Deteriorating quality

[GiveMeAVowel]

Originally Posted By: Al

The reason they went to lighter materials on vehicles is mileage, and safety..not rocket science.


I do agree with that to a point, but there are plenty of places they are using plastic where it has no business being, from intakes, to water pump impellers, to radiators...the weight savings is minimal and when these critical parts fail it can often destroy the engines.

 

[alarmguy]

Its simple really, the answer is the Shareholders of the company's stock. They want profits, profits, profits.
Produce a quality product, establish the brand name, secure premium profits and keep the profits coming, in time, the only why to keep profit increases coming once hitting market saturation is try to cut production costs as much as possible and as little noticeable as possible to the public.

By cutting costs and possibly holding the line on price, profits keep increasing and they are able to squeeze the competition further and truly dominate..depending on the product of course.
Some companies of smaller products (oil filter for example) will simply cut the quality to the bone, resting on its reputation and marketing, pull in massive profits and if they run the name into the ground, gut the company and sell it off.

Then there are companies of course where reputation and quality are above all else and maintain quality even at higher prices and people are will to pay for it.

One example would be BMW automobiles. A proud company, and guess what? They have no shareholders to answer too. BMW is privately owned. AS an American, you can be proud that once their FIFTH expansion is finished this summer, right here in South Carolina USA, BMW South Carolina will be BMWs largest manufacturing plant in the world, exceeding even Germany. They also are currently the largest exporter of automobiles in the USA> (no shareholders)

 

[alarmguy]

Originally Posted By: HerrStig
AR, KLH, Advent, Marantz, Carver...All gone.


Ahhh .. yes, I remember and knew those names well.

You know? Part of the problem is people just do not care, we are a throwaway society.
Audio reproduction has taken a GIANT leap backwards and people do not care, they pay for the horrid quality of satellite radio hundreds of over compressed channels instead of less high quality channels, same goes for cable and satellite TV, far inferior HD quality compared to a simple over the air TV antenna.

MP3s? Oh please, lets not even go there, how I wish I could just go back to CDs never mind albums, far better quality ... people dont care, they want quantity, not quality, most people no longer know what that is. (heck, just look at the way we vote)

People no longer educate on what they buy, they buy marketing and the big companies got it down to a science.

 

[Wheel]

I'd pay more for a better product, better customer service and future repair parts. We've cut our own jobs to save a nickel. I hate that I get a better customer experience online because companies devalue their employees to save that money. Even then, I'm likely facing a product that has planned to be obsolete or break.

I picked up a quote somewhere, and I don't know who the credit should go to - that life is too short to eat bad food. I also think it's too short to buy junk. I'm certainly not rich, but how much cheap can you afford ?

 

[4D-56]

Profits over quality. Profits over people. Its a race to the bottom.

 

[Jarlaxle]

Originally Posted By: surfstar
What are you guys talking about?

You can get things for dirt cheap from Costco, Amazon, WalMart, etc.

Stuff you never ever needed before. Straight from China.

My smartphones range in price from $25-80, NOT subsidized. Grab a new case off Amazon for $4.99 shipped to my door.

They will ship something to me that costs more to ship than the product. I can cross-shop across thousands of stores online, bid for items on ebay, sell things on ebay and craigslist, etc. It is so easy! Heck you can find a wife on your smartphone and they're not Russian order brides, but people just like you.

New tech, same old people complaining.

My Golf Sportwagen was $18,425 (MSRP of $21,6xx). The 2005 Saturn Vue it replaced had a sticker of $19,xxx.
11 years of inflation and buying a German (yeah hecho in Mex, I know) car vs a plastic one... that's a pretty good step up in quality and not price. Oh yeah, its also faster/sportier, yet gets way better mpg. For less cost.

What were you [censored] about again? Your 1960s inefficient stove or something? Your rose lenses sure look nice, though.


The Hoover vacuum my grandmother bought at Woolworth's in 1979 has outlasted (at last count) four replacements, despite cleaning up after long-haired cats for almost 20 years.

A few years ago, my mother finally admitted that yes, my 30-year-old Glenwood gas stove really DID work better on the cooktop than her new $2500+ dual-fuel stove.

My mother's (new) refrigerator has needed more repairs in 6 years than my big Kenmore has needed in twenty. (When I moved, I took one look at the new refrigerators...then I bought one, put it in my old house, and took the Kenmore with me!)

There is a gigantic amount of GARBAGE available...but real quality? Not so much...

 

[Jarlaxle]

Originally Posted By: GiveMeAVowel
Originally Posted By: Al

The reason they went to lighter materials on vehicles is mileage, and safety..not rocket science.


I do agree with that to a point, but there are plenty of places they are using plastic where it has no business being, from intakes, to water pump impellers, to radiators...the weight savings is minimal and when these critical parts fail it can often destroy the engines.


Plastic impellers are not bad...if nothing else, they will not corrode!

 

[LoneRanger]

Screw the consumer but not more than your competitor is screwing the consumer, lest your customer will go get less screwed by your competition and you lose.... i.e. hold the screwin' to a level that the market will tolerate.

Ought to be a global corporate motto.

 

[GiveMeAVowel]

Originally Posted By: Jarlaxle


Plastic impellers are not bad...if nothing else, they will not corrode!


Yes, they don't fail slowly by corroding, the plastic gets brittle and suddenly cracks and the fins drop off without warning, and you just happen to be in the middle of nowhere and your engine overheats.
Yes, plastic isn't that bad...

 

[hatt]

Originally Posted By: HerrStig
Seems like once famous stereo equipment companies are now putting their names on Chinese plastic boxes. Audio gear has come full circle. Once good gear was available on a college kid's budget, now the average change the wold type is suffering with lousy reproduction on "walk things". AR, KLH, Advent, Marantz, Carver...All gone.
Hopefully that will start to change. Vinyl sales are up every year. People are starting to understand again that music should be pleasant to listen to, not just 10,000,000 available poorly mastered loud songs played on [censored] devices.

 

[daves87rs]

Originally Posted By: stro_cruiser
Profits over quality. Profits over people. Its a race to the bottom.



Pretty much.

I think at some point though we'll see more and more companies go private (like dell) because most companies can only fake profit for so much longer....

 

[Merkava_4]

Originally Posted By: HerrStig
AR, KLH, Advent, Marantz, Carver...All gone.


How about Vector Research ? You remember Vector Research ?

They use to make the tape decks that were sorta a brown/grayish color.
Always plain and subdued; real professional looking.

 

[Pop_Rivit]

And yet the same people who moan and complain about poor quality are the same ones who flock to Walmart and seek out the cheapest product possible. You sit around and complain, and yet you're the ones who financially support one of the largest driving factors in low quality/low price.

And complaining about the quality of ice cream or the fake food that they push at consumers at places like chain pizza joints or IHOP? Now that's just downright funny. You could learn to make real food at home. It's far better than anything you can buy at a fake food joint, it's much healthier, it's less expensive, and you get the satisfaction of making it yourself. Or you can continue to waddle into the local IHOP and stuff your face while you complain about the quality of food.

It's also incredibly ironic that the folks that sit around and complain don't have the drive to actually go out and change anything. Few, if any, are willing to go out and start their own company and build a (insert the name of the product here) that lives up to their quality standards.

Or you can sit around and continue to moan, complain and do nothing to change the situation.

 

[alarmguy]

Originally Posted By: stro_cruiser
Profits over quality. Profits over people. Its a race to the bottom.


Exactly, the public clueless and does not care, as long as a device lasts long enough, as long as the sound quality is good enough, as long as the video is good enough, as long as the car lasts until the RENTAL lease is over, is, yes, good enough.

Companies can produce "good enough" products that look like, sound like, ride like, top of the line products to consumers at premium prices (and profits) simply because the public will buy them, as long as they are "good enough" and can feel like a "big shot" having the product. They are less concerned how long they will last, simply because they will be replaced before that time comes.

Look at automobiles, [censored], its hard to even find an advertised price anymore, its always Leased (translated RENTAL) prices.
As long as they can show off to their neighbors, its doesnt matter if the car falls apart in a few years because the "rental agreement" (lease) will be over and they will have a new one.

People are WILLINGLY allowing themselves to be enslaved by the corporations who have how the human brain works down to a science and what makes people allow those companies to take money out of their paychecks every week.
They end up with lifetime of payments, automatically taken from their paychecks every week.
Electronically enslaved to products at the expense of their families and income. AS long as the products bring complete joy to their brains, the product will fail at a predetermined time so it can be replaced by another joyful item.

Bottom line, the race to the bottom is the human race of many people, who just do not think for themselves, immature to turn down the so called latest, greatest product. Heck, look at the Iphone, a device that brings Apple INCREDIBLE profits, the public does not care, as long as they do not have to lay the money out upfront for a $600 phone and it can be taken out of their paychecks, they will get one, instead of a similar product for less then $100 total cost that will bring them the same joy.

 

[grampi]

Originally Posted By: alarmguy
Originally Posted By: HerrStig
AR, KLH, Advent, Marantz, Carver...All gone.


Ahhh .. yes, I remember and knew those names well.

You know? Part of the problem is people just do not care, we are a throwaway society.
Audio reproduction has taken a GIANT leap backwards and people do not care, they pay for the horrid quality of satellite radio hundreds of over compressed channels instead of less high quality channels, same goes for cable and satellite TV, far inferior HD quality compared to a simple over the air TV antenna.

MP3s? Oh please, lets not even go there, how I wish I could just go back to CDs never mind albums, far better quality ... people dont care, they want quantity, not quality, most people no longer know what that is. (heck, just look at the way we vote)

People no longer educate on what they buy, they buy marketing and the big companies got it down to a science.


I was once big time into car audio...remember the all of the USA made amps? Phoenix Gold, Rockford Fosgate, PPI, Orion, etc, all made amps that were built like tanks...now all of these companies have outsourced the production of their amps overseas, if they're still in business. I understand a business is in business to make a profit, but when profit becomes they're only concern, consumers end up with cheap, throw away garbage...

 

[grampi]

Originally Posted By: Wheel
I'd pay more for a better product, better customer service and future repair parts. We've cut our own jobs to save a nickel. I hate that I get a better customer experience online because companies devalue their employees to save that money. Even then, I'm likely facing a product that has planned to be obsolete or break.

I picked up a quote somewhere, and I don't know who the credit should go to - that life is too short to eat bad food. I also think it's too short to buy junk. I'm certainly not rich, but how much cheap can you afford ?


The problem here is most consumers don't have a choice to pay more for a higher quality product. In most cases, only cheap products are available...

 

[grampi]

Originally Posted By: Pop_Rivit
And yet the same people who moan and complain about poor quality are the same ones who flock to Walmart and seek out the cheapest product possible. You sit around and complain, and yet you're the ones who financially support one of the largest driving factors in low quality/low price.

And complaining about the quality of ice cream or the fake food that they push at consumers at places like chain pizza joints or IHOP? Now that's just downright funny. You could learn to make real food at home. It's far better than anything you can buy at a fake food joint, it's much healthier, it's less expensive, and you get the satisfaction of making it yourself. Or you can continue to waddle into the local IHOP and stuff your face while you complain about the quality of food.

It's also incredibly ironic that the folks that sit around and complain don't have the drive to actually go out and change anything. Few, if any, are willing to go out and start their own company and build a (insert the name of the product here) that lives up to their quality standards.

Or you can sit around and continue to moan, complain and do nothing to change the situation.


I would much rather cook my own food at home, but that's pretty tough to do when I'm on the road for work...

 

[supton]

Originally Posted By: exranger06
On another forum, people were saying that 5-8 years is a reasonable life expectancy for a TV set. I was blown away. I grew up with Sony CRT TVs that all lasted over 20 years. I still have a 27" Sony built in October 1993 in my master bedroom, still working fine.


Yep, I don't think I had a CRT fail on me, despite being decades old. Wound up paying to get rid of them, am hoping the LCD/LED replacements last.

People look at me funny when I tell them our last wireless router was 9 years old, and that I should have just replace it "because it was old". I wound up having to, as devices would just wouldn't connect. I've noticed some wonky behavior lately, similar sorts of things, on our 2 year old router.

I think most people replace things when they get the littlest scratch, and thus want the cheapest replacement. Quantity over quality, so it seems.

 

[daves87rs]

Originally Posted By: Pop_Rivit
And yet the same people who moan and complain about poor quality are the same ones who flock to Walmart and seek out the cheapest product possible. You sit around and complain, and yet you're the ones who financially support one of the largest driving factors in low quality/low price.

And complaining about the quality of ice cream or the fake food that they push at consumers at places like chain pizza joints or IHOP? Now that's just downright funny. You could learn to make real food at home. It's far better than anything you can buy at a fake food joint, it's much healthier, it's less expensive, and you get the satisfaction of making it yourself. Or you can continue to waddle into the local IHOP and stuff your face while you complain about the quality of food.

It's also incredibly ironic that the folks that sit around and complain don't have the drive to actually go out and change anything. Few, if any, are willing to go out and start their own company and build a (insert the name of the product here) that lives up to their quality standards.

Or you can sit around and continue to moan, complain and do nothing to change the situation.



While completely true....two issues lie within that:

1- With the constant job/pay cuts- it starts to give the consumer less and less choice...not going to save money-but all they can afford now...

2-Many people no longer have the time....and many times- the fast food is simply cheaper. Like with soda being cheaper than water or a cheeseburger for a buck (even though one on the grill is 100x better). I try even with my crazy retail hours to make good healthy food instead of going to the nearest Taco Bell....

Though nothing beats a home cooked meal...

 

[supton]

Nothing beats home cooked, that's for sure. I can't stand cooking but I do enjoy my wife's cooking.

I've packed a lunch for years. I know some people will use a cold can of soda to keep their lunch cool; dawned on me years ago that a cup of frozen veggies does similar--yet is far better for you! These days I don't even bother with an insulated lunch bag, as long as it's not room temp by lunchtime it should be ok to have to have a slow thaw. At work I usually keep a drawer full of small boxes of fruit--Walmart etc sell sleeves of Craisens and raisens, those make good snacks. Peanuts do too.

For a while I'd keep some Hormel processed foods in the desk, something which could sit for months. $1.97 or whatever at Walmart. Sure beats driving around at lunchtime to eat out. I try not to anymore, but it's a cheap alternative.

I wish I had the patience to make soup, and an outdoor kitchen to make soup in the summer. Make a big batch and freeze. Yum. I recently gave up pasta but cooking up big batches of rice or pasta then mixing with veggies and a bit of cheese always struck me as a pretty cheap lunch.