The cost of living in 2024....

[Astro14]

I want to say over $200k and it was more than 10 years ago. …I was once getting an eye exam and I asked the Dr how come I got him (ophthalmologist) and not an optometrist, and it set him off, saying he went to med school, can perform surgery, etc. At any rate with a PPO I can see someone like that for the copay for a medical eye exam. But at that time it was for glasses. Ok I’ll tell the story once we heard helicopters flying overhead. He and his daughter lived several blocks away and were arrested for growing and prescribing weed out of their house. I suppose before it was legal like today

Edit PS we used to park at Temple School of Podiatry. I was half being a wise a** cuz the driver was my friend Doug who was at the time a resident in radiology. I asked him are podiatrists doctors….he said don’t get me started. If you played for the Flyers, who would you see with a foot problem. That or an orthopedic surgeon?

That would set me off, too, if I were a doctor. That’s a flat out insult.

 

[John105]

That would set me off, too, if I were a doctor. That’s a flat out insult.

You took it the wrong way. He was set off saying he should not be doing eye exams as he is a medical doctor qualified to do surgery.

The door opened and a receptionist said he was in the wrong exam room, I’m just here for eyeglasses.

Interesting you interpreted it such that I insulted him. It’s perspective I guess. I totally get that I don’t always explain things fully but still find your response noteworthy.

 

[JustN89]

For decades, we've pushed on kids the idea that, in order to be successful, you need to go to college. Unsurprisingly, the number of students who decided to pursue higher education skyrocketed. In 1970, there were roughly 6.3 million undergraduate students in universities around the nation. Ten years later, that number was over 10 million. After 20 years, that number had increased again to nearly 14 million. By 2010, 18.1 million students were enrolled in undergraduate programs. While enrollment numbers have declined since 2010, it's not by much, and the bar has been set. So many people now have undergraduate degrees that it has basically become a prerequisite for many career fields, even ones that really shouldn't need it.

On top of that, universities, high school counselors, and even parents aren't guiding their kids enough to worthwhile degrees. Instead, society propagates the adage that students should just study what they are interested in. While this is not entirely a bad thing, spending the same money per semester for a Liberal Arts degree as you would for a STEM degree is a bad investment.

Which young adults don't understand anyways because schools do a terrible job of teaching useful financial skills before their students go off into the real world. Kids in my school district have to have 2 years of a foreign language to graduate, but don't have to have a basic understanding of how to pay their taxes, how different interest rates work, etc. It's sad when you really think about it. It also reminds me of a guy I graduated from school with, who graduated with the same degree as I did. He graduated with 3X the student loan debt I did. He wasn't dumb, but he lacked the financial intelligence that should be required before we allow our students to sign themselves up for loans that they will never get out of until they're repaid.

 

[BMWTurboDzl]

That chart displays exactly what those of use who have put kids through college already knew - college vastly outstripped inflation.

Through posts here, many of you know that I went to college on a combination of financial aid, student loans, and academic scholarship. My Dad’s out of pocket for me was about $3,000/year. I was intimately involved in the process, and knew all the numbers as I was the one signing for loans, which were paid back while I was in the Navy, and I had various campus jobs, including teaching assistant in the physics department.

Many of you also know that my wife and I put our six kids through college, from 2008-2022, we had at least one, and up to four, kids in college at the same time. I know exactly what college cost us, and we were able to get out kids through without loans, but the cost now, in relation to things like cars, or houses, or a gallon of gas, was brutally high.

The “no loans” objective for us was critical. We did not want the kids saddled with debt upon graduation.

Our kids all graduated and got jobs, or went on the advanced degrees. For those advanced degrees, the loans made sense, as the job would allow the loans to be paid back. The daughter who is a surgeon is not going to have a problem paying back her roughly $180,000 in loans for medical school. In fact, while still a Resident (think, low pay while in training) she has already paid off two of the private loans, that had higher interest rates.

We believed in education for the sake of education. That our kids should have the chance to learn, through college.

But, and it is an important but, we, and they, knew that being financially independent was the ultimate goal.

So, the surgeon - took on big loans, knowing precisely what she was doing, and going into a career that allowed her to enjoy the gains from the investment in her advanced education.

What continues to shock and disappoint me is how many students, and how many parents, fail to consider and plan how the finances of college will work. Little Suzie gets her degree in graphic design, for example, and borrows over $100,000, and then finds out what a graphic designer makes, and cries that she can’t pay back her loans.

What kind of fool enters into that kind of situation without doing the simplest of research on the cost of a degree and the anticipated salary from the degree that was earned?

Apparently, that foolishness is common.

I don't think anything will change until a mass of employers start to reconsider college graduate as a requirement for employment.

 

[Pew]

I don't think anything will change until a mass of employers start to reconsider college graduate as a requirement for employment.

I agree. Some of these requirements are ridiculous. Bahelor's degree for min/near-min wage front desk receptionist or IT help desk...bachelor's degree for min wage environmental scientist....etc.

 

[Rmay635703]

Liability insurance for 1 person is $3500 a year now.

I could drive uninsured and buy another used car every year and be ahead

And People wonder why the uninsured rate is 50% in some areas.

 

[SeaJay]

I don't think anything will change until a mass of employers start to reconsider college graduate as a requirement for employment.

There are so many unemployed college grads running around, why not make it a requirement.

 

[Astro14]

You took it the wrong way. He was set off saying he should not be doing eye exams as he is a medical doctor qualified to do surgery.

The door opened and a receptionist said he was in the wrong exam room, I’m just here for eyeglasses.

Interesting you interpreted it such that I insulted him. It’s perspective I guess. I totally get that I don’t always explain things fully but still find your response noteworthy.

Then, I apologize - I totally took it the wrong way. I had thought that he found the exchange insulting, and now, I understand what he was upset about - he was overqualified to be doing the work.

In which case, I find his conduct unprofessional. If he is part of the practice, and they're short staffed, well, he can pitch in without complaining about it. Whining in front of your patients shows poor emotional control.

 

[BMWTurboDzl]

There are so many unemployed college grads running around, why not make it a requirement.

Because it's not always needed for the job.

 

[Passport1]

Must be agonizing having college age children.

For many of these young, vulnerable adults college is a final rite de passage from mommy/daddy to the world. While the comforting light of one fades the next blinds them.

What have they done that prepares them for that?

 

[supton]

Must be agonizing having college age children.

For many of these young, vulnerable adults college is a final rite de passage from mommy/daddy to the world. While the comforting light of one fades the next blinds them.

What have they done that prepares them for that?

Good question—I know it was a hard transition from college to career for myself. Drinking and putting on weight was how I dealt with it.

I have a suspicion that my kids will just return home for a bit. One I suspect may never move out, he’s doing college local, the other may transition well. But we won’t know until she’s in college and done a couple of years. If it isn’t her path, she too will wind up at home, regroup, replan. But if it is her path, then I suspect she’ll network and do quite well.

This is where dorm life may be great, but getting off campus after a year or two is for the best. Bit of training wheels before you really start living like an adult and nobody is holding your hand, while you apartment shop nor write the check for the rent.

 

[alarmguy]

Must be agonizing having college age children.

For many of these young, vulnerable adults college is a final rite de passage from mommy/daddy to the world. While the comforting light of one fades the next blinds them.

What have they done that prepares them for that?

I think we agree?

I think the only blame is in the home itself.
You want your kids to succeed provide guidance, not coddling and endless shelter.

So the question is what have the parents done?
The only young people I know from my friends and family are successful in life, able to support themselves without hand outs and provide for their food and shelter

 

[mez]

My wife is a RN at a major union hospital in Boston. She has been there 35 years so she is at the top of her pay scale. She makes like $80+/hr and starting nurses start around $34/hr. Minimum wage in MA is $15/hr. We have friends in NC and his wife is a RN with over 30 years at same hospital and only makes like $40/hr. Have her apply for jobs in MA!!

 

[SC Maintenance]

I don't think anything will change until a mass of employers start to reconsider college graduate as a requirement for employment.

Maybe true but the big issue as I see it - there is absoluletly no skill required to get a high school diploma. If you show up, you pass. Even if you don't show up and mommy and daddy complain, you pass. You think the kids these days are worthless - give it another year or two - where your new grads only went to high school post pandemic. Your in for a real treat.

 

[SC Maintenance]

South Carolina can not find public school teachers. There paying bonuses and all kinds of things trying to get them.

But getting a teachers degree requires 4 years of college, the degree in one of the 3 state schools that teach it is going to run $120 to $150K.

Starting teacher pay even after all the bonuses is around $45K. If you teach summer school and do all the extra stuff, like after school tutoring, etc - you might get $55K. Beni's are good, and the pension looks OK if you ignore the fact of how underfunded it actually is. so not enough takers, and for good reason.

Nursing pays great now - but who is going to pay when Medicare goes bankrupt - current schedule is 2031. Yes, they will "find a way", which will result in lower payments, lower services, more money printing and more inflation.

So there are going to be consequences for everyone due to the rising cost of college, IMHO.

 

[BMWTurboDzl]

Maybe true but the big issue as I see it - there is absoluletly no skill required to get a high school diploma. If you show up, you pass. Even if you don't show up and mommy and daddy complain, you pass. You think the kids these days are worthless - give it another year or two - where your new grads only went to high school post pandemic. Your in for a real treat.

I don't remember there ever being a skill requirement to graduate HS. The only difference is that schools in the past had trades classes and there were trades schools. I have a bunch of older cousins who graduated HS went to work and college via night school.

 

[Owen Lucas]

This stuff REALLY accelerated when higher education was deemed to be available to all, through money for the institutions through whatever - any and all pathways that worked. Tuition skyrocketed.

I believe a previous admin also omitted student loans from bankruptcy proceedings, so the loans follow you for life unless you become an expat. Either way many loans are being forgiven now, but I don't think that applies to OP unfortunately.

She has accepted a position at a local Children's Hospital. She will work one month on day shift and then work night shift from then on. Base rate of pay for day shift is $22.66/hour and there is a $5/hour differential for night shift, where she will make $27.66.

This hospital is in a downtown urban area, a larger city and I don't want her driving 30+ minutes each way before/after a 13-14 hour shift.

Pay will be higher in more rural areas, but what 25 year old wants to live in the boonies?

She can also look into locums work / travel positions after a year of experience and make 2 - 4x or more. Just make sure to not get abused by the locums companies. She can also 1099 and contract directly with hospitals, be your own boss.


@Hillbilly Deluxe Here's my best advice for your daughter:

TELL HER TO FIND AN MD / DO / RESIDENT AND MARRY THEM, THE MRS. DEGREE IS HER WAY OUT.

You know this is what the nurses are all about. She'll be working mostly with ICU doctors and general surgery, both are very lucrative.

Aim high, look for a nice anesthesiologist, radiologist, orthopedic / plastic surgeon, any surgeon really. Bonus points for hepatopancreaticobiliary surgeon (liver transplants), radiation oncologist, or a brain surgeon.

 

[supton]

Maybe true but the big issue as I see it - there is absoluletly no skill required to get a high school diploma. If you show up, you pass. Even if you don't show up and mommy and daddy complain, you pass. You think the kids these days are worthless - give it another year or two - where your new grads only went to high school post pandemic. Your in for a real treat.

No doubt. I think my son crashed and burned at college due to this--HS just pushes them through, because of this, and also because not everyone matures at the same rate (but more of the former). School from home (SFH?) didn't work for my kids, they hated it (me, I loved WFH!). But my wife was complaining about kids at college pre-pandemic, the problems predate that time period (but absolutely not helped by that catastrophe).

South Carolina can not find public school teachers. There paying bonuses and all kinds of things trying to get them.

But getting a teachers degree requires 4 years of college, the degree in one of the 3 state schools that teach it is going to run $120 to $150K.

Starting teacher pay even after all the bonuses is around $45K.

Just doesn't make sense. The numbers don't work, for anyone. Not unless if they got a number of grants/scholarships and didn't rack up a six figure bill. Starting to sound like those memes for job ads where they require 7 years experience in something that was invented 2 years ago.

Wife and I talked about this subject today. She wonders if, back when we went to school, if parents didn't pay for more of this than parents today. Back then, her parents took out a HELOC to pay for a chunk of her college.

 

[SC Maintenance]

I don't remember there ever being a skill requirement to graduate HS. The only difference is that schools in the past had trades classes and there were trades schools. I have a bunch of older cousins who graduated HS went to work and college via night school.

In my day you had to at least show up and hand stuff in. No longer required. Not kidding.

 

[Trav]

My wife is a RN at a major union hospital in Boston. She has been there 35 years so she is at the top of her pay scale. She makes like $80+/hr and starting nurses start around $34/hr. Minimum wage in MA is $15/hr. We have friends in NC and his wife is a RN with over 30 years at same hospital and only makes like $40/hr. Have her apply for jobs in MA!!

My wife is an NP, it pays around 125k in mid state MA and more in Boston. I would not recommend anyone applying for a job in MA, this hell hole rivals CA and NY as one of the worst states in the country.