Buying Used in an age of Complaints

[Lolvoguy]

Originally Posted By: Bhoppy1216
Hi everyone!

Been lurking for awhile and gotten great info, but I needed to ask a very specific question, so figured I would join up. I am in the market for a new to me car, as I usually always buy used, and I am just running into an issue that I am sure is just me mind screwing it to death. I started my journey by picking a few cars and then going onto carcomplaints.com, and boy was that a mistake. It seems like everywhere you turn every modern car model has some serious issue like consuming all the oil, total transmission failure, or blown head gaskets. I was seriously considering a 2009 Camry because they seem dependable, but then found out their condensers collect mold and smell the car up, and there seems to be no permanent fix. I hate to use the phrase "they dont make them like they used to" but it just seems to apply! I know not everyone is experiencing these issues, but it makes you think twice before throwing 5-10K at something that might just bust a 2K transmission bill on you. Advice, suggestions, reassurances?


While carcomplaints does have some useful info (like how my model year Focus and prior ones can to eat thru alternators), not everything can be taken as an absolute.

When I purchased this Focus 4 years ago at 60k miles, I was ready to be replacing the battery and alternator ASAP from personal experience and online reviews. Sure, the battery did fail shortly after purchase, but now at 100k miles I'm still on the OEM alternator. My guess is that the battery failure was from the car sitting on the dealer lot for a very long time, thereby killing it (lot rot).

In terms of the alternator issues after further research I discovered that those with electrical problems also seemed to have hatchbacks (mine is a sedan). The problem with the hatchback, is the wiring harness leading into the rear tail gate tends to break the wires inside, leading to all sorts of shorts and electrical glitches. Personally I believe it compromises the health of the electrical system in general.

Overall it's a hit or miss game. All manufacturers have their issues. It's up to you, the informed consumer to choose the issues your comfortable working through.

 

[JustN89]

When looking for a used car, I generally like USNews reviews and Edmunds Consumer Reviews. USNews seems to be pretty unbiased, they do a good job breaking down the pros/cons of each model, and they often go back around 10 years on the model too. For example here is the review for a 2007 Civic. The Edmunds Consumer reviews are pretty solid about posting both the good and the bad that can be had with the cars. The reviewers also post their mileage too so you can get an bit of an idea about longevity.

 

[planeman223]

Originally Posted By: AirgunSavant
I'd agree on the paint jobs from the Japanese in the 80's

So if the guy does not present a link it is nonsense?
Sounds like a lazy reader here. You could Google it yourself and see if there is a study. Just saying.......

Originally Posted By: planeman223
Originally Posted By: DdDd
The least reliable car sold today is more reliable than a Japanese car from the 90s which was once the hallmark of quality.

Not a chance. Link or this is complete nonsense.


Are the 80's the 90's? Still no link.

 

[Sunnyinhollister]

Interesting topic. The last two used car purchases made by our household had issues that were identified as "common" online. The first one was a two year old 2010 Mazda 3 with 40k on the clock. The clutch failed within a week with no warning signs after coming to a stop. Again there was no slippage before the failure. I've been driving manual transmissions since 1981 so I know how a slipping clutch feels. I ignored the complaints on the internet, Thankfully the selling dealer covered the repair. Here's just one of the many links for this:

https://www.consumerclasslawyersblog.com...-failure-fault/

We also recently purchased a three year old Honda CRV with under 20k miles and had all the maintenance history. I heard about the VCT actuator issue from a gentleman here, but bought the vehicle anyways. Sure enough, when it is cold out, the VCT acts up. When it gets to the point of consistantly causing issues I'll replace it. So much for japanese quality.

The funny thing is I also had 2 Chevy Cruzes and racked up a lot of miles on each one of them and I never had to take them to a dealer. If you look on line they have a ton of complaints.

I guess it's a gamble no matter what these days.

 

[Wolf359]

Originally Posted By: planeman223
Originally Posted By: DdDd
The least reliable car sold today is more reliable than a Japanese car from the 90s which was once the hallmark of quality.

Not a chance. Link or this is complete nonsense.


Technically true. Any new car sold today is more reliable than a car from the 90's. The car from the 90's is at least 18 years old. A new car will have at least a 3/36 warranty.

The old stuff like engines and transmissions are probably more reliable, you didn't hear of too many cars from the 90's making it to the 200k mark but now 200k is the new 100k. The new stuff like parking sensor, panoramic roofs may be tricker, but they don't affect the operation of the car.

As for the OP, if you read the car forums, you won't encounter everything you read, maybe 10-25% of things. And the good thing with that is that there are probably threads on how to fix them. If you don't find major problems that cost a lot to repair, you should go for it. Certain years can be better than others. It still seems true that first year models of a car refresh aren't as good as the 2nd year.

 

[DdDd]

Google defects per thousand and bone up.

It's been twenty+ years since then. Car factories are unrecognizable from the days of yore. You do realize you're not talking into a bag phone anymore right? Its not like cars are immune from advancing tech.

I didn't say there aren't unreliable cars. But what we consider a lemon has gotten way pickier over time.

Porsche is now the most reliable car sold in the US. You wouldn't see one coming from back in the day

 

[kschachn]

Originally Posted By: Wolf359
The old stuff like engines and transmissions are probably more reliable, you didn't hear of too many cars from the 90's making it to the 200k mark but now 200k is the new 100k.

I must be a statistical aberration then

 

[Wolf359]

Originally Posted By: kschachn
Originally Posted By: Wolf359
The old stuff like engines and transmissions are probably more reliable, you didn't hear of too many cars from the 90's making it to the 200k mark but now 200k is the new 100k.

I must be a statistical aberration then

There were always people at the other end of the bell curve that got a million mile out of their cars even in the 80's. But those were the exception. Many people confuse the exception with the norm. I had a car made in the 90's. Didn't even make it to 100k. I did have a car from the 80's that lasted to 150k, but it had the engine replaced 3 times before I finally gave up.

 

[DriveHard]

Originally Posted By: c502cid
Looking for a car for my kids I have run into the same thing. I use carcomplaints.com as a guide to see if the car I want has some troublesome areas I need to ask questions about and check first when I go look at the car. Use the website to your advantage because when you see a car has had thousands of power steering issues in a select model year, and the Craigslist ad for the same car says, "has a little power steering problem, a cheap fix according to my mechanic" you know it's not even worth looking at.


I kind of disagree with this a little. Actually I use common problems with a particular model as an advantage. If a car is known to have its power steering going out, and you find an ad that matches the description...often on forums for that car you can find step by step instructions on how to fix it. You pick up a car with a known problem, and you get it for a song and already know it is an easy fix! I picked up my last Ford Escort for $200...all it needed was an alternator. My daughter has been driving it for three years now trouble free.

 

[planeman223]

Originally Posted By: DdDd
Google defects per thousand and bone up.

It's been twenty+ years since then. Car factories are unrecognizable from the days of yore. You do realize you're not talking into a bag phone anymore right? Its not like cars are immune from advancing tech.

I didn't say there aren't unreliable cars. But what we consider a lemon has gotten way pickier over time.

Porsche is now the most reliable car sold in the US. You wouldn't see one coming from back in the day


You said THE LEAST reliable car today. Please DdDd, enlighten me on how the 2016 Ford Fiesta and Chrysler 200 are more reliable (and defect free) than the LS400.

 

[HangFire]

Originally Posted By: Bhoppy1216
Advice, suggestions, reassurances?


Every problem is an opportunity. I got a good deal on a Honda Pilot that turned out to have a blinking "D" light, probably the reason it was traded-in. I researched it online and decided it was likely the most common problem, it just needed two shift sensors. It was a $99 fix I did myself in one evening. Other people were paying for new transmissions or unloading them at a loss, because they believed the dealer.

Point is, if you fully inform yourself of a vehicle's flaws, and what it cost to fix them, you can use that to find a good deal, do the fix (or be prepared to do it), and enjoy the car.

 

[Tahoe4Life]

Originally Posted By: rooflessVW
I prefer to buy clean, high-mileage cars with a good service history, preferably one or two owners depending on age.

If the car is clean it was cared for.

Service history allows you to track any recurring issues or verify that common trouble spots have been corrected.

I like higher-mileage because to me, it would indicate that any "gremlins" are either non-existent or have already been addressed.

Buying cars this way has kept me in a string of mint-condition German cars, that have all been trouble free for me.


I do the exact same thing. I generally find very low mileage vehicles are not properly maintained.

 

[jeepman3071]

Originally Posted By: HangFire

Point is, if you fully inform yourself of a vehicle's flaws, and what it cost to fix them, you can use that to find a good deal, do the fix (or be prepared to do it), and enjoy the car.


This.

Like with anything else, knowledge is king. The more you educate yourself about a vehicle's potential flaws, the less likely you are to have surprise bills.

Complaints can also vary. There are many complaints on there about cars being unreliable because of stupid stuff like windows rolling up slow compared to other cars that have transmissions failing. I'll take the one with the slow windows.

A lot of the complaints you can tell in the review that the person never maintained the car or had any clue what they were buying. My favorites are the people who buy a luxury car like a BMW or Mercedes then say the car is not made well because the synthetic oil and the tires are expensive.

 

[PeterPolyol]

Originally Posted By: Bhoppy1216
I was seriously considering a 2009 Camry because they seem dependable, but then found out their condensers collect mold and smell the car up,


If that's the worst thing you can find on a 09 Camry, you're not researching.

 

[MuzzleFlash40]

Take car complaint web sites with a grain of salt. Since the vast majority of people are most likely to take issues to internet forums than the ones who had a positive experience. For every negative complaint there are hundreds who had a positive experience.

 

[Toros]

Originally Posted By: JustN89
When looking for a used car, I generally like USNews reviews and Edmunds Consumer Reviews. USNews seems to be pretty unbiased, they do a good job breaking down the pros/cons of each model, and they often go back around 10 years on the model too. For example here is the review for a 2007 Civic. The Edmunds Consumer reviews are pretty solid about posting both the good and the bad that can be had with the cars. The reviewers also post their mileage too so you can get an bit of an idea about longevity.


I found that US News is a solid source for Intel on used cars. Edmunds reviews are ok. Edmunds pricing model is idiotic. No one pays what Edmunds provides with their stupid TMV pricing. Fastest way to derail a price negotiation with a reputable dealer is by pulling out Edmunds estimate.

 

[PeterPolyol]

US News relies on JD Power for "reliability" rankings. No thanks.