suggestion needed.. which one of 0w20?

[gogozy]

i want to add some 0w20 to my stash

living in Canada I have access to Honda Canada, Toyota, and M1 0w20 at similar price. which one of three is the better oil for my Acura in winter? I would have picked Honda in he past but seeing how well Toyota 0w20 on paper and uoa, (and other disappointment on Honda) and I have decide to leave that old thought out of this.
thanks

 

[cancov]

Isn't the Toyota API-SM? I thought I read that somewhere, not that there's anything wrong with that. 70% of my stash is SM.

 

[mauric3]

OP, i'm also wondering what would people here really recommended for 0w20.. Wonder how amsoil Signature series 0w20 will be when its being compared to honda idemitsu 0w20, toyota 0w20 and mobil1 afe 0w20.. .Looking for some good advice!

 

[Mustang_Cougar]

I was going to try Toyota 0w20 for my oil change, but the local dealer wants >$8/qt. After pricing w/the few other options readily available (Honda, Mazda, SynPower, M1), I'll be going w/AFE again...as it's only ~$6.50/qt.

Can't wait until this car is out of warranty and I can go to a cheaper, more readily available 5w20.

BTW: If you don't mind, what sort pricing are you getting in Canada for Toyo and Honda 0w20?

M_C

 

[gogozy]

thanks, I am able to get to $5/L plus tax on local Honda, and Toyota dealer .. thanks, wonder which is a better one!

 

[Mustang_Cougar]

Wow, that's a very good price; I'm always getting gouged by my local dealers.

 

[gogozy]

there had been some discussion about differences on SN and SM version of Toyota 0w20, the report on Honda is very few. Toyota seems to have very high VI, and very light for winter use. but then, Honda engine tend to be rev a little and I think, maybe this is one of the reason Honda 0w20 is a little heavier? my belief on Honda start to fade a while ago after some my own observations; but that is whole different subject. there are many great M1 0w20 reports. anyone know if Canadian Honda carry SM or SN version of 0w20?

I shall also add, my OCI is 8000km max, I probably will never push the OCI on my MDX beyond 5000km now especially seeing how J35 sludge up on another thread. It would also be a warning for me, I miss opportunity to take photo when i did last oil change on the MDX 2 month ago, the oil stick has varnish on it that i can not wipe off with cloth easily. The car is 30,000km, and that oci was about 7 month, 6000km, oil was Maxlife synthetic 5w30. I also change oil before 40% left on OLM. so, a thin 0w20 oil that with great cleaning and resisting sludge is probably my top choice. thanks.

 

[gogozy]

Originally Posted By: Mustang_Cougar
Wow, that's a very good price; I'm always getting gouged by my local dealers.

don't feel too bad, must Honda dealer charge $10/L, luckily I found one that would sell me with that great price in bulk. however, any other accessory in Canada is about twice as expensive. I personally do no blame dealer here as i suspect the Honda Canada is the one that set the price very high.

 

[CATERHAM]

Hi gogozy,

Since you're in Canada as you've discovered the choice is very simply; it's Toyota 0W-20 unless you're routinely starting your vehicle unaided at temp's below -20C then M1 0W-20 has an advantage.

There's also nothing wrong with the Idemitsu made Honda/Acura 0W-20 with it's 197 VI and high moly level, but it is an heavier oil especially on start-up. I've track tested this oil and it is very shear stable. But on balance I do prefer the Toyota oil for it's higher VI.

 

[CATERHAM]

Originally Posted By: gogozy
Originally Posted By: Mustang_Cougar
Wow, that's a very good price; I'm always getting gouged by my local dealers.

don't feel too bad, must Honda dealer charge $10/L, luckily I found one that would sell me with that great price in bulk. however, any other accessory in Canada is about twice as expensive. I personally do no blame dealer here as i suspect the Honda Canada is the one that set the price very high.

Yes I would blame the dealer as the retail price is something like $7.80/L and discounted at least 15% on a 12L case. That's from Newfoundland to BC.

Another source for the Idemitsu made GF-4 0W-20 is Mitsubishi but the price I got from a Mississauga dealer was high at 9/L.

 

[gogozy]

Originally Posted By: CATERHAM
Hi gogozy,

Since you're in Canada as you've discovered the choice is very simply; it's Toyota 0W-20 unless you're routinely starting your vehicle unaided at temp's below -20C then M1 0W-20 has an advantage.

There's also nothing wrong with the Idemitsu made Honda/Acura 0W-20 with it's 197 VI and high moly level, but it is an heavier oil especially on start-up. I've track tested this oil and it is very shear stable. But on balance I do prefer the Toyota oil for it's higher VI.

Hi Caterham:
thanks, I had read many of your post. and I still confused why M1 has advantages to Toyota when the Toyota's 40C Kmatic is so light? or I need to calculate it with the VI? Toyota dealer is much closer to me, but a few buck more per case. is Canadian Honda dealer getting SN 0w20 or still SM? I thought SN has better deposit control?

 

[dailydriver]

Originally Posted By: CATERHAM
There's also nothing wrong with the Idemitsu made Honda/Acura 0W-20 with it's 197 VI and high moly level, but it is an heavier oil especially on start-up. I've track tested this oil and it is very shear stable. But on balance I do prefer the Toyota oil for it's higher VI.


Is this still the same as the Scoobie labelled, Idemitsu-made, SM rated, 0W-20 (I thought that this was a 200 VI?)??

I can get this at the local Scoob dealer for $6.50/qt. U.S., whereas the Toy stuff is the de-additivized SN stuff for $7.95/qt. U.S..

If I do not need (or more importantly WANT) something that is going to shear down to a 10W within 1500 miles, should I save the coin, get more moly, and get the Idemitsu product???
Or do you value the ~17 or so VI points over EVERYTHING ELSE?!!

 

[CATERHAM]

Hi dailydriver,

Unfortunately the Idemitsu made Subaru 0W-20 is now the the 169 VI GF-5 version of this oil unless you can still get the GF-4 version.
AFAIK, in the States the Mazda and Mitsubishi 0W-20's which are made by Idemitsu are still using the preferred GF-4 oil.

I wouldn't call the SN GF-5 version of the Toyota 0W-20 "de-addivized". It's AW package is still better than M1 0W-20 and they may be using a more advanced form of moly that allows a lower concentration. There are a couple of members like Patman that prefer the SN version.

The Toyota oil won't shear down to a 10wt oil (maybe a 15wt but then how many OTC 20wt oils won't). Having said that, if you want a heavier at operating temp's 0W-20 oil, just add a small amount of something heavier. For example, just 8% of M1 0W-40 will give you a virgin HTHSV 2.7cP 0W-20 with a VI that's only marginally affected.

 

[mauric3]

Caterham..who manufactures the toyota 0w20?

So Toyota 0w20 is way better than honda idemitsu 0w20.. Thanks for the info!

Would anyone know the part number of the toyota 0w20 and its a fully synthetic right?

 

[CATERHAM]

Originally Posted By: gogozy
Originally Posted By: CATERHAM
Hi gogozy,
Since you're in Canada as you've discovered the choice is very simply; it's Toyota 0W-20 unless you're routinely starting your vehicle unaided at temp's below -20C then M1 0W-20 has an advantage.

There's also nothing wrong with the Idemitsu made Honda/Acura 0W-20 with it's 197 VI and high moly level, but it is an heavier oil especially on start-up. I've track tested this oil and it is very shear stable. But on balance I do prefer the Toyota oil for it's higher VI.

Hi Caterham:
thanks, I had read many of your post. and I still confused why M1 has advantages to Toyota when the Toyota's 40C Kmatic is so light? or I need to calculate it with the VI? Toyota dealer is much closer to me, but a few buck more per case. is Canadian Honda dealer getting SN 0w20 or still SM? I thought SN has better deposit control?

Yes Toyota is lighter than M1 0W-20 down to -15C or so but at extreme cold temp's M1 has an advantage due to it's lower 9,200cP MRV vs 18,000cP for the original Nippon Oil made Toyota 0W-20. I can only assume the spec' is similar for the XOM version of this oil but who knows.

 

[CATERHAM]

Originally Posted By: mauric3
Caterham..who manufactures the toyota 0w20?

So Toyota 0w20 is way better than honda idemitsu 0w20.. Thanks for the info!

Would anyone know the part number of the toyota 0w20 and its a fully synthetic right?

I never said the Toyota 0W-20 is way better to the GF-4 Idemitsu oil, I said I prefer it for the reasons I mentioned.
And yes both the Toyota and Idemitsu oils are fully synthetic using predominately GP III base oils.

 

[gogozy]

Caterham, again, thanks very much for shedding light and share your experiences here. I did not read any of Toyota or Honda Mrv info in the past, perhaps i missed them. In your opinion, which fluid (toyota or Honda)is more shear and sludge resistant within 6000km intervals? thanks!

I will try get both next weekend and hope the price stay so at dealers when I pick them up!.. I end up paying 15% more when my favorite Honda dealer raise the price on many fluids last Oct.

 

[dailydriver]

Originally Posted By: CATERHAM
Hi dailydriver,

Unfortunately the Idemitsu made Subaru 0W-20 is now the the 169 VI GF-5 version of this oil unless you can still get the GF-4 version.
AFAIK, in the States the Mazda and Mitsubishi 0W-20's which are made by Idemitsu are still using the preferred GF-4 oil.


As far as you know, did Idemitsu ever make the Scoobie 0W-20 SM rated, in the GF-5 version, or is it ONLY the SN rated stuff which is GF-5???

The bottles I bought were DEFINITELY SM labelled, but I did not look at the GF rating.

I will have to dig the empties out of the recycling bin and have a look.

But in any case, given the better GF-4 rated Idemitsu product, do you still really think that the Toy labelled stuff (even the SN) is worth the price difference for the ~17 point higher VI (given also that the Idemitsu product WILL NOT shear down as much)??

 

[CATERHAM]

6,000 kms OCI would be not be a test for either oil and you should be able to go much longer.
Even most if not all 5W-20 dino's can go at least that long and maintain a clean engine.
Keep in mind that the recommended OCI for the Toyota 0W-20 in the States is 16,000 kms (10,000 miles).

 

[mongo161]

There is also another synthetic option for 0w-20, at a lower price, if you only run the oil for 6K.

NAPA auto has a 0w-20, full synthetic, made by Ashland.