HELP!! Passat 1.8T Sludgebucket

[srivett]

The VW filter is quite expensive up here in Canada so I'd go with another brand such as Wix, etc. The price difference is something like 17$CDN vs. 9$CDN.

I would be tempted to buy myself an oil pressure guage and mount it under the hood so I could monitor progress. I'd also buy a pail of diesel oil for cheap and change it frequently, maybe daily at first. The oil filter wouldn't get changed that often.

On the other hand, there are a lot of people who have said they have seen cleaner engines when switching from diesel oil to synethic oil. I am part of this group. It took somewhere around 7500 km to clean up the rings on my car with 377K km on it. This was with Rotella 0w40.

What is your oil pressure? My VW diesel can live with as little as 2 PSI at the cylinder head! There is many a beater VW diesel that has less than this but continues to run with the oil light on at low speeds.

AutoRX is also worth a shot.

Steve

 

[Yuk]

quote:

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The VW filter is quite expensive up here in Canada so I'd go with another brand such as Wix, etc. The price difference is something like 17$CDN vs. 9$CDN.

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Buy your filters in bulk. One dealer in Edmonton charged me less than $9.00 CDN/filter, when I bought a 10 filter case of VW/M+H filters.

 

[aero nut]

Now your talkin. I actually had an old timer mechanic tell me to run diesel or kerosene in place of oil for about 3 min. I don't think I'll do that, but pouring it in and draining it out might be an idea. Then Delvac or whatever it is for just a few miles, change oil & start my Auto RX treatment. I think that's the plan unless someone can come up with something better or a reason not to. Wish me luck on my $9,000 experiment.

 

[brian]

Since this thread has moved away from Auto-RX...My Turkish mechanic buddy's who service German cars use ATF instead of kerosense. Drain oil, fill crankcase with ATF. Idle for a few minutes. Repeat until ATF comes out red in color. ATF is very highly additized and will probably clean out the engine. I've seen them do it to BMWs.... Chevron ATF at Costco is cheap $1/qt or less or try the Wal Mart stuff.

-brian

 

[srivett]

If you do anything unusual don't mention it to the dealer.

The engine already has unrelated issues but you never know what they'll say.

Steve

 

[John_E]

If my 1.8T were sludging on synth, I would suspect my PCV system. Also, if you do alot of "severe service" urban driving, tighten up the OCI to 3K or 3.5K miles instead of 5K. Always use an oil from the VW 502 list and use the larger VW 068-115-561B filter (or equivalent), which expands your cooling system capacity to 4.5 qts., which is alot better than 3.9.

One fellow on PassatWorld claimed to have been able to scrape some of the sludge from his oil pump pickup screen with a bristled baby bottle brush. It's worth a shot ...

I also like the overnight kerosene soak idea, but be sure to pour it down the dipstick tube instead of the oil filler hole. I would also put in considerably less solvent than my normal oil capacity, to avoid damaging any of the piston bearings.

 

[VNT]

If you can afford to trade it in, I would dump it. You have probably already done a lot of wear to the rod and main bearings, hence the low oil pressure. Even if you could drop the pan to clean off the oil pump pick up, sounds like the damage is done.

If your going to try to clean it out, I would dump the oil, fill the crankcase with a solvent and let it sit for an evening, dump it out and put fresh oil in and do a few changes. Would also hook up an oil pressure guage before and after to see if pressure does increase. If it doesnt sounds like rebuild.

VNT

 

[aero nut]

Yup, I will dump it. I need to get the pressure up
first. I'm hoping the low pressure is due to blockage not bearings. It does run well with little noise. The mechanic said he could hear a little groaning in the top end. He said probably lifters. So I hope a little cleaning out will increase flow enough to prevent major damage until Auto Rx cleaning occurs. It's going to be a close call and I really think I'm dead in the water to begin with, but at this point I have little to loose. The real kicker that I was not expecting is the problem of getting the oil pan off--complicates things a bit. I will drive the car home tonight on synthetic oil. About 20 miles.

 

[aero nut]

Drove the car home 20 mi without the Oil Pressure light coming on. A good sign. Maybe the synthetic is helping. However on start up the next day it was apparent the turbo was spinning dry. Must be coked up terribly. Any way of breaking this up before the bearing burns up without dissasembling the thing???

 

[wavinwayne]

quote:

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Originally posted by aero nut:
Any way of breaking this up before the bearing burns up without dissasembling the thing???

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Here's your shopping list:

(1) bottle Gunk or any other engine flush
(5) quarts Castrol GTX 10w30 (or any name brand dino 10w30)
(5) quarts Shell Rotella 5w40
(1) cheap oil filter...Fram, Stp, Super-Tech, etc.
(1) OEM or Mobil 1 oil filter

This is what I'd do:

1. Use the Gunk engine flush. Just follow the directions on the bottle.
2. After Gunk flush is completed, change the oil & filter. Use the Castrol 10w30 dino & the cheap oil filter.
3. Drive it 100-200 miles, even if it's just up & down a local highway for a couple hours.
4. Change oil & filter again with Shell Rotella T 5w40, available at Wal-Mart in gallon jugs for about $13 a gallon. Use your good oil filter at this change.
5. Repeat step 4 after 1-2k miles.

I know the above may not work & the situation you're in really stinks, but MAYBE it will work.

[ February 12, 2005, 10:10 PM: Message edited by: wavinwayne ]

 

[427Z06]

quote:

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Originally posted by aero nut:
However on start up the next day it was apparent the turbo was spinning dry. Must be coked up terribly. Any way of breaking this up before the bearing burns up without dissasembling the thing???

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I've never worked on one of these 1.8Ts so it's kinda' tough knowing what you're up agaisnt.

However, FWIW, if you can you take off the oil supply line off the turbo, you could check for oil flow to the turbo buy running it briefly with the oil supply line aimed into a container. If it's good, then maybe you can hook up a hose to the oil inlet on the turbo and pour some solvent product into the bearing and let it soak over night. The next day, reconnect the oil supply line and see if that helps. It may be the case that the bearing is already to far gone, but who knows, you might get lucky.

 

[srivett]

It's too bad that car isn't carberated as I would want to pull the turbo off for the time being.

Since you can't you should pull the turbo oil line (usually coming from the oil filter mount on VWs) and clean it out good. It is just a metal line right? Shouldn't be too hard to do. I bet the turbo return line is a steel braided hose hooked up to the back of the block. VW has been using the same blocks for close to 30 years now so it is really sad that they are having problems all of a sudden. The diesel/gas 4 cylinder blocks have always been very similar too.

Steve

 

[oilyriser]

note: this is not a tested idea; just thinking of stuff to try.

For just soaking the oil pickup screen, a more agressive solvent, like acetone, could be poured down the dipstick tube, and later drained out and allowed to dry off. There are solvents out there that will soften hardened epoxy. Maybe a few botles of GM Piston and Ring Cleaner would work, but it's rather expensive. Lacquer thinner?


Has any sludge actually been seen, perhaps on the dipstick?

 

[Lance]

quote:

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Originally posted by 427Z06:
Here's a method I used to help desludge an engine for a friend. YMMV. After the engine is at operating temps, park the car so that the oil drain plug is at the lowest point on the oil pan. Drain the oil and replace the filter (ST or equivalent) while you there. Let it drain for about an hour. Replace the drain plug and fill the engine with kerosene. Use the same amount of kerosene as you would oil for a normal oil change. Let the car sit at least over night. (Do not start it under any circumstance while the kerosene is in there!) Next day drain it, and after it gets down to just drips, dump one more quart of kerosene with the drain plug off to help flush out whatever you can. Replace drain plug and fill it with the proper amount of something like Delvac 1300 S 15w40. Run it gently for about an hour, keeping an eye on the oil/temp gauges for signs of any trouble. Now change the filter and oil again with the above oil, and start the AutoRX process. It'll probably take at least two of the AutoRX cycles to get close to normal again. Good luck.

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That sounds extreme, which could be what's needede here. I doubt it would hurt the engine.

 

[slc10844]

I was alway under the impression on an engine with heavy sludge it isn't good to de-sludge too quickly. It will overload the oil pan with deposits and aggravate the problem by loading the oil screen. Once sludge has taken a hold, the damage is done and the only way to correct the problem is to remove the engine and rebuild or replace.

 

[wavinwayne]

quote:

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Originally posted by slc10844:
I was alway under the impression on an engine with heavy sludge it isn't good to de-sludge too quickly....

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Auto-rx doesn't de-sludge quickly. It is designed to work s...l...o...w...l...y, whick makes it different from most of the flushes on the market which "shock" the system.

Many folks on this forum have used Auto-rx & most of them are very pleased with the results.

 

[Geoff]

Having seen some clogged oil pickup screens, you need to clean the screen before you start the engine with kerosene or ATF (both very effective). I would overfill it about 2 qts with kerosene and let it sit fot a few days. Don't run the motor. Then drain and run HDEO and give it time. Change the filter after about 50 miles.

Depending on how your oil pan is sealed, it is common for the RTV to ooze into the oil pan, where it gets softened by the oil additives and sucked up into the screen.

 

[Audi Junkie]

quote:

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ATF is very highly additized and will probably clean out the engine

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Not. Not even close.

 

[99]

VW should foot the bill for this guy's engine in my opinion, irregardless of who is to blame because the problem is so widespread. Good luck.

[ February 20, 2005, 01:37 AM: Message edited by: 99 ]

 

[427Z06]

quote:

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Originally posted by slc10844:
I was alway under the impression on an engine with heavy sludge it isn't good to de-sludge too quickly. It will overload the oil pan with deposits and aggravate the problem by loading the oil screen. Once sludge has taken a hold, the damage is done and the only way to correct the problem is to remove the engine and rebuild or replace.

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Your impression is correct. This engine may very well be a goner. However, he just might get lucky with some drastic measures or at least get it to limp along for awhile until he can clean it properly, rebuild/replace the engine or junk it.