Wearever rotors and other AAP parts

[mjoekingz28]

Its the oddest thing I tell ya. I got some wearever rotors on my Saturn and they were great for about 10k miles then acted like they were warping. So I took them back and the next set did the same thing, only this time they wouldn't accept them back, so I lived with it. After about 10-20k miles of the warping symptoms they smoothed out and have been great for 10s of thousands of miles.

Another one is the GMB water pump. I installed it and after 10k miles the coolant light came on and I investigated and saw the weep hole was wet, so I reperformed the job and after 10k miles on the 2nd pump the light once again came on. I just decided to live with and didn't investigate where the leak was from, but for a while I had to add a pint every 8500 miles. So I thought a $12 gallon of coolant every 100k or so doesnt seem to bad to live with. Well after adding a pint every 8000 or so for a few times, it began getting longer between fill ups.

So I say if your AAP parts seem to go bad, just give them a little while to work out the kinks.

 

[demarpaint]

I've been doing brake jobs since the 70's and about 18 months ago used AAP Wearever pads and rotors for my Aerostar. The Rotors warped in about 2000 miles and I demanded another set. 15,000 miles into the replacement rotors I can tell you they suck too. Worst brake job results I ever had. The rotors I tossed with well over 100,000 miles on them were better.

On damp mornings I have to ride the brakes as I roll out of the driveway, otherwise the first stop is jerky. I've never experienced this, and I've done more brake jobs than I can count.

 

[SteveSRT8]

Originally Posted By: demarpaint
I've been doing brake jobs since the 70's and about 18 months ago used AAP Wearever pads and rotors for my Aerostar. The Rotors warped in about 2000 miles and I demanded another set. 15,000 miles into the replacement rotors I can tell you they suck too. Worst brake job results I ever had. The rotors I tossed with well over 100,000 miles on them were better.

On damp mornings I have to ride the brakes as I roll out of the driveway, otherwise the first stop is jerky. I've never experienced this, and I've done more brake jobs than I can count.


As I'm sure you know, this symptom is describing a pad problem, not a rotor problem.

 

[CharBaby]

Most AAP parts that I have purchaced worked as they should have. The Wearever rotors didn't seem to hold up very well IMHO! And as mjoekingz28 and demarpaint have both mentioned about the warping Wearever rotors, this is my experience too.

Wearever pads didn't seem to be anything special either but, I didn't really have any complaints with the AAP pads/shoes as far as stopping power but, they did seem to warped the rotors very soon. I think once, in 10-12 yrs and two vehicles did I have a pad detatch from it's backing plate and fall apart. And I noticed lots of heat cracks in the pad material even after only a year of two while still having lots of pad thickness remaining.

I have had much better success with other brands of rotors such as, BREMBO and Centric rotors and just about anything name brand in a ceramic pad(Raybestos, Bendix, Akebono, Satisfied, Centric).

 

[demarpaint]

Originally Posted By: SteveSRT8
Originally Posted By: demarpaint
I've been doing brake jobs since the 70's and about 18 months ago used AAP Wearever pads and rotors for my Aerostar. The Rotors warped in about 2000 miles and I demanded another set. 15,000 miles into the replacement rotors I can tell you they suck too. Worst brake job results I ever had. The rotors I tossed with well over 100,000 miles on them were better.

On damp mornings I have to ride the brakes as I roll out of the driveway, otherwise the first stop is jerky. I've never experienced this, and I've done more brake jobs than I can count.


As I'm sure you know, this symptom is describing a pad problem, not a rotor problem.


That's what I thought after 2000 miles and took the rotors to my buddies machine shop and had him confirm they were warped before I returned them. He told me the rotors I bought sucked. What I neglected to say was I had AAP replace both rotors and pads to start fresh again. I figured that cheap rotors were better than the ones that had over 100K on them, and I'd be getting rid of the vehicle anyway. At this point I'm living with it because as I approach 200,000 miles I'm seriously considering getting rid of the vehicle and am not interested in fooling around with it anymore, that could change though.

 

[CharBaby]

Yeah demarpaint, I was doing that too for a while, years in fact. You know, returning the brake parts and getting new parts again under the warranty. But this becomes old hat after awhile! I just didn't want to keep doing this all the time. Knees and back aren't in the shape they once were as I don't have the luxury of a lift since dad retired and sold the shop(ESSO Station) in '79.

For a while there, my BIL was doing this too. And then he got my neices/nephews doing the same thing and it seemed as though we(I)was doing brakes all of the time! First my Sis and BIL vehicles, then one kid and another, and another. They were all driving and bought their own cars. And every time they needed brakes, they went to AAP to get those cheap Wearevers' and called uncle(ME) to install'em...Geeeesh!

I mean ya know, I have my own cars too! Finaly I had to stop or soon I won't be able to walk anymore.

You know, for an old vehicle on the cheap or a car that need to pass inspection or being sold, the Wearever or anything cheap is fine. But when your keeping the vehicle for years, put on some good stuff and enjoy'em without having to change them out every year or sooner.

 

[demarpaint]

LOL, yes the warranty return re-do deal can get old real fast. If it were my Jeep or E-150 I'd toss the parts and move on to another brand. The Aerostar wears the beater badge so I'm living with it. Here I thought I was doing the right thing tossing 100K+ mile rotors, and I shot myself in the foot it seems. I know plenty of people who had good luck with these parts, I struck out!

 

[CharBaby]

Yeah, I had to learn too! Mostly from personal experience. Can't go by what others say. YMMV! Now, I buy good stuff.

Speaking of Beaters! I love old beaters! Don't have to worry where you park'em or if it gets another ding/dent. Or, Oh Gee, I need to change the oil @ 3K! Or, different brands of tires(as long at they're the same size). Or, if your using Wearever brake parts

 

[demarpaint]

Originally Posted By: Char Baby
Yeah, I had to learn too! Mostly from personal experience. Can't go by what others say. YMMV! Now, I buy good stuff.

Speaking of Beaters! I love old beaters! Don't have to worry where you park'em or if it gets another ding/dent. Or, Oh Gee, I need to change the oil @ 3K! Or, different brands of tires(as long at they're the same size). Or, if your using Wearever brake parts

I couldn't have said it better!

 

[stephen9666]

Originally Posted By: mjoekingz28
After about 10-20k miles of the warping symptoms they smoothed out.


If they were truly warped, I don't think they would smooth out. Improper pad material distribution can also cause a pulsing pedal. I would guess that is what you were experiencing.

How did you break the pads in?

 

[mjoekingz28]

Some say you bed in the pads by repeated hard stops.

On new cars they say to go easy on the brakes for 500 miles.



I think (100k ago) I did some hard braking with Wearever silvers. Then 10k comes and warp. Keep the silvers on and new rotors, no special break in. 10s of 1000s of miles later and they are smooth and just recently went to Wearever Golds which are great and again just took it easy for a few days. Alot of hwy miles btw.

 

[SteveSRT8]

From one of the most respected names in braking:


http://www.stoptech.com/tech_info/wp_warped_brakedisk.shtml

 

[stephen9666]

Originally Posted By: mjoekingz28
Some say you bed in the pads by repeated hard stops.

On new cars they say to go easy on the brakes for 500 miles.




But what did you do, and what did the documents that came with the pads recommend?

 

[mechanicx]

Originally Posted By: SteveSRT8
From one of the most respected names in braking:


http://www.stoptech.com/tech_info/wp_warped_brakedisk.shtml


What that stoptech page says that rotor warpage is really rotor thickness variation due to uneven deposits is true, but the caveat is important:

Quote:
With one qualifier, presuming that the hub and wheel flange are flat and in good condition and that the wheel bolts or hat mounting hardware is in good condition, installed correctly and tightened uniformly and in the correct order to the recommended torque specification


But that's key. With a normally driven street car most all thickness variation is caused by rotor runout with new pads and rotors existing when installed. Whether the runout is caused by the things mentioned like hub flange condition and trueness, wheel bolt torque or a cheap and improperly machined rotors that are not true, if there is more than about .002" runout at the rotor then thickness variation will set in after about 5-6000 miles or so.

Also that webpage I think is talking about top quality high performance parts driven hard mostly on the track but also some street driving. I don't think it is really addressing poor quality rotors that may have metallurgy and machining quality issues, not to mention poor balancing of the assembly or poor pad quality.

I think hot rotors driven through a cold puddle of water can cause warpage though.

I'm not really saying the webpage is wrong. I just think too much emphasis is being placed on bedding-in/burnishing/breaking-in the pads. My experience has been with good parts and good brake work no special burnishing procedure is needed to have problem free brakes, just a slow and easy break-in is all that's needed. I think pad and rotor quality, and not having excessive rotor runout at assembly especially is key.

 

[fdcg27]

You are right, of course.
However, I think we had an experience of pad deposition on the '97 Accord last year.
A baaad pulsation, that went away over some miles.
Anyway, I agree that it does not pay to scrimp on parts.
When I was young, and didn't mind doing the same job twice (maybe three times!) over the remaining life of a car, I bought cheap, since it came with a lifetime gaurantee anyway (Who remebers Nationwise?).
As I have gotten older, I have come to realize that it pays to buy quality parts for a few bucks more, and do a job once.

 

[Dan55]

I agree , the article specifically mentions the bedding process for a high performance street pad. I looked at Wearever for my Fit. They lacked holes for the 2 rotor screws, Which everyone tells me you don't need. Then why did Honda put not one but two rotor screws?

 

[pottymouth]

Originally Posted By: Dan55
I agree , the article specifically mentions the bedding process for a high performance street pad. I looked at Wearever for my Fit. They lacked holes for the 2 rotor screws, Which everyone tells me you don't need. Then why did Honda put not one but two rotor screws?


I would rather have the holes for insurance, but they really are not needed if anti-sieze is applied in the proper places before the rotor is installed.

Given the choice, I'll take the holes.

 

[Bottom_Feeder]

Originally Posted By: Dan55
I agree , the article specifically mentions the bedding process for a high performance street pad. I looked at Wearever for my Fit. They lacked holes for the 2 rotor screws, Which everyone tells me you don't need. Then why did Honda put not one but two rotor screws?

The Wearever rotors I recently bought for my Subaru were the same way, threaded holes on the originals but not on the replacements. The Wearevers simply fit ever so slightly looser on the hub, just a hair, so they were still perfectly centered but didn't need to be persuaded on or off, making the threaded holes unnecessary.

I was a little leery about buying them at first, but now I'm glad I did. They seem to be of a good quality, certainly better than the NAPA rotors I put on the rear last year. The NAPAs have a lip on the inside that the originals didn't have that rubs against the backing plate in harder turns. The hats also rusted immediately whereas the Wearevers have a black coating on them to prevent that.

I feel a whole lot better about the brake job I did with the Advance parts in the front than the NAPA parts I used in the rear. Well, except for the Gold Ceramic pads that don't have a lot of initial bite, but that's a different issue.

 

[Dan55]

The Fit comes with 2 countersunk holes for rotor screws and another 2 for removal. At the first tire rotation I anti seize the back of the rotor and the rotor screws. I declined on the Wearever because I need a rotor that will last longer than the OE and didn't want to chance them.

 

[mechanicx]

The two main causes of brake pulsation, which is caused by rotor thickness variation, is lateral run out of the rotor causing uneven wearing of the rotor surfaces and the second is corrosion.

The pad and rotor interface can corrode causing varying degrees of thickness variation or even causing the rotor to flake of, depending on how long the corrosion has been going on. You can't fix severe corrosion with re-burnishing the pads, the rotors will have to be turned or replaced of course. Minor thickness variation and corrosion can be fixed by using the brakes over time. This is why minor pulasation can clear up on its own over time with using the brakes lightly.

It's possible cheap pads and rotors tend to corrode more on top of having rotor run out.