in 4WD when it snows.

Still don't know how we can do the OP justice-recommending what is really an off-road vehicle as a grocery getter.

 

[JLTD]

Seats are actually great for me, if I take my wallet out of the pocket....I can see how it would be too firm for some but I'm probably well above their weight and size.

Dash outdated....I guess that's a personal preference; Toyota left it with big controls and simple setup for a reason (designed in '05? LOL) just like they did for the FJ. Appealing to some, a turn off for others. I'm a function over form person, so if it works and isn't the prettiest/most up to date, I'm much happier than if it looked awesome but wasn't reliable.

We're agreed on the vents for sure. If OP just wants a street-only grocery getter (at this point we've gone pretty far afield, apologies for the hijack) and MPG then I agree there are better choices. But he specifically mentioned reliability which is why I've gone on so much.

 

[i6pwr]

I appreciate the input...we haven't been to look at any yet, but will try today. It will be hard to walk away from the sliding doors and the enormous cargo volume, as well as seating 7-8 adults comfortably..as far as leg room goes.

Fuel mileage is a bit of a concern, not a deal breaker, but I have also been looking at the 2014-2015 Pathfinder. I know the Nissan can pull big repair bills, so I dont know what to look for yet. Do they use CVT or is it a choice? Nissan likes to use mega-buck O2 sensors and many other items that can ruin a purchase...but I do like the 20/26 MPG rating.

The Santa Fe is an option, I've been going back and forth between the Highlander, Pathfinder, Acadia/Traverse.

New isn't an option right now....just crazy coin even for a nice Highlander.

I know I will get what I pay for, but a $20K cut in price for a 3YO vehicle with 30K miles looks much better

 

[wag123]

Originally Posted By: i6pwr
I appreciate the input...we haven't been to look at any yet, but will try today. It will be hard to walk away from the sliding doors and the enormous cargo volume, as well as seating 7-8 adults comfortably..as far as leg room goes.

Fuel mileage is a bit of a concern, not a deal breaker, but I have also been looking at the 2014-2015 Pathfinder. I know the Nissan can pull big repair bills, so I dont know what to look for yet. Do they use CVT or is it a choice? Nissan likes to use mega-buck O2 sensors and many other items that can ruin a purchase...but I do like the 20/26 MPG rating.

The Santa Fe is an option, I've been going back and forth between the Highlander, Pathfinder, Acadia/Traverse.

New isn't an option right now....just crazy coin even for a nice Highlander.

I know I will get what I pay for, but a $20K cut in price for a 3YO vehicle with 30K miles looks much better

The newer crossover Pathfinders have a CVT transmission and Nissan has had MAJOR problems with it in them, particularly in 2014 & 2015, and this is one of the primary reasons for why there are such good deals on used ones. It appears to me that CVTs do well in lightweight/low-powered vehicles but suffer from durability/reliability problems in heavier/higher-powered ones.
There are several very good reasons for why Highlanders have such a high resale value verses it's direct competitors and I predict that you will find out what those reasons are if you by one of them. BTW, there are plenty of 2014-2016 Highlanders with reasonable miles available in your price range as long as you are not holding out for a loaded-up high-end model, just do a search on https://www.cargurus.com. If she MUST have a leather interior, you can purchase an LE Plus or XLE cheap enough that you can afford to upgrade to leather and still stay within your budget (from Katzkin, Classic, etc). As far as miles are concerned, personally, I would rather spend my hard-earned money on a 60k mile Highlander than a 20k mile Hyundai, Kia, GMC, Buick, Chevy, or Ford competitor for the same kind of money (funny that you didn't mention the Explorer as one of the vehicles you are considering).
I reiterate, after 9 years, your wife is going to miss the sliding side doors (although she may never admit it).

 

[i6pwr]

Originally Posted By: wag123
funny that you didn't mention the Explorer as one of the vehicles you are considering).


I actually did consider the Explorer. I like the styling, but I don't want the EcoBoost and the standard V6 is under-powered.

 

[wag123]

Originally Posted By: i6pwr
Originally Posted By: wag123
funny that you didn't mention the Explorer as one of the vehicles you are considering).


I actually did consider the Explorer. I like the styling, but I don't want the EcoBoost and the standard V6 is under-powered.


I can certainly understand why you wouldn't want the Ecoboost, I am in agreement with this rationale. The Explorer's standard 3.5L V/6's 290hp is on-par with the other competitors you are looking at and more powerful than the 2.3L 4-cyl Ecoboost's 280hp. Did you drive it and the 3.5L V/6 Ecoboost back-to-back? If so, I can understand why you thought it was underpowered.

 

[mtndew_dad]

A Kia Sorento should be within your price range goal.

 

[i6pwr]

Sorry, I meant the Explorer Sport, not the I4 EcoBoost.

I feel the 3.5L should move the Explorer a little bit better given the ratings. Almost like the 390 HP in the Ram Hemi....it just doesnt feel like 390 HP.

 

[i6pwr]

We looked at the 2015 Traverse LT, and a 2015 Highlander LE Plus. We drove the Highlander but not the Traverse.

I really wanted to like the Traverse, first off, the sliding 2nd row was just too awkward, the wifey didnt care for it at all.

Rear seating was ok for what it is in the Traverse, but she had bad vibes from the start, also the turning radius is poor. We did t take it on the road, but a short distance in the parking lot to park it was enough for me.

The Highlander was a different animal, ergonomics were great. The rear seat while not for me, was quite tolerable and I'm 6'0 195.

As for now, we really like the highlander, need to look at the Explorer again but she seems set on the Toyota.

May wait till Sept to see what the prices do, seem firm across the board right now around 27K for the LE Plus. I would like to find the Blizzard Pearl LE Plus or XLE, but don't want black again.

The 4Runner while very capable, is just too much "truck" for what we are after. The safety features, smoothness, quietness of the Highlander just trump the 4Runner for our purposes.

 

[wag123]

Originally Posted By: i6pwr
We looked at the 2015 Traverse LT, and a 2015 Highlander LE Plus. We drove the Highlander but not the Traverse.

I really wanted to like the Traverse, first off, the sliding 2nd row was just too awkward, the wifey didnt care for it at all.

Rear seating was ok for what it is in the Traverse, but she had bad vibes from the start, also the turning radius is poor. We did t take it on the road, but a short distance in the parking lot to park it was enough for me.

The Highlander was a different animal, ergonomics were great. The rear seat while not for me, was quite tolerable and I'm 6'0 195.

As for now, we really like the highlander, need to look at the Explorer again but she seems set on the Toyota.

May wait till Sept to see what the prices do, seem firm across the board right now around 27K for the LE Plus. I would like to find the Blizzard Pearl LE Plus or XLE, but don't want black again.

The 4Runner while very capable, is just too much "truck" for what we are after. The safety features, smoothness, quietness of the Highlander just trump the 4Runner for our purposes.


The Sienna sure does have a tight turning radius! It is very noticeable when you drive something else.
You are going to pay extra for Blizzard Pearl, new or used, and you will pay disproportionately more for a used one because of supply/demand/rarity. I may be wrong, but I don't think that they offered Blizzard Pearl on the LE Plus, just on the higher-end models. Super White is a good 2nd choice that won't cost you any more and is a color that holds-up well in the long run.

 

[UG_Passat]

If the wife wants an SUV for AWD, maybe throw in a CPO Sienna AWD as a contender.

There are downsides:
1) Older Active Torque Control AWD system (compared to a current Highlander), which only send up to 40% torque to the rear wheels (vs 50% on the current Dynamic Torque Control AWD system)
2) Runflats.

These guys even do the diagonal test on it

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Za0BVHOliDY

 

[supton]

Friend of mine has an AWD Sienna. He got a spare and has it tie strapped in the back.

 

[i6pwr]

Naturally now that I've seen the limited version with the captain's chairs I really like to captain's chairs. However if you wanna go on a trip with luggage you're limited to a 4 seated vehicle.

May need to stick with the bench seat plan. The Pilot has a lot more room, but I'm weary on them.

 

[glock19]

Originally Posted By: i6pwr
Naturally now that I've seen the limited version with the captain's chairs I really like to captain's chairs. However if you wanna go on a trip with luggage you're limited to a 4 seated vehicle.

May need to stick with the bench seat plan. The Pilot has a lot more room, but I'm weary on them.


I tried to talk my wife into a XLE FWD with second row bench seat. However, the saying goes "happy wife, happy life", so she got a Limited AWD with captain's chairs. The deal breaker for her was the ventilated seats which put us into the Limited.

 

[wag123]

Originally Posted By: i6pwr
Naturally now that I've seen the limited version with the captain's chairs I really like to captain's chairs. However if you wanna go on a trip with luggage you're limited to a 4 seated vehicle.

Besides the sliding side doors, you and your wife are also going to miss all of the interior space you have in the Sienna, especially if you do a lot of travelling with passengers and luggage. You get almost as much luggage space behind the 3rd row seat in the Sienna as you do with most mid-size SUVs with the 3rd row folded down, forget having any reasonable amount of luggage space with the 3rd row up.

 

[i6pwr]

Originally Posted By: glock19

I tried to talk my wife into a XLE FWD with second row bench seat. However, the saying goes "happy wife, happy life", so she got a Limited AWD with captain's chairs. The deal breaker for her was the ventilated seats which put us into the Limited.


The cooled seats very well could be the deal breaker....hard to say.

I agree, the storage space in the Sienna is enormous...haven't ran out of room yet.

We dont travel heavy that much....but I surely wish we could get the cooled seats with a bench 2nd row. But the caveat is with cap't chairs you are very limited in regards to people and luggage.....she still prefers the Highlander over the pilot, but Honda thought that part through.

 

[wag123]

Originally Posted By: i6pwr
Originally Posted By: glock19

I tried to talk my wife into a XLE FWD with second row bench seat. However, the saying goes "happy wife, happy life", so she got a Limited AWD with captain's chairs. The deal breaker for her was the ventilated seats which put us into the Limited.


The cooled seats very well could be the deal breaker....hard to say.

I agree, the storage space in the Sienna is enormous...haven't ran out of room yet.

We dont travel heavy that much....but I surely wish we could get the cooled seats with a bench 2nd row. But the caveat is with cap't chairs you are very limited in regards to people and luggage.....she still prefers the Highlander over the pilot, but Honda thought that part through.

Heated and cooled seats can be installed after the fact. Kazkin, Classic Soft Trim, and Champion all make them.
I like the new body style Pilots but I don't care for the old body style. Honda's engine still has a timing belt that will need periodic replacement. Also, Honda has a history of paint, valve train, transmission, and A/C problems with them. Even so, they are superior to all of the other SUVs you mentioned. The availability of used Pilots is lower than used Highlanders and the prices appear to be even higher.

 

[i6pwr]

I forgot how involved used car shopping is....

After looking at countless vehicles, I did find a 2014 Highlander, little under 60K miles, clean Carfax, and while not a 2015 which was my criteria for the oldest Highlander, this one is the same body style and is the color I'm after and trim level.

Fingers crossed on this.