Can you help me better understand why women want a SUV over a sedan?

[dishdude]

It made you bankrupt?

No, because I got rid of it in 2015.

 

[AlphaOmega]

No, because I got rid of it in 2015.

and that’s how you know it would have bankrupted you?

 

[AlphaOmega]

i like old European cars, they're cheap because nobody wants to fix them, well built, drive nice and make me money because I fix other people's cars to pay for gas for mine.
most German cars aren't harder than American cars to fix, exept germans use torx and e torx and have excessive amounts of sensors and computers

Well, at some point, they are not worth fixing, unless you do the job yourself. But with newer German cars from 3 year old to 8 year old ones, they are cheaper than they ought to be, because most people are just afraid of them, often irrationally. You can see the guy above - dishdude - thinks E class is a luxury car and that an 8 year old one will bankrupt its owner . And that’s coming from, supposedly, a car enthusiast who has owned multiple cars in his lifetime, including said E class. Imagine what the image is like inside the average general public head

 

[dishdude]

Well, at some point, they are not worth fixing, unless you do the job yourself. But with newer German cars from 3 year old to 8 year old ones, they are cheaper than they ought to be, because most people are just afraid of them, often irrationally. You can see the guy above - dishdude - thinks E class is a luxury car and that an 8 year old one will bankrupt its owner . And that’s coming from, supposedly, a car enthusiast who has owned multiple cars in his lifetime, including said E class. Imagine what the image is like inside the average general public head

The E Class is marketed as a luxury car in the US and anyone buying a 10 year old car for under $20k is likely on a budget and doesn't have a reserve to handle Mercedes priced repairs.

 

[CKN]

Late model cars have warranty and are taken to dealer. One can purchase additional factory warranty to 7 years 100k miles (or something like that). But an oil change, brake fluid flush and brakes can be done on European car by any more or less conscious independent shop. These are no meaningfully different than the same jobs on Toyota or Chevy. Really.

Anyways, on my E class, the only repair it required during 8+ years I have owned it is repairing leaking camshaft magnets (x4). It cost $685 at the dealer. How much would the same job cost on an American 6 cylinder car, at a dealer? Likely not meaningfully less.

The bottom line is whether maintenance and repair costs are above average or not-the perception is they are. And this accounts for the poor resale value of many European cars. Guys like you can take advantage of this-while the rest of us run the other way. I looked at Mercedes and Volvos before I purchased my wife's Highlander a month ago. Quite frankly I was astonished how low prices were even under current market conditions.

 

[GON]

Smart buyers know that Mercedes will bankrupt them trying to keep it on the road. Old luxury cars are for poor suckers.

My Hurricane Harvey 2005 S500 salvage flood vehicle has acquired 90k miles, driven across the USA multiple times, and between SLC and Denver at least a dozen times, has cost me next to nothing after the rebuild. And that is a V8 that gets 25 MPG at 70MPH+. 90k miles, and the biggest expense has been replacement tires......

Guess I am a poor sucker.........

 

[dishdude]

My Hurricane Harvey 2005 S500 salvage flood vehicle has acquired 90k miles, driven across the USA multiple times, and between SLC and Denver at least a dozen times, has cost me next to nothing after the rebuild. And that is a V8 that gets 25 MPG at 70MPH+. 90k miles, and the biggest expense has been replacement tires......

Guess I am a poor sucker.........

The average owner doesn't have your DIY skillset.

 

[SC Maintenance]

My Hurricane Harvey 2005 S500 salvage flood vehicle has acquired 90k miles, driven across the USA multiple times, and between SLC and Denver at least a dozen times, has cost me next to nothing after the rebuild. And that is a V8 that gets 25 MPG at 70MPH+. 90k miles, and the biggest expense has been replacement tires......

Guess I am a poor sucker.........

I got a burr that I wanted a 10 year old Mercedes a few years back and got looking around, but the S and other higher trims were still $30K+. I'll grant you my search didn't last long, so maybe there were better deals. I suppose that's a third of what they were new, but still not something I wanted to spend so I moved along. Had nothing to do with expected maintenance costs. I don't think most used car buyers want to spend that on a used sedan.

 

[FishFry]

Gents, thanks for all the information.

The takeaway is that suvs are viewed as easier to drive because of better visibility and seating position, and can offer more options for moving stuff.

For me personally it's all about space and comfort of what we used to call a "full size" car.

An other point is - a SUV by definition is based on a truck with a real frame. Basically a Suburban.
A unibody car is not a SUV - just saying, cause folks always get confused about this.

 

[GON]

For me personally it's all about space and comfort of what we used to call a "full size" car.

An other point is - a SUV by definition is based on a truck with a real frame. Basically a Suburban.
A unibody car is not a SUV - just saying, cause folks always get confused about this.

Does that mean a sedan without a real frame is not a car?

 

[AlphaOmega]

The E Class is marketed as a luxury car in the US and anyone buying a 10 year old car for under $20k is likely on a budget and doesn't have a reserve to handle Mercedes priced repairs.

What isn’t market in US as a “luxury” or “premium” product? Never underestimate the gullibility of an average person. First thing that comes to mind are “for rent” signs next to 50-70 year old drab shacks with fashionable names in Los Angeles area, advertising “luxury apartments”.

If my son or daughter would be coming of driving age and I’d budget $20k for their first car, for that $20k I certainly would purchase a German sedan over Chevy Equinox or similar (from the above example). One has to be very ignorant to do the opposite

The idea that a properly researched and selected Mercedes (as in, E class without Airmatic, fancy headlights, dynamic seat, etc) will be “breaking down left and right” at insane prices just doesn’t hold any water. You’re limping together a V8 twin turbo on its 5th owner with a deferred maintenance of $15k car with a 1-2 owner properly maintained 6 cylinder, no fancy options car. That’s just silly and is a housewife level of approach

A German sedan without luxury options is the same internal combustion engine + transmission + suspension + accessories affair, as any other car — it ain’t not nuclear reactor. If an ignition coil, or water pump, or a coolant hose, accessory belt or something similar will need repairing, it won’t be significantly more costly than on a said Chevy Equinox, and these and other items will be more durable on a Merc than on Chevy, because Chevy is a disposable econo car.

 

[vwmaniaman]

Replacement costs on parts has always been an issue with me. That is one reason that I really like my Dodge vehicles. They don't change mechanically "just because" so the after market can offer replacement parts at competitive prices. I also have 4 VW's that are all Classics that had reasonable part prices when they were newer. Classic status has raised the prices of their replacement parts. I own a 1993 Dodge based Roadtrek camper and a 07 Ram 1500 Laramie. If you can work on one you can work on the other. Last year on vacation, my wife and I had to replace a caliper that wouldn't release. Went to Oreillys after getting towed to Rapid City,SD. They had the caliper in stock for my 93 B350 chassis and we replaced it in the parking lot. The manager they was a tremendous friendly person and periodically checked our progress. After that replacement not another issue on our 4K miles vacation. That 5.2 magnum averaged 16 mpg loaded with stuff and the camper package. How many guys have a wife like mine that will help repair a vehicle. We have a game we play called "Get me home Robyn" We have had to be towed only 3 or 4 times in our 70+ years.

 

[ATex7239]

2 door cars are awful for egress and a hassle all around. My parents had a 70 something Cutlass Supreme 2 door and 78 Trans am Firebird and it was a hassle with us 3 kids. Then the 3 door Saab turbo.

100%. We had a Cutlass too. (I think everyone did lol.) Hated being in the back as a kid. I was much happier when we got a Caprice wagon.

 

[AlphaOmega]

The bottom line is whether maintenance and repair costs are above average or not-the perception is they are.

That’s what I meant when I said in US there is an irrational fear of German cars.

I looked at Mercedes and Volvos before I purchased my wife's Highlander a month ago.

What year is a Highlander? Could have gone with the GLE 350, where carfax shows one owner and on time servicing at a Merc dealer

Just for grins, I did a quick look up of things that first came to my head, that might be needed done with either car, and what it would cost on average, via repairpal.com. Can’t vouch for its accuracy, but should be in the ballpark:


*Spark plugs job is a wash:

Blower motor replacement, Toyota wins by $150

*Ignition coil job seems to be cheaper on a Merc:

*camshaft position sensor also seems cheaper

Did not look up other things, as this was a quick search.

 

[CKN]

That’s what I meant when I said in US there is an irrational fear of German cars.



What year is a Highlander? Could have gone with the GLE 350, where carfax shows one owner and on time servicing at a Merc dealer

Just for grins, I did a quick look up of things that first came to my head, that might be needed done with either car, and what it would cost on average, via repairpal.com. Can’t vouch for its accuracy, but should be in the ballpark:


*Spark plugs job is a wash:
View attachment 152491View attachment 152492

Blower motor replacement, Toyota wins by $150
View attachment 152493
View attachment 152494

*Ignition coil job seems to be cheaper on a Merc:
View attachment 152495
View attachment 152496

*camshaft position sensor also seems cheaper
View attachment 152497
View attachment 152498


Did not look up other things, as this was a quick search.

I don't keep my vehicles long enough to have to deal with any of the above. I have clicked around the above site as well. I don't find it accurate. Perception is everything-and that's what accounts (in part) for poor resale.

 

[AlphaOmega]

I don't keep my vehicles long enough to have to deal with any of the above.

Even more so, why did you decide to go with Toyota then, considering you did look at European cars? To save on perceptible cost of an “oil change”? It’s a sincere question

 

[IndyIan]

Even more so, why did you decide to go with Toyota then, considering you did look at European cars? To save on perceptible cost of an “oil change”? It’s a sincere question

Prepaid service at the dealer in Canada.

https://fs-sm360.s3.amazonaws.com/var/mercedes/MBCAN_PPM_Brochure_EN.pdf

For a gas E class, 4 services
4 oil changes @ 12k miles interval with tire rotations, 4 keyfob battery changes(MB thing?) ,1 air filter change, a brake fluid flush, clean/lube the panoramic roof, and check the other fluids but no changes, $3100. Servicing the brakes isn't explicitly mentioned so I doubt they include that?
That is about double than what my subaru dealer would charge for the same work in 48k miles, and that's with all the fluids actually changed(CVT, both diffs, brake fluid), and twice as many oil changes.

I would think the independent euro garages base their prices off the dealerships, and will be cheaper, but there's no reason to go way down to "dumb commoner" car service rates... Also in Canada, premium fuel is around 15-20% more, so the running costs just add up over most normal cars for people who don't do their own maintenance.
That said, I am impressed here with the low running costs of the DIY guys here for german lux cars, as with a bit of knowledge and parts searching, keeps the prices reasonable.

 

[CKN]

Even more so, why did you decide to go with Toyota then, considering you did look at European cars? To save on perceptible cost of an “oil change”? It’s a sincere question

I think we beat this horse enough. Enjoy your Mercedes.

 

[Pew]

That’s what I meant when I said in US there is an irrational fear of German cars.



What year is a Highlander? Could have gone with the GLE 350, where carfax shows one owner and on time servicing at a Merc dealer

Just for grins, I did a quick look up of things that first came to my head, that might be needed done with either car, and what it would cost on average, via repairpal.com. Can’t vouch for its accuracy, but should be in the ballpark:


*Spark plugs job is a wash:

Blower motor replacement, Toyota wins by $150


*Ignition coil job seems to be cheaper on a Merc:


*camshaft position sensor also seems cheaper



Did not look up other things, as this was a quick search.

Since we're going to pull up random websites, Consumer Reports and KBB also puts Merc at the very bottom of the list of reliability. Guess who's at the top? BMW is up there which is really nice.

 

[AlphaOmega]

Prepaid service at the dealer in Canada.

https://fs-sm360.s3.amazonaws.com/var/mercedes/MBCAN_PPM_Brochure_EN.pdf

For a gas E class, 4 services
4 oil changes @ 12k miles interval with tire rotations, 4 keyfob battery changes(MB thing?) ,1 air filter change, a brake fluid flush, clean/lube the panoramic roof, and check the other fluids but no changes, $3100. Servicing the brakes isn't explicitly mentioned so I doubt they include that?
That is about double than what my subaru dealer would charge for the same work in 48k miles, and that's with all the fluids actually changed(CVT, both diffs, brake fluid), and twice as many oil changes.

I would think the independent euro garages base their prices off the dealerships, and will be cheaper, but there's no reason to go way down to "dumb commoner" car service rates... Also in Canada, premium fuel is around 15-20% more, so the running costs just add up over most normal cars for people who don't do their own maintenance.
That said, I am impressed here with the low running costs of the DIY guys here for german lux cars, as with a bit of knowledge and parts searching, keeps the prices reasonable.

I don’t know about Subarus, so I also went and looked. What I learned is that Subaru (Canada) has 4 types of maintenance: A, B, C, D. B is bigger A, C is bigger than B…

Subarus (Canada) call for a 6 months or 6,000 miles service interval, and so requires 8 services within 48 months. More specifically: x4 service A + x3 Service B + x1 service C:

The cost of x4 service A + x3 Service B + x1 service C = $2,800 CA and does not include transmission service, unless I’ve missed it quickly glancing

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