AWD with Summers vs FWD with winters

[Wolf359]

Originally Posted by edyvw
Originally Posted by AuthorEditor
Sure, winter tires are great, but you don't need them 90% of the time if you have good all-season tires and you are a normal driver. In the Northeast most of us do very little driving on snow-covered roads like that with no treatment. In New York the plows are out before the first snow starts treating the roads, and then they go 24/7 nonstop until the roads are clear again. "Winter" driving often means slippery conditions, but not pure snow. The road is likely to be a mix of bare pavement, thin snow, slush, water, and ice. With care I regularly commuted in that slop for decades in all sorts of vehicles with just all seasons. The first hint that the roads are getting bad is usually a 4WD truck or SUV in the ditch because they were going too fast.

What about 10% of the time?
I have both vehicles on winter tires, and trust me, Colorado is much better in winter than anything in the Northeast. But, tell me what happens when 2 year old runs 105 degrees temperature at 3am and outside is blizzard?
Most of the time when I actually needed winter tires to stop, it was hard braking on green light bcs someone who does not need winter tires 90% of the time could not stop on the red light.


Well you just stay home the other 10% of the time. If you need to travel in a blizzard and it's a medical emergency, you call an ambulance.

 

[Treadstone]

Originally Posted by Wolf359
Originally Posted by JimPghPA
I will agree that they could have put all seasons on all 4 of the AWD, and then compared it to a FWD with winters.


Yeah, because who really drives on summer tires in an AWD car in the winter? Mostly likely just regular all seasons.


Exactly. I have never had a problem in snow/ice/slush with good all season tires and AWD/4WD. But then again, I don't drive like a bat out of [censored] in those conditions anyway.

 

[Quattro Pete]

Originally Posted by Wolf359
Well you just stay home the other 10% of the time. If you need to travel in a blizzard and it's a medical emergency, you call an ambulance.

Yeah, but it may take some time for an ambulance to arrive, depending on where you live.

 

[Quattro Pete]

Originally Posted by supton
Dealing with a second set of tires isn't that big of a deal to me but listening to tire roar is.
Maybe it depends on how well soundproofed your car is? When I run winter tires on my 530i, I don't find them any noisier than my summer tires. On wife's Q5, winter tire noise is slightly more audible, but far from "roar."

 

[Quattro Pete]

Originally Posted by AuthorEditor
Sure, winter tires are great, but you don't need them 90% of the time.

That's like saying there is no point buying insurance because you don't need it 90% of the time.

 

[Treadstone]

Originally Posted by painfx
Originally Posted by AuthorEditor
For over a decade I worked in the Southern Adirondack Mountains and I commuted in a rear drive Crown Vic and a Grand Marquis with nothing but all-season radials. I did carry a couple of heavy toolboxes and other junk in the trunk, and sometimes a big bag of salt or two. I've had AWD and 4WD drive vehicles wipe out within sight on bad roads, while I remained in control. How you drive is more important than the particular equipment you have. Would winter tires on all four wheels have been better? Yes! I just couldn't justify the price and the hassle, and then have to endure wearing down my expensive tires for the 95% of the time they weren't needed at all. We would often take a winter trip or two from New York to Florida and back, totaling 5-6K of driving. What a waste that would be driving on winter tires.


Not any all season tires is good in snow. Hence, I ask is there an all season tires you can recommend? Brand and model? Thanks


I have had great results with the GY WeatherReady[FWD], DuraTrac[AT tire/4WD], and Continental TrueContact Tour[AWD] and ControlContact[FWD] in snow/ice/slush.

 

[Treadstone]

Originally Posted by Quattro Pete
Originally Posted by AuthorEditor
Sure, winter tires are great, but you don't need them 90% of the time.

That's like saying there is no point buying insurance because you don't need it 90% of the time.


FAIL

The snow tire brigade never quits.

Good all season tires and the new breed of all weather tires have advanced to the point where if you live somewhere where you only see a few days of snow per year, there is no longer the need for a dedicated set of winter tires that are absolutely dangerous the rest of the year.

 

[Quattro Pete]

Originally Posted by Treadstone
Originally Posted by Quattro Pete
Originally Posted by AuthorEditor
Sure, winter tires are great, but you don't need them 90% of the time.

That's like saying there is no point buying insurance because you don't need it 90% of the time.


FAIL

The snow tire brigade never quits.
You do what works for you. I am not forcing you to use winter tires.

From personal experience, based on the road conditions that I may encounter, I prepare for the worst. My wife had a C300 4-matic with all-season tires. It handled Michigan winters very poorly.

 

[Quattro Pete]

Originally Posted by Treadstone
a dedicated set of winter tires that are absolutely dangerous the rest of the year.

Tell me more about it.

Nobody is advocating that you run winter tires all year long.

 

[supton]

Originally Posted by Quattro Pete
Originally Posted by supton
Dealing with a second set of tires isn't that big of a deal to me but listening to tire roar is.
Maybe it depends on how well soundproofed your car is? When I run winter tires on my 530i, I don't find them any noisier than my summer tires. On wife's Q5, winter tire noise is slightly more audible, but far from "roar."


Wife's Camry, last set of snows decided to chop (5k rotations apparently isn't aggressive enough), and I could definitely hear the change going from snow to all season (as could she). My truck, I can tell the new Hankook ATM's are not all season, although I still haven't heard the iPikes (yet).

My old Camry, the fast I go the less of anything I hear, it all just blends together...

What can I say, I'm a cheapskate, my cars aren't particularly quiet I guess.

 

[Env1ous]

Originally Posted by Wolf359
Originally Posted by JimPghPA
I will agree that they could have put all seasons on all 4 of the AWD, and then compared it to a FWD with winters.


Yeah, because who really drives on summer tires in an AWD car in the winter? Mostly likely just regular all seasons.


I had my Volvo S60R running summer tires and we got a really early blizzard and I had to drive 40 miles to work on summer tires. It was a terrible time. I left at 3:00 and got there at 6am with no traffic.

 

[Treadstone]

Originally Posted by Quattro Pete
Originally Posted by Treadstone
a dedicated set of winter tires that are absolutely dangerous the rest of the year.

Tell me more about it.

Nobody is advocating that you run winter tires all year long.



Most people around here put their snow tires on in November and take them off in April. All for maybe, maybe, one week of snow, unless they go into the mountains for skiing. So that means the REST of the time, they are driving on inferior tires when it is 50*F and raining.....

And yet, with my vehicles and proper, good all season/all weather tires, we are good 12 months of the year, and have no issues going anywhere in the snow we do get....

 

[krzyss]

Originally Posted by Quattro Pete
Originally Posted by Treadstone
a dedicated set of winter tires that are absolutely dangerous the rest of the year.

Tell me more about it.

Nobody is advocating that you run winter tires all year long.


Maybe except people who use 3MPSF branded all seasons ;-)

I think it is much safer to use winter tires in summer than summer tires in winter but nothing beats proper tools.

In case of OP. The Camry has massive tires (the same size 300HP Volvo S60/V60 uses optionally) so it may be next to impossible to find decent all season that work well in snow, ice.
Hence my suggestion to consider 16" for winter (they are listed by TR). They will be much cheaper than 19" tires with decent performance.

KrzyÅ›

 

[Quattro Pete]

Originally Posted by Treadstone
Originally Posted by Quattro Pete
Originally Posted by Treadstone
a dedicated set of winter tires that are absolutely dangerous the rest of the year.

Tell me more about it.

Nobody is advocating that you run winter tires all year long.



Most people around here put their snow tires on in November and take them off in April. All for maybe, maybe, one week of snow, unless they go into the mountains for skiing. So that means the REST of the time, they are driving on inferior tires when it is 50*F and raining.....

I've driven on winter tires when it's 50F and raining, and I wouldn't call them "absolutely dangerous." Far from it. These are conditions that just about any tire can handle without much fuss.

I would say braking and steering in snowy and icy conditions with all-season tires is more dangerous than driving on winter tires when it's 50F and raining.

Again, to me, getting winter tires is about being prepared to handle the worst possible conditions that you might encounter. 50F and raining ain't it.

 

[edyvw]

Originally Posted by Treadstone
Originally Posted by Quattro Pete
Originally Posted by Treadstone
a dedicated set of winter tires that are absolutely dangerous the rest of the year.

Tell me more about it.

Nobody is advocating that you run winter tires all year long.



Most people around here put their snow tires on in November and take them off in April. All for maybe, maybe, one week of snow, unless they go into the mountains for skiing. So that means the REST of the time, they are driving on inferior tires when it is 50*F and raining.....

And yet, with my vehicles and proper, good all season/all weather tires, we are good 12 months of the year, and have no issues going anywhere in the snow we do get....

Depends which winter tires.
I can tell you that Nokian R2 on my wife's Tiguan are absolutely misreable in rain.
Michelin Xi2 on Toyota will shame many all seasons in rain, and are better than Bridgestone Driveguard all seasons I got on SIenna in any temperature.
Of course, they would wear out fast, but just saying.

 

[edyvw]

Originally Posted by Wolf359
Originally Posted by edyvw
Originally Posted by AuthorEditor
Sure, winter tires are great, but you don't need them 90% of the time if you have good all-season tires and you are a normal driver. In the Northeast most of us do very little driving on snow-covered roads like that with no treatment. In New York the plows are out before the first snow starts treating the roads, and then they go 24/7 nonstop until the roads are clear again. "Winter" driving often means slippery conditions, but not pure snow. The road is likely to be a mix of bare pavement, thin snow, slush, water, and ice. With care I regularly commuted in that slop for decades in all sorts of vehicles with just all seasons. The first hint that the roads are getting bad is usually a 4WD truck or SUV in the ditch because they were going too fast.

What about 10% of the time?
I have both vehicles on winter tires, and trust me, Colorado is much better in winter than anything in the Northeast. But, tell me what happens when 2 year old runs 105 degrees temperature at 3am and outside is blizzard?
Most of the time when I actually needed winter tires to stop, it was hard braking on green light bcs someone who does not need winter tires 90% of the time could not stop on the red light.


Well you just stay home the other 10% of the time. If you need to travel in a blizzard and it's a medical emergency, you call an ambulance.

And then I have to pull out of snow drift ambulance. It is enough I have to take kid to emergency room, I do not want to be responsible for ambulance crew too.
You know that saying: if you wanna do it right, do it yourself. When it comes to fever and child, personal transport is most efficient. Now, injury would be different set of issues.
You just stay home 10% of time. WHat if I do not want to stay home? What if I decide to get coffee? Or go to lunch? Life does not stop bcs. of a snow or ice.

 

[Quattro Pete]

Originally Posted by edyvw
I can tell you that Nokian R2 on my wife's Tiguan are absolutely misreable in rain.
I continue to be puzzled by your experience with R2, as it does not resemble my experience with R2 on wife's Q5 at all.

 

[pandus13]

Originally Posted by Quattro Pete
Originally Posted by edyvw
I can tell you that Nokian R2 on my wife's Tiguan are absolutely misreable in rain.

I continue to be puzzled by your experience with R2, as it does not resemble my experience with R2 on wife's Q5 at all.

I remember they performed well in the last CO snowstorm.
Now, I think his where older stock?
My discontinued Nokian Entyre (early 2016 made) all-seasons, developed small tiny little cracks on sidewall just before the blocks area. I wander about our local area using liquid brine this winter....may more corrosive then salt?
My CS5 in my Yaris did that after 3+ years
Also, managed to slide lateral (at 20 mph) taking a right turn in rain.
But also had 6 hours of rain which turned into snow and performed well until snow hit 3+ inches...

 

[Treadstone]

Originally Posted by Quattro Pete
Originally Posted by Treadstone
Originally Posted by Quattro Pete
Originally Posted by Treadstone
a dedicated set of winter tires that are absolutely dangerous the rest of the year.

Tell me more about it.

Nobody is advocating that you run winter tires all year long.



Most people around here put their snow tires on in November and take them off in April. All for maybe, maybe, one week of snow, unless they go into the mountains for skiing. So that means the REST of the time, they are driving on inferior tires when it is 50*F and raining.....

I've driven on winter tires when it's 50F and raining, and I wouldn't call them "absolutely dangerous." Far from it. These are conditions that just about any tire can handle without much fuss.

I would say braking and steering in snowy and icy conditions with all-season tires is more dangerous than driving on winter tires when it's 50F and raining.

Again, to me, getting winter tires is about being prepared to handle the worst possible conditions that you might encounter. 50F and raining ain't it.



Well, it's your $$. But spending the $$ for snow tires for one week of snow a year? Foolish. Especially when good all season or all weather tires work just fine, which testing has proven. But, it's your $$. Might better use that money for AMSOIL or something.

 

[AuthorEditor]

Quote
You just stay home 10% of time.

Ha! I get your point, but I have never been stopped by all-season tires. Yes, there is some advantage in winter tires, but that doesn't mean you are stopped by not having them. There are many things you can purchase that would be great for very limited use periods and cases. For example, it might be really nice to have a full-on jacked up 4WD truck with winter tires just for those two horrible days when almost nobody can get out, and then suffer poor gas mileage, costly repairs, lack of comfort, etc. for the rest of the year. If I lived in the backwoods of Montana I might think differently. My point is just that for many of us winter tires are not worth the cost/benefit.

By the way, I hesitate to recommend a particular tire or brand because they change constantly and what works well in one application does not in another.