Social Security

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What the government and most financial planners neglect to include in their calculations is the time value of money. This is something that is real, and must be included in your calculations or your results will be meaningless.

In my case I did a spreadsheet with the following assumptions:
1. I was fully retired at 64. No earned income past that point. Age 62 should give similar results, but the calculations might change slightly.
2. Income tax on benefits was not considered. Too many variables to include this in the calculations.
3. SS payments from 64 to 66 (my full retirement age) were saved and invested in an account. Investment returns of 0% (checking account), 3% (bond funds) and 8% (estimated average index fund return) were calculated.
4. After age 66 funds were drawn out of the account monthly in the amount that SS payments were reduced by taking it early. I believe I used a 16% reduction in benefits (slightly higher than the actual reduction) assumption.

I'm having to use a questionable memory, but from what I recall, with no investment income the "checking account" was zeroed out at around 83 years of age. This would be the break even point without considering the time value of money. A "bond fund" account ran out of money around 87 years of age. The account that averaged 8% returns never ran out of money, and would grow as long as i lived.

So what did I do? I'm 68 and still haven't started collecting on my earnings history. In my case, I considered I may predecease my spouse, and I wanted the higher spousal benefits available to her by my delaying to 70. This outweighed my conclusion that overall I'd have more money by taking SS early and investing in S&P 500 index funds. I am able to currently draw much reduced benefits based upon my spouse's earnings while mine grow, but that loophole has been eliminated and can't be factored into your decision.

Other considerations:
1. You get a cost of living adjustment that applies to your total SS payment. Favors holding off.
2. If you are married, are the higher income spouse, and will likely be outlived, favors holding off.
3. If you will spend the early payments and not invest them, and depend on SS as your main source of income in retirement, you are generally better off waiting as long as you can up to 70.
4. If you think politicans won't fix the shortfall and benefits will be reduced then you might want to take it early. I did not factor this into my decision.
5. If you delay you probably will pay income taxes on more of your SS payments. I've mitigated that by rolling over IRA/401k funds into a Roth IRA between age 64 and 70, reducing that tax impact.

Edit: In a post above IRA/401k minimum distributions are mentioned at age 70.5. For individuals turning that age in 2020 and later that was just changed by the Secure Act to 72 years old.
 
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Originally Posted by spasm3
My question is, if you do have a long life expectancy, should you start collecting early? Even though you will get less per month, won't you collect for several years longer, and with a longer life expectancy, which method yields more money?


Depends how long you live. Its a fairly straight forward calculation to perform on a spreadsheet. You can even factor in the time value of money at various assumptions of investment yields on the money if so desired.
 
Back to the original question, as someone who was just a working stiff paying into the system for 40 years straight, when I signed up for SS there were no options for "maximizing" benefits beyond merely delaying the start date. The math to calculate the monthly check amount is relatively uncomplicated. It is based on the inflation adjusted highest 35 years of wages, and the age tables are set up so that you receive the same $$ by around age 77 or 78 regardless of when you start. The complicated part about this is figuring out whether you want to enjoy the money now or will need it for beans and rice in the future.

The big caveat on starting payments at age 62 is whether you plan to work and earn above the annual allowable wage earnings in the years prior to reaching full retirement age.
There isn't much point in accepting a reduction in the monthly check to start your SS payments early and then have SS hold back from your check half of what you earn over the allowable earnings limit.

Another caveat and this wasn't a concern of mine so I didn't dig into it very deep, but it's my understanding that if you have a wife who didn't work enough to qualify for her own SS and will be depending on your SS to determine her benefits, starting YOUR SS early also lowers HER benefits. So, from that standpoint, starting your benefits at 62 would make her lifetime benefits lower and therefore have somewhat of a snowball effect on your combined benefits.
 
Originally Posted by grampi
Maybe some of you who are drawing SS can answer a question for me. I am always hearing these ads on the radio for these consultants who claim they can maximize your SS benefits, and that there are thousands of pages of info in the SS guide on all of the rules and guidelines for they system. I plan on taking my benefit right at age 62 and I see no way to increase my amount of benefit other than waiting longer to take it. Is that the ONLY way to increase my retirement benefit?

For every year to postpone claiming your benefit past 62, you gain 8 percent each year.
 
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There are many books out there that go over the calculations. Basically it's supposed to be neutral, but the numbers indicate that people are actually living longer than the numbers they use so waiting is supposed to be better on average unless you have a family history or have some illness. As for SS running out of money, that's not supposed to happen til 2037 and then they will only be able to pay out 76% of benefits so your check would just be less, not just go to zero. It can be fixed with various measures such as raising taxes or reducing benefits but it keeps getting kicked down the road.
 
If you had put your share and your employers share into your Roth IRA you would have had way over a million dollars tax free in your Roth when you retired. Oh and when you died it would belong to your estate not Uncle Sugar!
 
Originally Posted by Lou_Boyle


Another caveat and this wasn't a concern of mine so I didn't dig into it very deep, but it's my understanding that if you have a wife who didn't work enough to qualify for her own SS and will be depending on your SS to determine her benefits, starting YOUR SS early also lowers HER benefits. So, from that standpoint, starting your benefits at 62 would make her lifetime benefits lower and therefore have somewhat of a snowball effect on your combined benefits.



Not exactly correct. This was the way I read it, but when I started collecting based on my wife's income I found it wasn't true.

My wife started collecting at age 62. I was over 66 and started my spousal benefit. I expected to get half of her reduced benefit once she started collecting. It turns out my payment is half of her full retirement age benefit, not half of the reduced benefit she is getting.

If you start collecting early it will reduce the death benefit payments available to a lower earning spouse in case you predecease her.
 
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Originally Posted by atikovi
What if they discover the aging gene in the next ten years and everybody lives to 200 or more? Then you're screwed if you started collecting at 62.

Possibly--don't forget, SS is supposed to track inflation. What do they call it, COLA? Cost of living adjustment?

Now, if everyone started living to 200, somehow overnight, yeah things would have to change... not sure that is keeping anyone awake at night though.
 
Originally Posted by supton
Now, if everyone started living to 200, somehow overnight, yeah things would have to change... not sure that is keeping anyone awake at night though.


Yea, but then, everybody would have to work until 150, so it all evens out in the end.
 
Kinda depends on how much you earn.

My gut reaction is if you are high earner, it really doesn't matter much.

Why?

Let's look at the benefits formula. I'm using numbers for 2019 Adjusted Indexed Monthly Earnings (AIME) but following years will be about the same.

AIME is an inflation adjusted value taking into account your 35 highest earning years.

https://www.ssa.gov/oact/progdata/retirebenefit2.html

For 2019 Benefits are paid based on the following Annual Indexed Monthly Earnings AIME:

90% of each dollar up to $926 AIME
32% of each dollar from $927 to $5583 AIME
15% of each dollar from $5584 to $9300 AIME

So those who, over the course of their life averaged less than about 10-11k/year in 2019 dollars will get 90% of their income in Social Security or up to ~$833/month

Those whose AIME came out to no more than $67000 year (estimates in my head, don't ding me for being off by a thousand or so here or there) will get the ~$833/month plus up to another $1490 to make a total of $2323.

- High earners, those who made more than about $67k/year in AIME will get that $2323 plus up to another 558 maxing out at ~$2881

These are full retirement age benefit payouts. If you retire earlier, like at 62, these numbers go down.

For those with AIME above the $67k/year, it may not make sense to keep working too many more years, from a Social Security perspective, as close to 40% of wages are paid at only a 15% benefits rate compared to lower income workers.

It may not be worth it trying to tack on another 4-5 years to get to full retirement age or even beyond before taking benefits as relative to what you earned, you are not getting that much more back for your time.

But for higher earning workers, the benefits per dollar earnings are lower and it just may not be worth working a job simply to maximize your Social Security benefits.

For workers with more modest incomes, it might make more sense. Especially for those who will end up getting 90% of their AIME in benefits. Heck, if they keep earning at that pace even after they "retire" they will see an improvement in their fiscal situation, getting 90% of what they earned, tax free.
 
I have already decided to take my benefit at age 62. Is there anything I can do, a certain way to apply for my benefit, that would increase the amount I get, or is waiting longer to take it the only way of increasing my benefit?
 
Just make sure all your quarters of wages are properly recorded.

There used to be some special credit for Military Service up to 2001. It's probably in there now if you served, but check to be sure.

https://www.ssa.gov/planners/retire/military.html

There are probably some other plans if you were married to a high wage earner for 10 years or more. If you didn't remarry, you might be eligible for claims on a former or deceased spouse.

I suspect these "benefits maximizers" ask questions about these sorts of situations, or others where you have a military or government service retirement (such as my wife's educator plan, she doesn't pay in to Social Security) and your situation is more complex.

If you don't have any special situations where you can draw on the benefits of others, or others are drawing on yours, chances are there is no special magic to this.
 
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Originally Posted by supton
Originally Posted by atikovi
What if they discover the aging gene in the next ten years and everybody lives to 200 or more? Then you're screwed if you started collecting at 62.

Possibly--don't forget, SS is supposed to track inflation. What do they call it, COLA? Cost of living adjustment?

Now, if everyone started living to 200, somehow overnight, yeah things would have to change... not sure that is keeping anyone awake at night though.


Well trust me I've retired for 13.5 years and it doesn't. I don't care what they tell you.
 
Originally Posted by grampi
I have already decided to take my benefit at age 62. Is there anything I can do, a certain way to apply for my benefit, that would increase the amount I get, or is waiting longer to take it the only way of increasing my benefit?


You haven't gotten a simple answer to your question yet. I've been looking into this as well and haven't found anything about filling out the form differently to get more money. My financial guy is a good friend and he doesn't have any tricks for me. If you've decided to start taking benefit at 62 it is what it is apparently.
 
Originally Posted by AZjeff
Originally Posted by grampi
I have already decided to take my benefit at age 62. Is there anything I can do, a certain way to apply for my benefit, that would increase the amount I get, or is waiting longer to take it the only way of increasing my benefit?


You haven't gotten a simple answer to your question yet. I've been looking into this as well and haven't found anything about filling out the form differently to get more money. My financial guy is a good friend and he doesn't have any tricks for me. If you've decided to start taking benefit at 62 it is what it is apparently.





It's looking more and more like the only way to increase the benefit is to wait longer to take it, which I'm not going to do...
 
My wife and I both took ours at 62. Short of waiting til your full retirement age I am not aware of any way to increase your benefit. As another poster said, it is what it is.
 
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