Ecore Experience
- Thread starter Red Bowtie
- Start date
- Status
- Joined
- Sep 28, 2002
- Messages
- 39,799
It was a tongue in cheek query
She just needed a bit of adjustment. She figured out that having kids was a good distraction. That gave her all she needed to do while he was otherwise occupied
And yes, if the boys are still at home ..and you enjoy each others company, you are very fortunate.
- Joined
- Sep 28, 2002
- Messages
- 39,799
One thing that really kinda keeps tugging at me here.
I'm not directing this toward Red Bowtie ..I'm just posting it here since it's so much a part of this thread.
There are all kinds of engines that get hopped up. Mopars ...Fords ..and Chebbies. Now this whole plugging the bypass has been a religion for so long ..I doubt that anyone really knows why they do it. I mean ..sure ..they know what to say when someone asks them ...but I don't really think that anyone ..unless they're 70 some odd years old, and were "cutting edge" racers/builders...probably has a valid reason for doing this.
I don't see any 500 hp 5.0 defeating a bypass ..nor any other hi-per engine. In fact our present day Permacool mount was made for Fram (had a part number in their catalog) to fit Ford style filters the HP1 ..the first bullet proof Orange Can of Doom has an in filter bypass. This was used on dragsters of the day ..w/bypass valves in their filters.
That is, in a Chevy, this appears to be the same thing as asking why a dog licks itself in its private parts ....simply because it can.
It's like I'm wondering what "trick myth" the first guy who did this pulled out of his arse that made him think that this feature gave him an edge that the Ferds and the Jopars couldn't match. As though the other engine builders were envious that "he" (whomever he was) had access to this unique feature that they were denied.
Does anyone else see this as a, sort of, religion
How do Ford and Mopar street rodders and bracket racers deal with all that insecurity?? How do they deal with the risk that they put their engines through by running a bypass (yes, now I am being a bit redundantly whyzarse
)
[ June 15, 2006, 01:17 AM: Message edited by: Gary Allan ]
I'm not directing this toward Red Bowtie ..I'm just posting it here since it's so much a part of this thread.
There are all kinds of engines that get hopped up. Mopars ...Fords ..and Chebbies. Now this whole plugging the bypass has been a religion for so long ..I doubt that anyone really knows why they do it. I mean ..sure ..they know what to say when someone asks them ...but I don't really think that anyone ..unless they're 70 some odd years old, and were "cutting edge" racers/builders...probably has a valid reason for doing this.
I don't see any 500 hp 5.0 defeating a bypass ..nor any other hi-per engine. In fact our present day Permacool mount was made for Fram (had a part number in their catalog) to fit Ford style filters the HP1 ..the first bullet proof Orange Can of Doom has an in filter bypass. This was used on dragsters of the day ..w/bypass valves in their filters.
That is, in a Chevy, this appears to be the same thing as asking why a dog licks itself in its private parts ....simply because it can.
It's like I'm wondering what "trick myth" the first guy who did this pulled out of his arse that made him think that this feature gave him an edge that the Ferds and the Jopars couldn't match. As though the other engine builders were envious that "he" (whomever he was) had access to this unique feature that they were denied.
Does anyone else see this as a, sort of, religion
How do Ford and Mopar street rodders and bracket racers deal with all that insecurity?? How do they deal with the risk that they put their engines through by running a bypass (yes, now I am being a bit redundantly whyzarse
[ June 15, 2006, 01:17 AM: Message edited by: Gary Allan ]
- Joined
- Sep 28, 2002
- Messages
- 39,799
Well, what I'm really looking for is the guy who brought down the tablet with the Chevy commandments that said "Thou SHALL defeat thy in block bypass port!"
..and what good was supposed to come from it
Were you going to be struck down by lightning if you didn't
What is so special about this technique that appears to put the fear of the pain of death in so many if they don't do it
Yes, it's like a religion.
..and what good was supposed to come from it
Were you going to be struck down by lightning if you didn't
What is so special about this technique that appears to put the fear of the pain of death in so many if they don't do it
Yes, it's like a religion.
I just caught the fact that the bypass was blocked, I thought it was stated earlier that it was not. I guess my suspicions were correct No offence, but I think you will have a hard time getting any warrantee to cover it. The filter was designed for a bypass, as are all filters that will fit your car. Blocking the bypass has no purpose and is asking for trouble. I'd recomened eliminating the filter altogether if you're going to do that.
-T
[ June 15, 2006, 05:32 AM: Message edited by: T-Keith ]
-T
[ June 15, 2006, 05:32 AM: Message edited by: T-Keith ]
Well i'll add my 2p worth.
Red Bowtie has had the engine 3 years ( if I read correctly).
For 3 years he's beeen doing his thing on the street and probably on the track.
So on one particular day he goes and does his "normal" thing.
Unbeknown to him his engine has been deteriorating over time. Metal parts have been sheering off.
So he "warms" up the car. This meant he watched his water temp and not oil temp. Then goes WOT a time or two. His car breaks down.
He tows it back, tears it apart, and looks at the filter. The filter doesn't look normal.
He send the filter back and the lab tells him there was nothing wrong with the filter.
I suspect that as his engine was breaking down to begin with, a piece of metal got lodged in the oil pumps regulating ( relief to some) valve, as the oil pump is positive displacement and sucked it up from the pan, then stuck the valve in the closed postion which over pressurized the lubricating system which in turn collapsed the filter.
Oil was always flowing through the engine as the oil pump was doing it's job. Closed by-pass or not. ( Collapsed filter for one "run" or not).
Now Red Bowtie is going back to doing things the way he was doing them before. Same oil viscosity, same blocked by-pass, only with a different brand filter.
As long as he is aware --now-- of what the problem was, he can watch for some tell tale signs in the future.
He can visually inspect every filter he takes off the engine from now on. He can go to higher burst/collapse versions. He can even cut them open. He should also drop the pan and check for metal in his oil. This may help him diagnose a minor problem in the future before it turns into a major one. He might even do oil analysis.
But imho the filter was a casualty of the engine not the cause of the problem.
Red Bowtie has had the engine 3 years ( if I read correctly).
For 3 years he's beeen doing his thing on the street and probably on the track.
So on one particular day he goes and does his "normal" thing.
Unbeknown to him his engine has been deteriorating over time. Metal parts have been sheering off.
So he "warms" up the car. This meant he watched his water temp and not oil temp. Then goes WOT a time or two. His car breaks down.
He tows it back, tears it apart, and looks at the filter. The filter doesn't look normal.
He send the filter back and the lab tells him there was nothing wrong with the filter.
I suspect that as his engine was breaking down to begin with, a piece of metal got lodged in the oil pumps regulating ( relief to some) valve, as the oil pump is positive displacement and sucked it up from the pan, then stuck the valve in the closed postion which over pressurized the lubricating system which in turn collapsed the filter.
Oil was always flowing through the engine as the oil pump was doing it's job. Closed by-pass or not. ( Collapsed filter for one "run" or not).
Now Red Bowtie is going back to doing things the way he was doing them before. Same oil viscosity, same blocked by-pass, only with a different brand filter.
As long as he is aware --now-- of what the problem was, he can watch for some tell tale signs in the future.
He can visually inspect every filter he takes off the engine from now on. He can go to higher burst/collapse versions. He can even cut them open. He should also drop the pan and check for metal in his oil. This may help him diagnose a minor problem in the future before it turns into a major one. He might even do oil analysis.
But imho the filter was a casualty of the engine not the cause of the problem.
There's a couple points we'll need to clarify to keep this thread straight.
First point. The question about the blocked bypass. I've asked a local engine builder and his comment was " they want all the oil to go through the filter." Apparently, in a hi perf application, this strategy prevents the possiblity of greater engine damamge from small pieces being fed back thru the motor. Maybe it's the reason guys cut open the filter to see what's in it. If it were bypassing, then the pieces might not get caught. I personally have seen some parts of small needle bearings from an aftemarket roller lifter get ground up through the oil pump and end up in the filter. I guess that was better than finding it in the bearings. The camshaft got dinged a bit and the pump gears looked rough (no - it didn't shear off the intermediate drive shaft either) in that case, but the crank and rods were OK.
Second point. Hey FG! At the top of this page we mentioned that we had "completely diassembled" this motor late last fall. There was nothing going on inside of it. It looked great. The motor was not deteriorating and there were no metal parts sheering off. The bearings were darn near perfect! Explain that one. (blocked bypass, old design PF1218) Now do you understand our extreme disappointment with the Ecore? It was the only thing that changed with our setup.
We probably should have talked about our warmup procedure seeing FG replayed it off the cuff. We typically warm the motor to full water temp, shut it down and let it soak for about 20 minutes while we go grab a cup of jo and talk about what the rest of the day will bring. We would have added this extra detail, but our nubbies can handle only so much poking on the 'puter.
We realize this blocked bypass thing is a hot topic, but our approach to managing changes are to minimize them. One change at a time, otherwise how do you know what worked or not? In this instance, we're changing only the filter and we'll see how it works.
We should have mentioned it, but AC suggested using the PF2232 filter from a Duramax diesel because it has an internal bypass. We've got some of them on the shelf because we run a D-max in our little truck and that's the filter we've been using on it. No problem there either. We're just going to try the Wix on the hot rod. If Ecore's weren't made in the PF1218 p/n, we'd still be using that. Our teardown evidence proved that we weren't doing too bad with it either.
We'll quit the whining and get on with it. We came to BITOG to learn more about oiling systems and to share our experience with a fine group of folks. We've certainly enjoyed the discussion.
PS. Still waiting for the old filter to come back from Champ.
First point. The question about the blocked bypass. I've asked a local engine builder and his comment was " they want all the oil to go through the filter." Apparently, in a hi perf application, this strategy prevents the possiblity of greater engine damamge from small pieces being fed back thru the motor. Maybe it's the reason guys cut open the filter to see what's in it. If it were bypassing, then the pieces might not get caught. I personally have seen some parts of small needle bearings from an aftemarket roller lifter get ground up through the oil pump and end up in the filter. I guess that was better than finding it in the bearings. The camshaft got dinged a bit and the pump gears looked rough (no - it didn't shear off the intermediate drive shaft either) in that case, but the crank and rods were OK.
Second point. Hey FG! At the top of this page we mentioned that we had "completely diassembled" this motor late last fall. There was nothing going on inside of it. It looked great. The motor was not deteriorating and there were no metal parts sheering off. The bearings were darn near perfect! Explain that one. (blocked bypass, old design PF1218) Now do you understand our extreme disappointment with the Ecore? It was the only thing that changed with our setup.
We probably should have talked about our warmup procedure seeing FG replayed it off the cuff. We typically warm the motor to full water temp, shut it down and let it soak for about 20 minutes while we go grab a cup of jo and talk about what the rest of the day will bring. We would have added this extra detail, but our nubbies can handle only so much poking on the 'puter.
We realize this blocked bypass thing is a hot topic, but our approach to managing changes are to minimize them. One change at a time, otherwise how do you know what worked or not? In this instance, we're changing only the filter and we'll see how it works.
We should have mentioned it, but AC suggested using the PF2232 filter from a Duramax diesel because it has an internal bypass. We've got some of them on the shelf because we run a D-max in our little truck and that's the filter we've been using on it. No problem there either. We're just going to try the Wix on the hot rod. If Ecore's weren't made in the PF1218 p/n, we'd still be using that. Our teardown evidence proved that we weren't doing too bad with it either.
We'll quit the whining and get on with it. We came to BITOG to learn more about oiling systems and to share our experience with a fine group of folks. We've certainly enjoyed the discussion.
PS. Still waiting for the old filter to come back from Champ.
It's a hot topic because the blocked bypass is without question what caused the filter failure and subsequently the engine damage. It seems a no brainer to me that the root cause of the problem is what needs to be addressed. Everything else is like putting a bandaid on a bullet wound.
There is no way opening the bypass and using a lighter weight oil will cause engine problems given the way you drive the car. You seem to be locked into this "race car engine builder" mindset, when in reality what you've got is a weekend hotrod that needs the bypass valve to ensure proper lubrication.
- Joined
- Sep 28, 2002
- Messages
- 39,799
Red Bowtie. Now I surely know that we're reaching the end of productive dialog here, so this is not to pile on just one more comment ...but, I've worked with my engine builder quite often ..and YES, he cuts open all the filters on the engines that he builds just to see if anything is there to give any reason to tear down the engine.
But what makes anyone assume that if you've got a bypass that the particle is going to manage to get past the filter. Sure, it's possible, but why is it likely? The bypassed flow is very limited. The filtered oil flow ..is not. Again I wonder, just what does a Ford or Mopar (or some Asian or Euro rocket) do for this situation, just suffer a case of near nervous breakdown
But, thank you for sharing this. Good luck with your rebuild.
But what makes anyone assume that if you've got a bypass that the particle is going to manage to get past the filter. Sure, it's possible, but why is it likely? The bypassed flow is very limited. The filtered oil flow ..is not. Again I wonder, just what does a Ford or Mopar (or some Asian or Euro rocket) do for this situation, just suffer a case of near nervous breakdown
But, thank you for sharing this. Good luck with your rebuild.
One thing Red Bowtie should keep an eye on is the filter media in the Wix "race" filter. It's possible to have a collapse failure wihtout even knowing it. Collapse failures come in two flavors; media and core. A sudden high differential pressure may cause both components to fail but in some cases only one or the other goes. If it's the core it's easy to see. If it's the media you have to cut open the filter, place the filter under a fluid (water is ok) and apply a very low pressure to the inside of the filter element. You may have to use a large cork or rubber stopper with a hole through the center to plug the open end and introduce the air. At a few inches of water pressure the air will start escaping through any broken parts of the pleats. High differential pack failures will almost always occur at the fold next to the core. Once a pleat rupture occurs the pressure is released and no more damage will occur.
Even high performance filters have filtering media with fine fibers that will rupture at high differential.
Oil flow rate through a filter is controlled by engine demand. A rule of thumb for pushrod V8 engines is 1 gallon per minute per 1000 RPM. Of course as bearing clearances open up flow rates also go up. BBC engines may be some higher than this but not much. You really don't get to high oil flow rates until you start talking DOHC. Northstars will get in the 12 to 20 gpm range at redline.
Even high performance filters have filtering media with fine fibers that will rupture at high differential.
Oil flow rate through a filter is controlled by engine demand. A rule of thumb for pushrod V8 engines is 1 gallon per minute per 1000 RPM. Of course as bearing clearances open up flow rates also go up. BBC engines may be some higher than this but not much. You really don't get to high oil flow rates until you start talking DOHC. Northstars will get in the 12 to 20 gpm range at redline.
Missed one of FG's points.
We do drop the pan on occassion to check things out. We have the oil pan mounted on studs and we use a nifty one piece reuseable gasket. It's an easy thing to do. We check the rod caps, the oil pump and drive shaft and the strainer along with the bottom of the pan. As we mentioned earlier, we really try to take good care of this motor. It's our recreation.
And as long as we can agree to disagree, our opinion is the filter took the motor down.
We'll agree it wasn't the right one to use. We tried to use the best information available to us at the time from AC and Champ (stronger core, more efficient design) which supported our decision to use it. We did it. We own it. We won't be using an Ecore in this application again. We wanted to share our story. That's why we're here.
In hindsight, we should of went with our gut feel that it just didn't look like the right part to use.
Was it an expensive lesson? You bet it was. But we do this together, my boys and I.
A short story to end with. We had two guys looking at the car. One guy commented to the other about how much this stuff costs. The other guy replied, "Have you ever paid an attorney to get your kid out of jail in Florida?"
We do drop the pan on occassion to check things out. We have the oil pan mounted on studs and we use a nifty one piece reuseable gasket. It's an easy thing to do. We check the rod caps, the oil pump and drive shaft and the strainer along with the bottom of the pan. As we mentioned earlier, we really try to take good care of this motor. It's our recreation.
And as long as we can agree to disagree, our opinion is the filter took the motor down.
We'll agree it wasn't the right one to use. We tried to use the best information available to us at the time from AC and Champ (stronger core, more efficient design) which supported our decision to use it. We did it. We own it. We won't be using an Ecore in this application again. We wanted to share our story. That's why we're here.
In hindsight, we should of went with our gut feel that it just didn't look like the right part to use.
Was it an expensive lesson? You bet it was. But we do this together, my boys and I.
A short story to end with. We had two guys looking at the car. One guy commented to the other about how much this stuff costs. The other guy replied, "Have you ever paid an attorney to get your kid out of jail in Florida?"
- Joined
- Sep 28, 2002
- Messages
- 39,799
That's a good one, Bowtie. It all depends on your point of view
(visions of someone saying "Well, I think you would really need to define "totally destroyed" before we pass judgement here" ..or Vic Morow in "The Glass House" when he said, "Hey, kid ..it's either me ...or them three".(pointing to Ajax and his associates). Some things need comparitive worth before you can evaluate "costs"
I guess I just don't understand the logic here. Were starting out with new racing only oil and street filter for the season. The filter at this point should be free flowing. Much higher than normal pressure is introduced into the filter. The filter can a handle XX flow and now we have XXX. What happens next? I'm thinking that XX is still flowing through the filter up until the center tube / media collapses, then the flow jumps to XXX.
What caused the oil pump to be tricked into producing so much pressure? Was it because the oil filter got plugged up even though that doesn't seem likely and was only flowing X?
Was it because some metal object hadn't made it to the filter yet? Was it because some contaminant the result of using low or non-detergent racing oil gummed up the works?
If there had been no filter on this engine would the results have been the same?
Was the engine damage really the result of too little oil pressure or too much?
No..I never said that.
The service report stated that the filter was subject to pressure in excess of 70 PSID.
The service report never claimed what the E-core tests to as far as collapse.
The E-core product bulletin states that the E-core has a higher collapse than standard metal cores.
As the E-core collapsed--so would any of the other GM application filter elements without a by-pass and standard metal core.
--------------------
Red Bowtie..
If there was no contaminant in the oil that could have lodged in the oil pump regulating valve...then what caused the excess differential pressure which collapsed the filter?
I surmized it was metal from your engine already having a problem--never claimed proof positive it was. If you say it couldn't have been--fair enough.
But still-- imho--something caused the excess pressure. Others have inquired along the same lines.
No one has come up with a satisfactory answer. Other than the oil pump pressure regulating/relief valve being stuck in the closed postion. All I am attempting to do is determine what could have lodged there.
AC--old metal core design or new E-core--would have encountered the same flow/pressure. The filter is but a dumb stupid animal hanging on the motor. It does nothing except filter the oil that the oil pump sends its way.
The filter does not regulate flow. A filter has about a 1-2 PSID pressure drop when new. AC, Wix, E-core--all of them. ( and from the picture evidence of the filter looking down the center tube, the media wasn't full of contaminant and plugged)
My replies in this thread would be the same regardless of which brand of filter used. So it's not about E-core. Or AC as it was under their label and they also have tested the filter.
I have yet to see any other explaination as to what caused the excess differential pressure.
As you seem to think the filter is the culprit..can you explain how?
- Joined
- Sep 28, 2002
- Messages
- 39,799
If his oil was cold (not around 200F) and the throttle was WO ...once you hit the ceiling of pressure, you reduce flow across the filter. This gives you a high pressure/low(er) flow condition. The engine here, for a this example anyway, is a constant. Less flow means less pressure across it. The pump, however, is now "regulated" by pressure. That creates a high differential ..while, up to, 99% of the flow is shunted to the relief. Now if it's a high enough volume pump AND the relief is not big enough to maintain a ceiling on the pressure ..it will climb even higher ..while still delivering reduced flow.
Let's see if anyone can see this as I do:
Assume that the relief is open at 100 psi ..but the volume shunted is 1% in this image. We should see fairly normal readings.
The heirarchy of "circles" is PUMP, filter, engine. I did not draw the relief circuit = which effectively is a parallel variable resistance. This will allow you to see this as a simple series circuit in a variable flow/regulated pressure situation. All three of these images must add up to 100psi. The split is a function of the constant pressure ..and the reduced pressure drop across the engine at the reduced flow rate.
No go to 10% flow shunted to the relief. We'll still see 100psi ..but at reduced flow.
Note the pressure drop changes over the individual elements.
Now at 50% flow shunted:
So ..all they had to do is hit the relief valve and have it shunt a good % of the flow to the suction side/sump ..and the differential would go sky high with, perhaps, NO FLOW
This is why Pete C. insists that the bypass is there to protect the engine. If the PSID was limited to 15PSID ..then the engine would have to receive more flow at 100 psi applied. Now the bypass SETTING is there to protect the MEDIA. It was not easy to make this distinction.
[ June 15, 2006, 01:51 PM: Message edited by: Gary Allan ]
Wow Gary! That's awesome. I'm not sure I understand all of it, but there's some thought being applied there.
I'd like to take a stab at asnwering FG's question on explaining how the filter was the culprit. I'll throw it out there and you guys are gonna fillet it anyhow, but I'll risk the chance.
The oil pump being a positive displacement device outputs more oil the faster the motor turns. I'll venture a guess that the poor Ecore's media simply couldn't handle the sudden increase in flow when the hammer was dropped and it snapped the media support grid - the Ecore, and allowed the media to escape the can and plugged the outlet (yes, we all know the bypass is blocked) and subsequently roasted the rod bearings. That would be a description of a rapid high differential pressure/flow event. I'd use the analogy of hitting the water at 60mph. That stuff is hard! But it's soft at 3mph. That's our simple view of it.
Now someone is going to suggest the old design PF1218 should have reacted the same way. We haven't had one do that, but maybe we were lucky? For 3 years running?
Or was that Ecore, the one that's stronger than previous metal core designs, defective in this one instance? We've never used one before this, so we have no history to compare with. I'm not sure if Champ cuts them apart when they do a service report, so that's why we're so interested in taking a look at it first hand.
Could it have been a bad Ecore? Could a good one have survived this severe duty? The design hype suggests it could. If it were a poor quality extrusion, that could explain a lot. Do they check for that? We'll see when we get it back. Just our $0.02 worth.
I'd like to take a stab at asnwering FG's question on explaining how the filter was the culprit. I'll throw it out there and you guys are gonna fillet it anyhow, but I'll risk the chance.
The oil pump being a positive displacement device outputs more oil the faster the motor turns. I'll venture a guess that the poor Ecore's media simply couldn't handle the sudden increase in flow when the hammer was dropped and it snapped the media support grid - the Ecore, and allowed the media to escape the can and plugged the outlet (yes, we all know the bypass is blocked) and subsequently roasted the rod bearings. That would be a description of a rapid high differential pressure/flow event. I'd use the analogy of hitting the water at 60mph. That stuff is hard! But it's soft at 3mph. That's our simple view of it.
Now someone is going to suggest the old design PF1218 should have reacted the same way. We haven't had one do that, but maybe we were lucky? For 3 years running?
Or was that Ecore, the one that's stronger than previous metal core designs, defective in this one instance? We've never used one before this, so we have no history to compare with. I'm not sure if Champ cuts them apart when they do a service report, so that's why we're so interested in taking a look at it first hand.
Could it have been a bad Ecore? Could a good one have survived this severe duty? The design hype suggests it could. If it were a poor quality extrusion, that could explain a lot. Do they check for that? We'll see when we get it back. Just our $0.02 worth.
I'm going to venture this guess...
I take it as fact that the e-core "core" is "stronger" than the old design metal "core". But, it depends on how "strength" is measured. If you measure strength as a static load to a desired deformation, the nylon core may win. Under an "impulse" load, though, the nylon core might shatter where a metal core might recover.
I haven't actually crushed an e-core to see what happens, but if it shatters it shows the weakness of the e-core design. When a metal core fails, it should simply begin to collapse. It might continue to flow oil in a collapsed state. Even a collapsed metal core would hold the media back, I would think. Complete oil starvation would only occur on a complete collapse.
The e-core may fail at a higher diff pressure, but the instant the cage collapses or shatters, the output hole will immediately become totally clogged with media and debris and cut off oil flow almost instantly.
Maybe somebody smarter on strength-of-materials issues can back me up (or tell me how I'm wrong). This theory will explain why the previous generation filters didn't cause a problem even if they are technically weaker.
And if what I am saying is right, the e-core could certainly be blamed as an aggravating factor for the destruction in this engine.
I take it as fact that the e-core "core" is "stronger" than the old design metal "core". But, it depends on how "strength" is measured. If you measure strength as a static load to a desired deformation, the nylon core may win. Under an "impulse" load, though, the nylon core might shatter where a metal core might recover.
I haven't actually crushed an e-core to see what happens, but if it shatters it shows the weakness of the e-core design. When a metal core fails, it should simply begin to collapse. It might continue to flow oil in a collapsed state. Even a collapsed metal core would hold the media back, I would think. Complete oil starvation would only occur on a complete collapse.
The e-core may fail at a higher diff pressure, but the instant the cage collapses or shatters, the output hole will immediately become totally clogged with media and debris and cut off oil flow almost instantly.
Maybe somebody smarter on strength-of-materials issues can back me up (or tell me how I'm wrong). This theory will explain why the previous generation filters didn't cause a problem even if they are technically weaker.
And if what I am saying is right, the e-core could certainly be blamed as an aggravating factor for the destruction in this engine.
Gary,
That was a very nice description of what goes on in the engine oil system. The diagrams were a little hard to follow, but I did get it. Your final statement says it all.
"This is why Pete C. insists that the bypass is there to protect the engine..... Now the bypass SETTING is there to protect the MEDIA...."
The arguement from the engine builder that stated you dont want to risk chunks bypassing the filter is not reasonable. As you have seen, the filter bypass never opens anyway.
OTOH the racing filter that was chosen is very unlikely to ever collapse anyway.
That was a very nice description of what goes on in the engine oil system. The diagrams were a little hard to follow, but I did get it. Your final statement says it all.
"This is why Pete C. insists that the bypass is there to protect the engine..... Now the bypass SETTING is there to protect the MEDIA...."
The arguement from the engine builder that stated you dont want to risk chunks bypassing the filter is not reasonable. As you have seen, the filter bypass never opens anyway.
OTOH the racing filter that was chosen is very unlikely to ever collapse anyway.
- Joined
- Sep 28, 2002
- Messages
- 39,799
This is the case with most composite fixtures. They are lighter and stronger (typically) then their metal counterparts. Take radiator tanks. They are stronger and lighter then the copper/brass ones of yester year (or currently in the cheaper aftermarket) ..but can sustain no damage without catastrophic failure.
In all fairness to both principles in this expensive exercize, the Ecore withstood insult way out of bounds for any sensible usage ..but it was worse in failure then alternatives.
- Status
