Pennzoil's cleaning claims - Updated!

[NMBurb02]

Originally Posted By: KrisZ
Originally Posted By: Johnny248
Before I get shot at, I just thought I throw out my idea on this whole idea of "cleaning" engines...Most engines don't have a problem with not being clean if oil changes have been performed at normal intervals with a quality oil to begin with?


You're right, most engines that are regurarly maintained don't need cleaning.
Here is my Focus with 85k miles and nothing but MC 5w20 by the previous owner. What's exactly there to clean?

Here is my Mazda with about 105k miles. First 60k was with some dino, and various synthetics, the rest were done with dino. Both look exactly the same cleanliness wise.

How does this address Pennzoil's claims of keeping pistons clean? Much different operating environment. A view of the top end of your engine through the oil fill hole (or even under the full valve covers) does not show the cleanliness of the pistons.

 

[zerosoma]

I want to create my own oil company. Not because I'm good with it, but because I think Pennzoil is cocky and needs to be taken out. I hear Pennzoil is now accepting competitors' coupons. This week's special... all of our oil, completely free. Special note : not eligible with any zerosoma oil company products. Free oil refinery with purchase...of one quart.

 

[ottotheclown]

In this thread photos show syn blend and dino keep an engine as clean as the syn pictures .... that is re. cam lobes. Nobody to my knowledge showed their pistons which is the main subject eh???Psst wanna see my pistons??? It is easy to say a difficult to show part is cleaner in a website and that is why all these claims are a waste of eyesight IMHO.

 

[tig1]

I have seen a Vulcan ford engine with 185K at 10K OCIs(a good friend of mine) disassembled because the car went through a country road that had been over flowed by a flooded creek. The engine hydrauliced and broke a rod. My friend was able to rebuild the engine as there was no block damage, but all parts were very clean and spec'd factory. I personally saw all the parts and can tell you the pistons and rings were very clean. Many engines that begin to burn oil suffer from coked rings due to dino OCI abuse, but in all of my 35 years using M1 oils have never had an engine use more oil at the end of my ownership than at the time I purchased the vehicle and some have gone well in excess of 300K. I know nothing about Pennz oils as I haven't used them, but M1 oils will keep your engine clean, as they are well known for.

 

[Clevy]

Originally Posted By: DuckRyder
Originally Posted By: Clevy
...
Honestly I believe most of these claims are just noise. . ...


I agree it is pretty much all marketing.

I do like Mobil1, I've used it for many years and will continue to use it until I have an oil related failure. (I'd say the chance of that happening is about the same as me winning the power ball, which is to say near 0)

I do like the test Mobil does and post like the million mile Mercedes and the Taxi's as well as the older one involving the E30 325i. I know they (the test) aren't respected here but to me that stuff is more meaningful than graphs without scales and "25% cleaner pistons".

What I've learned here in relation to oils and filters is that I just don't think it matters that much.

As much as the marketing is noise, so too is all the nail biting around here about which oil cleans the best, which filters have paper end caps or dome end bypasses and what oil has a few extra PPM of whatever element on a UOA. I mean we have got two not too bad UOAs on blown up motors in the UOA section...

I consider all the UOAs and filter cutting I do entertainment value and if I "waste" some oil or money in the process that doesn't matter to me either.


On that I do agree. This is the least expensive of my hobbies. If I spend a few extra bucks on a jug of liqui-moly oil or save a few buying pp on sale it's fun for me. I doubt my engine will live any longer nor do I thinks I'm shortening its life by using different things.

 

[Clevy]

Originally Posted By: tig1
I have seen a Vulcan ford engine with 185K at 10K OCIs(a good friend of mine) disassembled because the car went through a country road that had been over flowed by a flooded creek. The engine hydrauliced and broke a rod. My friend was able to rebuild the engine as there was no block damage, but all parts were very clean and spec'd factory. I personally saw all the parts and can tell you the pistons and rings were very clean. Many engines that begin to burn oil suffer from coked rings due to dino OCI abuse, but in all of my 35 years using M1 oils have never had an engine use more oil at the end of my ownership than at the time I purchased the vehicle and some have gone well in excess of 300K. I know nothing about Pennz oils as I haven't used them, but M1 oils will keep your engine clean, as they are well known for.


I don't think anyone can argue with the success tig has had using m1 oils.

 

[ottotheclown]

Originally Posted By: Clevy
Originally Posted By: tig1
I have seen a Vulcan ford engine with 185K at 10K OCIs(a good friend of mine) disassembled because the car went through a country road that had been over flowed by a flooded creek. The engine hydrauliced and broke a rod. My friend was able to rebuild the engine as there was no block damage, but all parts were very clean and spec'd factory. I personally saw all the parts and can tell you the pistons and rings were very clean. Many engines that begin to burn oil suffer from coked rings due to dino OCI abuse, but in all of my 35 years using M1 oils have never had an engine use more oil at the end of my ownership than at the time I purchased the vehicle and some have gone well in excess of 300K. I know nothing about Pennz oils as I haven't used them, but M1 oils will keep your engine clean, as they are well known for.


I don't think anyone can argue with the success tig has had using m1 oils.

 

[KrisZ]

Originally Posted By: NMBurb02
How does this address Pennzoil's claims of keeping pistons clean? Much different operating environment. A view of the top end of your engine through the oil fill hole (or even under the full valve covers) does not show the cleanliness of the pistons.


It doesn't have to, but in most cases a clean engine on top is also clean everywhere else. Pennzoil's claims are just another marketing angle at something that doesn't need fixing when regular maintenance is done. Since Mobil 1 has taken the top end photos for their marketing campaign, Pennzoil just took something else, that's all.

I have yet to see a clean looking engine on top with stuck rings and burning tons of oil, have you?

 

[OVERKILL]

I'm really tempted to order this oil:

http://www.epc.shell.com/Docs/GPCDOC_X_cbe_24855_key_140007500286_20130123090_5.pdf

Look at that NOACK!!! And it is VERY close to M1 0w-40 in the certs/approvals department

 

[antiqueshell]

Originally Posted By: KrisZ


It doesn't have to, but in most cases a clean engine on top is also clean everywhere else. Pennzoil's claims are just another marketing angle at something that doesn't need fixing when regular maintenance is done.


This.

 

[midnightlaundry]

How many miles would it take for Ultra to clean a varnished motah?

Doesn't Shell make Pennz? Is Shell the King?

 

[gregoron]

What's the VI? I doubt it will be higher than M1 0W-40.

 

[OVERKILL]

Originally Posted By: gregoron
What's the VI? I doubt it will be higher than M1 0W-40.


It doubt it too. And it isn't listed

 

[JohnnyZ52]

This isn't about cockiness. If you're putting out great products that are better than the competition and can back it up, why wouldn't you say so? Reputation means everything in the auto industry. If Fords are viewed as unreliable, their sales will take a hit. If Castrol is viewed as having sludge-prone oil, their sales will take a hit. Pennzoil can change their perception by putting stuff like this out. What other way would you suggest? Put out a better product year after year and wait 20 years for consumers to catch on?

 

[FoxS]

Originally Posted By: OVERKILL
Originally Posted By: gregoron
What's the VI? I doubt it will be higher than M1 0W-40.


It doubt it too. And it isn't listed

166

 

[FoxS]

Originally Posted By: OVERKILL
I'm really tempted to order this oil:

http://www.epc.shell.com/Docs/GPCDOC_X_cbe_24855_key_140007500286_20130123090_5.pdf

Look at that NOACK!!! And it is VERY close to M1 0w-40 in the certs/approvals department

I have 12 quarts of this for the next oil change in my Mercedes.

Cost me far less than M1 0w40 though.

But I received SM dated Sep / Oct 2012. Interesting to see a Jan 2013 PDS for the SN version.

 

[gregoron]

With VI of 166 vs M1's 185 for 0W-40, that's pretty low. The Mag1 5W-40 I'm using now has 170, and I got it for $32 per 6 qts. If it's cheaper than that, I'd get it. But to compete with M1 for the same price, I'd go for M1.

 

[PZR2874]

ALOT of Speed guys use that oil due to our fuel dilution issues. I myself have never used it.

 

[OVERKILL]

Originally Posted By: FoxS
Originally Posted By: OVERKILL
Originally Posted By: gregoron
What's the VI? I doubt it will be higher than M1 0W-40.


It doubt it too. And it isn't listed

166


This from the older PDS?

 

[panthermike]

Originally Posted By: OVERKILL
Originally Posted By: FoxS
Originally Posted By: OVERKILL
Originally Posted By: gregoron
What's the VI? I doubt it will be higher than M1 0W-40.


It doubt it too. And it isn't listed

166


This from the older PDS?


That's a good question, although I think the VI importance is overblown here. Give the Pennzoil a try, I don't think many people have used it.