Indian Firm to Buy Cooper Tire for $2.5 Billion

[JHZR2]

Well, if Apollo has cash and some size, then new Apollo is larger than old Cooper, isnt it?

Or do you think that this is somehow magically good for the American worker and plants?

 

[mrsilv04]

Originally Posted By: JHZR2
Or do you think that this is somehow magically good for the American worker and plants?


It ceased to be about the "American worker and plants" some years ago.

Now, it is all about the American *union*.

 

[Trav]

Originally Posted By: JHZR2
Well, if Apollo has cash and some size, then new Apollo is larger than old Cooper, isnt it?

Or do you think that this is somehow magically good for the American worker and plants?


With articles like these its not hard to see through the smoke and mirrors. America is selling its work force and industrial base one company at a time.
I read comments like "they employ American workers paying US dollars" which is true but its short term, these workers will be facing unemployment a little later thats all the the work place will be gone with no chance of reopening.
That argument doesn't hold water. If every US company was owned by overseas interest but keeps the workforce employed the entire US economy is being sent overseas leaving America to exist on basically a rotating service economy.

Quote:
In December 2008, Mississippi vied with other Cooper Tire plant locations to keep the plant open when the company said the weakening economy would cause it to shutter one of its U.S. plants. Noting the plant provided $2.1 million annually in taxes for the community and schools, Mississippi responded by offering $30 million in tax incentives to keep the Tupelo plant open.

So this Indian company is the beneficiary of 30 million American taxpayer dollars? The state should demand every dime back.

Quote:
The bad news is, Apollo Tyre of India will someday want to move Cooper Tire & Rubber production from Findlay to another country, tire industry experts say.

Quote:
Cooper Tire and Apollo Tyre on Wednesday announced Apollo will be buying Cooper for $2.5 billion. Apollo, which has plants in India, South Africa and Europe, wants to use Cooper to gain a foothold in the United States.


This part is the most disturbing part, once this company gets a foothold in the US with its cheap products its going to force other first world tire companies into making some decisions.
It may be plant closings, lay offs, lower quality, etc the effects over the next decade could be devastating to the US and first world tire industry in the US tire market.

America should not be for sale, no one is discouraging foreign investment but that investor should by law not be allowed to gain controlling interest.
When the department of commerce initiated the "Invest in America" initiative they did not mean selling American down the river.

 

[CapriRacer]

Originally Posted By: Trav
......This part is the most disturbing part, once this company gets a foothold in the US with its cheap products its going to force other first world tire companies into making some decisions..........


If you look carefully, ALL the "first world" tire manufacturers already have manufacturing facilities in low labor cost countries. The tire market is truly a global market. The only pressure to manufacture tires in the US is the cost of shipping.

Besides, the only thing different will be the nationality of the owner - and to a global capitalist, he has no allegiance to a particular country. I think that was as true for the management of Cooper as it is for the management of Apollo. It's just more obvious now.

 

[Trav]

Originally Posted By: CapriRacer
you look carefully, ALL the "first world" tire manufacturers already have manufacturing facilities in low labor cost countries.

What does that have to do with anything? Its not like Apollo came here, opened a plant and is making tires.
They bought a US company with end game being to take the company and its profits out of the US.

 

[CapriRacer]

Originally Posted By: Trav
Originally Posted By: CapriRacer
you look carefully, ALL the "first world" tire manufacturers already have manufacturing facilities in low labor cost countries.

What does that have to do with anything? Its not like Apollo came here, opened a plant and is making tires.
They bought a US company with end game being to take the company and its profits out of the US.


The point would be that your point would be true for ANY major tire manufacturer - including the current owners of Cooper. It's just that it is more obvious now.

 

[Trav]

How many third world tire companies are buying US tire companies?
First world sure but it pays them to keep the company going in the US because their cost of labor is similar to the US.

The only thing that may be keeping Apollo here briefly is the 30 million taxpayer dollars which was given to a US company to keep an American plant open.

 

[daves87rs]

Originally Posted By: Trav
Originally Posted By: JHZR2
Well, if Apollo has cash and some size, then new Apollo is larger than old Cooper, isnt it?

Or do you think that this is somehow magically good for the American worker and plants?


With articles like these its not hard to see through the smoke and mirrors. America is selling its work force and industrial base one company at a time.
I read comments like "they employ American workers paying US dollars" which is true but its short term, these workers will be facing unemployment a little later thats all the the work place will be gone with no chance of reopening.
That argument doesn't hold water. If every US company was owned by overseas interest but keeps the workforce employed the entire US economy is being sent overseas leaving America to exist on basically a rotating service economy.

Quote:
In December 2008, Mississippi vied with other Cooper Tire plant locations to keep the plant open when the company said the weakening economy would cause it to shutter one of its U.S. plants. Noting the plant provided $2.1 million annually in taxes for the community and schools, Mississippi responded by offering $30 million in tax incentives to keep the Tupelo plant open.

So this Indian company is the beneficiary of 30 million American taxpayer dollars? The state should demand every dime back.

Quote:
The bad news is, Apollo Tyre of India will someday want to move Cooper Tire & Rubber production from Findlay to another country, tire industry experts say.

Quote:
Cooper Tire and Apollo Tyre on Wednesday announced Apollo will be buying Cooper for $2.5 billion. Apollo, which has plants in India, South Africa and Europe, wants to use Cooper to gain a foothold in the United States.


This part is the most disturbing part, once this company gets a foothold in the US with its cheap products its going to force other first world tire companies into making some decisions.
It may be plant closings, lay offs, lower quality, etc the effects over the next decade could be devastating to the US and first world tire industry in the US tire market.

America should not be for sale, no one is discouraging foreign investment but that investor should by law not be allowed to gain controlling interest.
When the department of commerce initiated the "Invest in America" initiative they did not mean selling American down the river.



While I can agree with some of this, the Chinese market started that ball rolling...and besides Cooper, most are still hanging on.


And while I'll try to avoid the poltics on this one, our own greed sold this country out long ago.....

 

[OVERKILL]

Originally Posted By: daves87rs



And while I'll try to avoid the poltics on this one, our own greed sold this country out long ago.....


Quoted for truth.

 

[daves87rs]

Originally Posted By: CapriRacer
Originally Posted By: Trav
......This part is the most disturbing part, once this company gets a foothold in the US with its cheap products its going to force other first world tire companies into making some decisions..........


If you look carefully, ALL the "first world" tire manufacturers already have manufacturing facilities in low labor cost countries. The tire market is truly a global market. The only pressure to manufacture tires in the US is the cost of shipping.

Besides, the only thing different will be the nationality of the owner - and to a global capitalist, he has no allegiance to a particular country. I think that was as true for the management of Cooper as it is for the management of Apollo. It's just more obvious now.



+1

It's about the money...

 

[PandaBear]

Originally Posted By: Trav
How many third world tire companies are buying US tire companies?
First world sure but it pays them to keep the company going in the US because their cost of labor is similar to the US.

The only thing that may be keeping Apollo here briefly is the 30 million taxpayer dollars which was given to a US company to keep an American plant open.


It doesn't make sense to buy a company and shut down a huge asset (factory that is making money) and move everything to India. They can keep it running and tag their Indian made tires with the Cooper brand, they can leverage the experts in the US to help the Indian operation, they can sell the plant to another US operation, they can shuffle the product line around so all the high end stuff is in the US (instead of in India if they have a plant there now).

The point is, if there are still so many profitable tire plants in the US, there is no reason to move everything away to India. The first world companies still have plants (and still BUILD new plants) in other first world area instead of all moving away.

 

[Trav]

I didn't say they would close it and move the operation to India.
Probably south of the border to take full advantage of NAFTA, this buy was nothing to do with Coopers day to day operations its about the brand.

Sure they will be branding their other tires with the Cooper name.

 

[PandaBear]

Originally Posted By: Trav
I didn't say they would close it and move the operation to India.
Probably south of the border to take full advantage of NAFTA, this buy was nothing to do with Coopers day to day operations its about the brand.


That would still means a huge facility move that is likely not cost effective vs just selling the plant to someone else.

 

[Trav]

Now thats just guessing. Do you have any idea how old the plant is?
How much the taxes are? The union contract or medical cost are or will be in 2014?
In the 2.5 billion scheme of things the actual plants probably represent a small portion of that.

Lets wait and see but my money is on them being gone from US soil in the production area within 10 yrs if that.

This is what i don't understand about a lot of the third world country supporters in this thread.
A Toyota or Subaru or what have you is made in the US with American workers getting American dollars but they are the first to call the cars Japanese.
Hypocrisy at its finest.

 

[JHZR2]

Originally Posted By: mrsilv04
Originally Posted By: JHZR2
Or do you think that this is somehow magically good for the American worker and plants?


It ceased to be about the "American worker and plants" some years ago.

Now, it is all about the American *union*.


So the union boss is horrible for pulling in $1M (made up number, likely less, and yes, I dont think a union boss should make that) but the CEO is a saint for pulling in $5M and selling his fellow countrymen out to the third world?

 

[SlipperyPete]

Originally Posted By: JHZR2
So the union boss is horrible for pulling in $1M (made up number, likely less, and yes, I dont think a union boss should make that) but the CEO is a saint for pulling in $5M and selling his fellow countrymen out to the third world?


The salaries of either party have nothing to do it.

The unions are at fault when they make outrageous demands that make it more attractive for companies to move overseas, such as free lifetime healthcare, without regard for their member's future employment. The CEOs are at fault when they move a profitable operation overseas to make more profit without regard for the damage done to their own country's economy and workforce.

This wasn't always the case, on either side of the equation. If you calculate when the baby boomers started entering the workforce and when they would have started getting to the CEO level, it kind of looks like the attitudes of the "me generation" have much more to do with this than simply union and management.

 

[daves87rs]

Ah, and this is why we all make 10 bucks an hour.....


With no decent wage, you have no choice but to buy the cheapest tire available....can't exactly afford the best on that budget....we could blame the workers for going to far, or for management for being to cheap. Cooper would have worked better as a private company anyways...

 

[cbear]

Remember Asian tire companies run factories IN the US. Toyo/Nitto, and Firestone/Bridgestone. I don't they will close it down totally.

 

[Trav]

Originally Posted By: cbear
Remember Asian tire companies run factories IN the US. Toyo/Nitto, and Firestone/Bridgestone. I don't they will close it down totally.

You cant compare India, Pakistan, Bangladesh, etc to first world nations like Japan, South Korea or even almost (if not already) first world like Taiwan.

 

[SlipperyPete]

Originally Posted By: Trav
You cant compare India, Pakistan, Bangladesh, etc to first world nations like Japan, South Korea or even almost (if not already) first world like Taiwan.


It may not be long before you can make that comparison if those countries continue to attract manufacturing jobs.