3-row towing vehicle
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Originally Posted By: CKN
I have a 30 foot ultra light that comes in at 4,500 pounds and the truck with just the wife and I. I towed it around the country about 2 years ago and I wouldn't have wanted any more weight in the truck nor a heavier trailer.
30ft at 4500 lbs? Loaded with lp gas and your stuff? I'd love to know what trailer!! 23ft hybrid?
My jayco 23b ultralight is 23ft, 30ft with the beds out and is over 4500lbs loaded.
I still say that you need wheel base for towing travel trailers. There is a lot of difference in pulling a boat, flat trailer, uhaul trailer and a full hard size travel trailer. the wind resistance , cross wind from 18wheelers are a lot different to deal with. Its not just about pulliing the weight, its about controlling it in curves and the above situations. Braking and being able to stop a travel trailer. You don't always find yourself in a straight line when you have to brake hard, so a decent weight tow vehicle and longer wheelbase makes it safer. Yes a WD hitch and a good ( not timed) brake controller are essential.
I have a 30 foot ultra light that comes in at 4,500 pounds and the truck with just the wife and I. I towed it around the country about 2 years ago and I wouldn't have wanted any more weight in the truck nor a heavier trailer.
30ft at 4500 lbs? Loaded with lp gas and your stuff? I'd love to know what trailer!! 23ft hybrid?
My jayco 23b ultralight is 23ft, 30ft with the beds out and is over 4500lbs loaded.
I still say that you need wheel base for towing travel trailers. There is a lot of difference in pulling a boat, flat trailer, uhaul trailer and a full hard size travel trailer. the wind resistance , cross wind from 18wheelers are a lot different to deal with. Its not just about pulliing the weight, its about controlling it in curves and the above situations. Braking and being able to stop a travel trailer. You don't always find yourself in a straight line when you have to brake hard, so a decent weight tow vehicle and longer wheelbase makes it safer. Yes a WD hitch and a good ( not timed) brake controller are essential.
Has he driven a Suburban or Tahoe? They are popular for a reason, if your used to driving a Traverse they are not to much harder to park.
I have spent a fair amount of wheel time on my buddies Suburban this summer and its a fantastic vehicle. I'd highly recommend one.
I have spent a fair amount of wheel time on my buddies Suburban this summer and its a fantastic vehicle. I'd highly recommend one.
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Originally Posted By: Nate1979
Originally Posted By: IndyIan
Originally Posted By: Nate1979
^^^^
No. 10% is minimum for travel trailer type and you even want a little more just to make it more stable. Friction bar or other type of sway control is like putting a bandaid on a severed limb. It won't help if you don't have at least the minimum tongue weight.
References? From people with engineering degrees?
I've read that the rest of the world usually sets up their trailers with fairly low tongue weights because they use normal cars for towing. As shown above, it seems to work for them.
I am not an engineer on this topic and the 10% "rule" does seem not universal across all countries. I have heard that in Europe they use trailers designed for 5-8% tongue weight. In the US it is almost always recommended 10-15%. There are multiple references for 10-15% tongue weight in the US. Some I found in 5 min:
https://books.google.com/books?id=JgEAAAAAMBAJ&pg=PA94&dq=%22hitch+load%22#v=onepage&q=%22hitch%20load%22&f=false --> this one says that a GM study found 15% to be the most stable (its old from 1971).
Some great posts with math from Ron Gratz who I find is very knowledgeable on this subject:
http://www.rv.net/forum/index.cfm/fuseaction/thread/tid/22277617/gotomsg/22282876.cfm#22282876
http://www.edccorp.com/library/TechRefPdfs/EDC-1082.pdf
Some more math for you:
https://www.rv.net/forum/index.cfm/fuseaction/thread/tid/14265335.cfm
They don't have the choice in the rest of the world, they don't have the money and big trucks we have to haul big stuff around. F250's are not a hot seller in France.
So you make due with what you have.
In Europe a 5k pound trailer would be towed with a Mercedes E class station wagon or something along those lines. I have towed 3k pounds with an E class in the states. It will drag it, and it will stop. But my truck will do it a whole heck of a lot better, and since I'm lucky enough to live in the land of cheap fuel and big trucks that's what I use.
Originally Posted By: IndyIan
Originally Posted By: Nate1979
^^^^
No. 10% is minimum for travel trailer type and you even want a little more just to make it more stable. Friction bar or other type of sway control is like putting a bandaid on a severed limb. It won't help if you don't have at least the minimum tongue weight.
References? From people with engineering degrees?
I've read that the rest of the world usually sets up their trailers with fairly low tongue weights because they use normal cars for towing. As shown above, it seems to work for them.
I am not an engineer on this topic and the 10% "rule" does seem not universal across all countries. I have heard that in Europe they use trailers designed for 5-8% tongue weight. In the US it is almost always recommended 10-15%. There are multiple references for 10-15% tongue weight in the US. Some I found in 5 min:
https://books.google.com/books?id=JgEAAAAAMBAJ&pg=PA94&dq=%22hitch+load%22#v=onepage&q=%22hitch%20load%22&f=false --> this one says that a GM study found 15% to be the most stable (its old from 1971).
Some great posts with math from Ron Gratz who I find is very knowledgeable on this subject:
http://www.rv.net/forum/index.cfm/fuseaction/thread/tid/22277617/gotomsg/22282876.cfm#22282876
http://www.edccorp.com/library/TechRefPdfs/EDC-1082.pdf
Some more math for you:
https://www.rv.net/forum/index.cfm/fuseaction/thread/tid/14265335.cfm
They don't have the choice in the rest of the world, they don't have the money and big trucks we have to haul big stuff around. F250's are not a hot seller in France.
So you make due with what you have.
In Europe a 5k pound trailer would be towed with a Mercedes E class station wagon or something along those lines. I have towed 3k pounds with an E class in the states. It will drag it, and it will stop. But my truck will do it a whole heck of a lot better, and since I'm lucky enough to live in the land of cheap fuel and big trucks that's what I use.
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Originally Posted By: spasm3
Originally Posted By: CKN
I have a 30 foot ultra light that comes in at 4,500 pounds and the truck with just the wife and I. I towed it around the country about 2 years ago and I wouldn't have wanted any more weight in the truck nor a heavier trailer.
30ft at 4500 lbs? Loaded with lp gas and your stuff? I'd love to know what trailer!! 23ft hybrid?
My jayco 23b ultralight is 23ft, 30ft with the beds out and is over 4500lbs loaded.
I still say that you need wheel base for towing travel trailers. There is a lot of difference in pulling a boat, flat trailer, uhaul trailer and a full hard size travel trailer. the wind resistance , cross wind from 18wheelers are a lot different to deal with. Its not just about pulliing the weight, its about controlling it in curves and the above situations. Braking and being able to stop a travel trailer. You don't always find yourself in a straight line when you have to brake hard, so a decent weight tow vehicle and longer wheelbase makes it safer. Yes a WD hitch and a good ( not timed) brake controller are essential.
The 4,500 pounds was the DRY WEIGHT. Sorry I should have put down ready to campweight which would be 5,500 pounds.
It's the 24LSBHG
http://www.eclipservmfg.com/MilanCKSeries
Originally Posted By: CKN
I have a 30 foot ultra light that comes in at 4,500 pounds and the truck with just the wife and I. I towed it around the country about 2 years ago and I wouldn't have wanted any more weight in the truck nor a heavier trailer.
30ft at 4500 lbs? Loaded with lp gas and your stuff? I'd love to know what trailer!! 23ft hybrid?
My jayco 23b ultralight is 23ft, 30ft with the beds out and is over 4500lbs loaded.
I still say that you need wheel base for towing travel trailers. There is a lot of difference in pulling a boat, flat trailer, uhaul trailer and a full hard size travel trailer. the wind resistance , cross wind from 18wheelers are a lot different to deal with. Its not just about pulliing the weight, its about controlling it in curves and the above situations. Braking and being able to stop a travel trailer. You don't always find yourself in a straight line when you have to brake hard, so a decent weight tow vehicle and longer wheelbase makes it safer. Yes a WD hitch and a good ( not timed) brake controller are essential.
The 4,500 pounds was the DRY WEIGHT. Sorry I should have put down ready to campweight which would be 5,500 pounds.
It's the 24LSBHG
http://www.eclipservmfg.com/MilanCKSeries
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Originally Posted By: CKN
Originally Posted By: spasm3
Originally Posted By: CKN
I have a 30 foot ultra light that comes in at 4,500 pounds and the truck with just the wife and I. I towed it around the country about 2 years ago and I wouldn't have wanted any more weight in the truck nor a heavier trailer.
30ft at 4500 lbs? Loaded with lp gas and your stuff? I'd love to know what trailer!! 23ft hybrid?
My jayco 23b ultralight is 23ft, 30ft with the beds out and is over 4500lbs loaded.
I still say that you need wheel base for towing travel trailers. There is a lot of difference in pulling a boat, flat trailer, uhaul trailer and a full hard size travel trailer. the wind resistance , cross wind from 18wheelers are a lot different to deal with. Its not just about pulliing the weight, its about controlling it in curves and the above situations. Braking and being able to stop a travel trailer. You don't always find yourself in a straight line when you have to brake hard, so a decent weight tow vehicle and longer wheelbase makes it safer. Yes a WD hitch and a good ( not timed) brake controller are essential.
The 4,500 pounds was the DRY WEIGHT. Sorry I should have put down ready to campweight which would be 5,500 pounds.
It's the 24LSBHG
http://www.eclipservmfg.com/MilanCKSeries
no problem, Looks nice! Nice that yours has a double door fridge.
Here is my rig
[img:center]
[/img]
[img:center]
[/img]
Originally Posted By: spasm3
Originally Posted By: CKN
I have a 30 foot ultra light that comes in at 4,500 pounds and the truck with just the wife and I. I towed it around the country about 2 years ago and I wouldn't have wanted any more weight in the truck nor a heavier trailer.
30ft at 4500 lbs? Loaded with lp gas and your stuff? I'd love to know what trailer!! 23ft hybrid?
My jayco 23b ultralight is 23ft, 30ft with the beds out and is over 4500lbs loaded.
I still say that you need wheel base for towing travel trailers. There is a lot of difference in pulling a boat, flat trailer, uhaul trailer and a full hard size travel trailer. the wind resistance , cross wind from 18wheelers are a lot different to deal with. Its not just about pulliing the weight, its about controlling it in curves and the above situations. Braking and being able to stop a travel trailer. You don't always find yourself in a straight line when you have to brake hard, so a decent weight tow vehicle and longer wheelbase makes it safer. Yes a WD hitch and a good ( not timed) brake controller are essential.
The 4,500 pounds was the DRY WEIGHT. Sorry I should have put down ready to campweight which would be 5,500 pounds.
It's the 24LSBHG
http://www.eclipservmfg.com/MilanCKSeries
no problem, Looks nice! Nice that yours has a double door fridge.
Here is my rig
[img:center]
[/img] [img:center]
[/img]
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Originally Posted By: CKN
Originally Posted By: clinebarger
Originally Posted By: CKN
He will be over payload (or right at it) even with most half-ton trucks.
He needs at least a 3/4 ton truck. As another poster suggested-he needs to open the driver's side door of the vehicles he is considering at look at the PAYLOAD NUMBER.
I don't think anyone needs a 3/4 ton rig to haul a 5000# camper. A 1500 Suburban can tow that pretty easy with a W-D hitch.....I wouldn't bumper pull a camper/TT without one. However there is truth in what your saying about the numbers.
2006 2wd Suburban with Tow Package....
GVWR 7000#
Payload Capacity 1731#
GCWR 13,000#
5000# camper with 15% on the tongue = 750#, 1731-750= 981# left for occupants & gear in the truck itself, Not much margin.
Lets say you max out the vehicle at 7000# (including tongue weight), 7,000# truck + 5,000# camper= 12,000#, So in theory you can still add 1000# to the camper in the form of gear & luggage (Pretending the GVWR of the camper is not exceeded)
In the end, These specs are VERY conservative! If a Suburban cant tow a 5,000 pound camper....Something is seriously wrong.
I used to have a Heartland Big Horn 3055 5th wheel, Weighed 10,400# dry, That I pulled with my '06 2500HD, Exceeded pin weight, & payload limits quite often with no ill effects.
I have a 2011 Silverado Crew Cab with the 5.3 and 2WD It has a payload of 1444 pounds(AND I HAVE THE "TOW PKG.). The tongue weight of his trailer will be about 750 pounds. Put 4 additional passengers in my truck, and add all the stuff you take for camping (Bikes,Ice Chest, Firewood, Dog, Easy ups, etc.,) and explain how I am not going to exceed the approximately 700 pounds left under my payload.
Most Half-ton trucks DO NOT HAVE ENOUGH PAYLOAD as I have previously stated.
I have a 30 foot ultra light that comes in at 4,500 pounds and the truck with just the wife and I. I towed it around the country about 2 years ago and I wouldn't have wanted any more weight in the truck nor a heavier trailer.
From what I gather, The OP's buddy has already towed this TT with a midsized FWD SUV?
A '96 Roadmaster station wagon would be a step up from that! A 1500 Suburban would be perfect.
I mentioned the Roadmaster wagon because I have a customer that tows a 6000+# TT with his. Though modified....383 stroker LT1, 4L80E, 9.5" diff w/ 12" drums & rear springs out of a Fleetwood Hearse, Air bags, Baer front brakes, Oversized sway bars, W-D hitch, & Prodigy brake controller.
Originally Posted By: clinebarger
Originally Posted By: CKN
He will be over payload (or right at it) even with most half-ton trucks.
He needs at least a 3/4 ton truck. As another poster suggested-he needs to open the driver's side door of the vehicles he is considering at look at the PAYLOAD NUMBER.
I don't think anyone needs a 3/4 ton rig to haul a 5000# camper. A 1500 Suburban can tow that pretty easy with a W-D hitch.....I wouldn't bumper pull a camper/TT without one. However there is truth in what your saying about the numbers.
2006 2wd Suburban with Tow Package....
GVWR 7000#
Payload Capacity 1731#
GCWR 13,000#
5000# camper with 15% on the tongue = 750#, 1731-750= 981# left for occupants & gear in the truck itself, Not much margin.
Lets say you max out the vehicle at 7000# (including tongue weight), 7,000# truck + 5,000# camper= 12,000#, So in theory you can still add 1000# to the camper in the form of gear & luggage (Pretending the GVWR of the camper is not exceeded)
In the end, These specs are VERY conservative! If a Suburban cant tow a 5,000 pound camper....Something is seriously wrong.
I used to have a Heartland Big Horn 3055 5th wheel, Weighed 10,400# dry, That I pulled with my '06 2500HD, Exceeded pin weight, & payload limits quite often with no ill effects.
I have a 2011 Silverado Crew Cab with the 5.3 and 2WD It has a payload of 1444 pounds(AND I HAVE THE "TOW PKG.). The tongue weight of his trailer will be about 750 pounds. Put 4 additional passengers in my truck, and add all the stuff you take for camping (Bikes,Ice Chest, Firewood, Dog, Easy ups, etc.,) and explain how I am not going to exceed the approximately 700 pounds left under my payload.
Most Half-ton trucks DO NOT HAVE ENOUGH PAYLOAD as I have previously stated.
I have a 30 foot ultra light that comes in at 4,500 pounds and the truck with just the wife and I. I towed it around the country about 2 years ago and I wouldn't have wanted any more weight in the truck nor a heavier trailer.
From what I gather, The OP's buddy has already towed this TT with a midsized FWD SUV?
A '96 Roadmaster station wagon would be a step up from that! A 1500 Suburban would be perfect.
I mentioned the Roadmaster wagon because I have a customer that tows a 6000+# TT with his. Though modified....383 stroker LT1, 4L80E, 9.5" diff w/ 12" drums & rear springs out of a Fleetwood Hearse, Air bags, Baer front brakes, Oversized sway bars, W-D hitch, & Prodigy brake controller.
Originally Posted By: Ramblejam
Originally Posted By: hattaresguy
I have spent a fair amount of wheel time on my buddies Suburban this summer and its a fantastic vehicle. I'd highly recommend one.
What spec? (Year, engine, etc.)
2014, looks pretty loaded with leather and 20in wheels, don't know GM's trim specs. Assume the motor is a 5.3
Originally Posted By: hattaresguy
I have spent a fair amount of wheel time on my buddies Suburban this summer and its a fantastic vehicle. I'd highly recommend one.
What spec? (Year, engine, etc.)
2014, looks pretty loaded with leather and 20in wheels, don't know GM's trim specs. Assume the motor is a 5.3
Originally Posted By: IndyIan
Good information in those links, although I didn't find anything that explains the effects of an anti sway damper and the required tongue weight for stability.
Many of the UK caravanning sites say to add one if needed of course, which is more often is I assume, given that they run lower tongue weights.
Anyways, probably if we ever get a 4000lb trailer, and have something like a Pathfinder with a silly low payload, I'll run the tongue weight heavy enough to avoid sway problems, keep my speeds reasonable (65 and under) and not worry about going slightly over the payload ratings the odd time.
Also, as far as I can tell the highway traffic act in ontario doesn't seem to even mention manufacturer ratings on personal vehicles, just trailer weights(over 3200lbs needs brakes) and combined vehicle and trailer weights(over 10k lbs needs a yearly inspection ). If anyone can find something different I'd love to see it.
I have towed with an older pathfinder and it was just not a good tow vehicle. Any vehicle that rides luxuriously on a daily basis is sprung too soft for towing. I had an older pathfinder-- rated for 5000 lbs but put 2500-3000 behind it and it was white-knuckle. The vehicle rode too soft for its height and more importantly, had too short a wheelbase. Conversely, the same trailer behind a chrysler minivan rated for 2500 was a far, far better, experience. The van chassis was actually good for 3500 in all fairness but was de-rated with the smaller engine. It still did fine. the van had shorter rubber and leaf springs on the rear. It may be a short-sighted way to look at it, but in my experience, if it has coil springs in the back, it's not going to work well, at least without weight-distributing hitch.
I pay little heed to engine size. it's ok to slow on hills. Towing needs to be out of OD anyway to keep AT temps down. It's about stability and braking. I'd bet he could put a WDH on his current vehicle with steering stabilizer and be much better off than any pathfinder or midsize suv.
Good tow vehicles OTOH do not make as comfortable of an experience as a DD.
Good information in those links, although I didn't find anything that explains the effects of an anti sway damper and the required tongue weight for stability.
Many of the UK caravanning sites say to add one if needed of course, which is more often is I assume, given that they run lower tongue weights.
Anyways, probably if we ever get a 4000lb trailer, and have something like a Pathfinder with a silly low payload, I'll run the tongue weight heavy enough to avoid sway problems, keep my speeds reasonable (65 and under) and not worry about going slightly over the payload ratings the odd time.
Also, as far as I can tell the highway traffic act in ontario doesn't seem to even mention manufacturer ratings on personal vehicles, just trailer weights(over 3200lbs needs brakes) and combined vehicle and trailer weights(over 10k lbs needs a yearly inspection ). If anyone can find something different I'd love to see it.
I have towed with an older pathfinder and it was just not a good tow vehicle. Any vehicle that rides luxuriously on a daily basis is sprung too soft for towing. I had an older pathfinder-- rated for 5000 lbs but put 2500-3000 behind it and it was white-knuckle. The vehicle rode too soft for its height and more importantly, had too short a wheelbase. Conversely, the same trailer behind a chrysler minivan rated for 2500 was a far, far better, experience. The van chassis was actually good for 3500 in all fairness but was de-rated with the smaller engine. It still did fine. the van had shorter rubber and leaf springs on the rear. It may be a short-sighted way to look at it, but in my experience, if it has coil springs in the back, it's not going to work well, at least without weight-distributing hitch.
I pay little heed to engine size. it's ok to slow on hills. Towing needs to be out of OD anyway to keep AT temps down. It's about stability and braking. I'd bet he could put a WDH on his current vehicle with steering stabilizer and be much better off than any pathfinder or midsize suv.
Good tow vehicles OTOH do not make as comfortable of an experience as a DD.
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The ultimate tow rig is the Suburban or Tahoe. The only downsides I can think of is tad more fuel consumption around town and a bit huge as daily driver.
I grew up with 3/4 ton Suburban 4x4 for sisters horses and it was effortless to tow with.
I grew up with 3/4 ton Suburban 4x4 for sisters horses and it was effortless to tow with.
I'm sticking with my suggestion of more tongue weight and maybe airbags in the coils.
Originally Posted By: clinebarger
Originally Posted By: CKN
Originally Posted By: clinebarger
Originally Posted By: CKN
He will be over payload (or right at it) even with most half-ton trucks.
He needs at least a 3/4 ton truck. As another poster suggested-he needs to open the driver's side door of the vehicles he is considering at look at the PAYLOAD NUMBER.
I don't think anyone needs a 3/4 ton rig to haul a 5000# camper. A 1500 Suburban can tow that pretty easy with a W-D hitch.....I wouldn't bumper pull a camper/TT without one. However there is truth in what your saying about the numbers.
2006 2wd Suburban with Tow Package....
GVWR 7000#
Payload Capacity 1731#
GCWR 13,000#
5000# camper with 15% on the tongue = 750#, 1731-750= 981# left for occupants & gear in the truck itself, Not much margin.
Lets say you max out the vehicle at 7000# (including tongue weight), 7,000# truck + 5,000# camper= 12,000#, So in theory you can still add 1000# to the camper in the form of gear & luggage (Pretending the GVWR of the camper is not exceeded)
In the end, These specs are VERY conservative! If a Suburban cant tow a 5,000 pound camper....Something is seriously wrong.
I used to have a Heartland Big Horn 3055 5th wheel, Weighed 10,400# dry, That I pulled with my '06 2500HD, Exceeded pin weight, & payload limits quite often with no ill effects.
I have a 2011 Silverado Crew Cab with the 5.3 and 2WD It has a payload of 1444 pounds(AND I HAVE THE "TOW PKG.). The tongue weight of his trailer will be about 750 pounds. Put 4 additional passengers in my truck, and add all the stuff you take for camping (Bikes,Ice Chest, Firewood, Dog, Easy ups, etc.,) and explain how I am not going to exceed the approximately 700 pounds left under my payload.
Most Half-ton trucks DO NOT HAVE ENOUGH PAYLOAD as I have previously stated.
I have a 30 foot ultra light that comes in at 4,500 pounds and the truck with just the wife and I. I towed it around the country about 2 years ago and I wouldn't have wanted any more weight in the truck nor a heavier trailer.
From what I gather, The OP's buddy has already towed this TT with a midsized FWD SUV?
A '96 Roadmaster station wagon would be a step up from that! A 1500 Suburban would be perfect.
I mentioned the Roadmaster wagon because I have a customer that tows a 6000+# TT with his. Though modified....383 stroker LT1, 4L80E, 9.5" diff w/ 12" drums & rear springs out of a Fleetwood Hearse, Air bags, Baer front brakes, Oversized sway bars, W-D hitch, & Prodigy brake controller.
Even without those upgrades, weren't they rated for 7500? Bet it tows nicely with the upgrades.
Originally Posted By: clinebarger
Originally Posted By: CKN
Originally Posted By: clinebarger
Originally Posted By: CKN
He will be over payload (or right at it) even with most half-ton trucks.
He needs at least a 3/4 ton truck. As another poster suggested-he needs to open the driver's side door of the vehicles he is considering at look at the PAYLOAD NUMBER.
I don't think anyone needs a 3/4 ton rig to haul a 5000# camper. A 1500 Suburban can tow that pretty easy with a W-D hitch.....I wouldn't bumper pull a camper/TT without one. However there is truth in what your saying about the numbers.
2006 2wd Suburban with Tow Package....
GVWR 7000#
Payload Capacity 1731#
GCWR 13,000#
5000# camper with 15% on the tongue = 750#, 1731-750= 981# left for occupants & gear in the truck itself, Not much margin.
Lets say you max out the vehicle at 7000# (including tongue weight), 7,000# truck + 5,000# camper= 12,000#, So in theory you can still add 1000# to the camper in the form of gear & luggage (Pretending the GVWR of the camper is not exceeded)
In the end, These specs are VERY conservative! If a Suburban cant tow a 5,000 pound camper....Something is seriously wrong.
I used to have a Heartland Big Horn 3055 5th wheel, Weighed 10,400# dry, That I pulled with my '06 2500HD, Exceeded pin weight, & payload limits quite often with no ill effects.
I have a 2011 Silverado Crew Cab with the 5.3 and 2WD It has a payload of 1444 pounds(AND I HAVE THE "TOW PKG.). The tongue weight of his trailer will be about 750 pounds. Put 4 additional passengers in my truck, and add all the stuff you take for camping (Bikes,Ice Chest, Firewood, Dog, Easy ups, etc.,) and explain how I am not going to exceed the approximately 700 pounds left under my payload.
Most Half-ton trucks DO NOT HAVE ENOUGH PAYLOAD as I have previously stated.
I have a 30 foot ultra light that comes in at 4,500 pounds and the truck with just the wife and I. I towed it around the country about 2 years ago and I wouldn't have wanted any more weight in the truck nor a heavier trailer.
From what I gather, The OP's buddy has already towed this TT with a midsized FWD SUV?
A '96 Roadmaster station wagon would be a step up from that! A 1500 Suburban would be perfect.
I mentioned the Roadmaster wagon because I have a customer that tows a 6000+# TT with his. Though modified....383 stroker LT1, 4L80E, 9.5" diff w/ 12" drums & rear springs out of a Fleetwood Hearse, Air bags, Baer front brakes, Oversized sway bars, W-D hitch, & Prodigy brake controller.
Even without those upgrades, weren't they rated for 7500? Bet it tows nicely with the upgrades.
Originally Posted By: meep
It may be a short-sighted way to look at it, but in my experience, if it has coil springs in the back, it's not going to work well, at least without weight-distributing hitch.
Nah. Just ask anyone with a newer Ram -- coils work great with any appreciable weight:
It may be a short-sighted way to look at it, but in my experience, if it has coil springs in the back, it's not going to work well, at least without weight-distributing hitch.
Nah. Just ask anyone with a newer Ram -- coils work great with any appreciable weight:
Originally Posted By: Ramblejam
Originally Posted By: itguy08
or use a more appropriate truck...
That truck has a 7,100lb. tow rating.
With that number, why should someone expect such results when towing a Fiero?
That trailer weighs more than the Fiero! That's a 15-20k capacity trailer meant for tractors, Bobcats and the like. He has enough truck, but too much trailer and probably no weight distributing hitch.
Originally Posted By: itguy08
or use a more appropriate truck...
That truck has a 7,100lb. tow rating.
With that number, why should someone expect such results when towing a Fiero?
That trailer weighs more than the Fiero! That's a 15-20k capacity trailer meant for tractors, Bobcats and the like. He has enough truck, but too much trailer and probably no weight distributing hitch.
Originally Posted By: Ramblejam
Originally Posted By: meep
It may be a short-sighted way to look at it, but in my experience, if it has coil springs in the back, it's not going to work well, at least without weight-distributing hitch.
Nah. Just ask anyone with a newer Ram -- coils work great with any appreciable weight:
That was the Fiero the Car and Driver wonks ran. http://www.nytimes.com/2008/09/28/automobiles/28LEMONS.html?pagewanted=all
The truck could be one of their test vehicles.
Originally Posted By: meep
It may be a short-sighted way to look at it, but in my experience, if it has coil springs in the back, it's not going to work well, at least without weight-distributing hitch.
Nah. Just ask anyone with a newer Ram -- coils work great with any appreciable weight:
That was the Fiero the Car and Driver wonks ran. http://www.nytimes.com/2008/09/28/automobiles/28LEMONS.html?pagewanted=all
The truck could be one of their test vehicles.
Originally Posted By: Ramblejam
Originally Posted By: itguy08
or use a more appropriate truck...
That truck has a 7,100lb. tow rating.
With that number, why should someone expect such results when towing a Fiero?
That sag has to affect steering and at night will blind other drivers. He either needs to adjust his WDH (or get one) or get a truck that will not sag with that type of tongue load. A Ram 1500 ain't that vehicle.
Originally Posted By: itguy08
or use a more appropriate truck...
That truck has a 7,100lb. tow rating.
With that number, why should someone expect such results when towing a Fiero?
That sag has to affect steering and at night will blind other drivers. He either needs to adjust his WDH (or get one) or get a truck that will not sag with that type of tongue load. A Ram 1500 ain't that vehicle.
Originally Posted By: Joshua_Skinner
That trailer weighs more than the Fiero! That's a 15-20k capacity trailer meant for tractors, Bobcats and the like. He has enough truck, but too much trailer and probably no weight distributing hitch.
Both the car and trailer are around 2500, for a total of 5k.
Originally Posted By: itguy08
That sag has to affect steering and at night will blind other drivers. He either needs to adjust his WDH (or get one) or get a truck that will not sag with that type of tongue load. A Ram 1500 ain't that vehicle.
Not disagreeing with the end result (sag). Just saying that what we see above shouldn't be the end result of towing such a load with a truck rated for 7,100lbs. That brings us full-circle to talking about coil springs...
That trailer weighs more than the Fiero! That's a 15-20k capacity trailer meant for tractors, Bobcats and the like. He has enough truck, but too much trailer and probably no weight distributing hitch.
Both the car and trailer are around 2500, for a total of 5k.
Originally Posted By: itguy08
That sag has to affect steering and at night will blind other drivers. He either needs to adjust his WDH (or get one) or get a truck that will not sag with that type of tongue load. A Ram 1500 ain't that vehicle.
Not disagreeing with the end result (sag). Just saying that what we see above shouldn't be the end result of towing such a load with a truck rated for 7,100lbs. That brings us full-circle to talking about coil springs...
Originally Posted By: Ramblejam
Originally Posted By: Joshua_Skinner
That trailer weighs more than the Fiero! That's a 15-20k capacity trailer meant for tractors, Bobcats and the like. He has enough truck, but too much trailer and probably no weight distributing hitch.
Both the car and trailer are around 2500, for a total of 5k.
Originally Posted By: itguy08
That sag has to affect steering and at night will blind other drivers. He either needs to adjust his WDH (or get one) or get a truck that will not sag with that type of tongue load. A Ram 1500 ain't that vehicle.
Not disagreeing with the end result (sag). Just saying that what we see above shouldn't be the end result of towing such a load with a truck rated for 7,100lbs. That brings us full-circle to talking about coil springs...
I pulled that exact same load yesterday with a 2014 Ram 1500, no weight distributing hitch, and had no excessive sag. It might have dropped the back end 2" at most. It was a 2695 lb. 16' tilt trailer and most of a John Deere B, totaling right at 5000 lbs., maybe a bit more. All the weight was from the rear trailer axel forward. I don't know the exact tongue weight, but it towed beautifully, even to a brief 70 mph.
I'd say that trailer is improperly loaded or the bed is full of stuff we can't see.
Ed
Originally Posted By: Joshua_Skinner
That trailer weighs more than the Fiero! That's a 15-20k capacity trailer meant for tractors, Bobcats and the like. He has enough truck, but too much trailer and probably no weight distributing hitch.
Both the car and trailer are around 2500, for a total of 5k.
Originally Posted By: itguy08
That sag has to affect steering and at night will blind other drivers. He either needs to adjust his WDH (or get one) or get a truck that will not sag with that type of tongue load. A Ram 1500 ain't that vehicle.
Not disagreeing with the end result (sag). Just saying that what we see above shouldn't be the end result of towing such a load with a truck rated for 7,100lbs. That brings us full-circle to talking about coil springs...
I pulled that exact same load yesterday with a 2014 Ram 1500, no weight distributing hitch, and had no excessive sag. It might have dropped the back end 2" at most. It was a 2695 lb. 16' tilt trailer and most of a John Deere B, totaling right at 5000 lbs., maybe a bit more. All the weight was from the rear trailer axel forward. I don't know the exact tongue weight, but it towed beautifully, even to a brief 70 mph.
I'd say that trailer is improperly loaded or the bed is full of stuff we can't see.
Ed
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