SN Rating vs Ford Spec
- Thread starter md76
- Start date
If it;s an older API license it can, new licenses require dual rated CK-4 oils to comply with the resource conserving limits.
I’d replace that with a picture which has your personal information eliminated.
The rules allow them to at least on the 40 weight oils. Valvoline (White Bottle), Fram, Travellers, etc. There are several oils that meet both SN & Ford F1 Specification.
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OVERKILL
$100 Site Donor 2021
xW-40's and xW-50's don't have the reduced phosphorous limit for SM/SN/SN+/SP, it only applies to the RC grades.
Only when they only cary an S-rating , if they are dual rated they must comply with the resource conserving limits.
Thank you!
OVERKILL
$100 Site Donor 2021
The statement made on the CK-4 spec sheet with respect to the caveat for phosphorous is:
(26) Phosphorous must be less than 0.08m% to obtain API S claims for ILSAC grades.
xW-40 grades aren't ILSAC, which are 0W-20, 0W-30, 5W-20, 5W-30 and 10W-30.
Under (9) however, there is also:
For all viscosity grades:
- If API CH-4, CI-4 and/or CJ-4 categories precede the "S" category and there is no API Certification Mark, the "S" category limits for phosphorus, sulfur, and the TEOST MHT do not apply.
- However, the CJ-4 limits for phosphorus and sulfur do apply for CJ-4 oils, and the limit in the SP-RC column for phosphorous (0.08% mass max) applies when CK-4 with SP or FA-4 with SP is claimed.
So it looks like this might change with SP, though that's a bit muddied by the "SP-RC" indication, as you wouldn't expect most of these to want to claim SP-RC, just SP, which brings us back to (26).
But based on both of these footnotes, you can claim SN (non-RC) and CK-4 on an xW-40. It doesn't sound like you can claim SP though.
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OVERKILL
$100 Site Donor 2021
See edit, I addressed that.
This is consistent with oils on the market like Mobil 1 TDT 5W-40, which has both SN and CK-4, but has 1,100ppm phosphorous.
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Probably because it's a low volume product and they haven't bothered to update the spec sheet, Mobil no longer claims dual ratings on it's HDEO with over 800ppm of phosphorous, they along with Shell and Chevron, when they transitioned to CK-4 either dropped to 800ppm or stopped claiming dual ratings if the oil is over 800ppm, seems like anything claiming dual ratings with over 800ppm was licensed prior to 2019 or so. Although Delo 400 XSP 15W40 which only recently launched is kind of an outlier, although they may attempt to establish a new standard on dual ratings and then just reneged on it and are now going back to the bad practice of dual rating oils with too much phosphorous so long as they don't claim SP.
OVERKILL
$100 Site Donor 2021
The Mobil product guide was last updated in 2022, it shows the 1,100PPM of phosphorous for TDT. PDS seems to indicate October, 2020. I'd speculate that this is because this product is part of the Mobil 1 portfolio, which you find at parts stores, Walmart and the like, so it has a consumer presence that makes having the API SN designation worthwhile.
Mobil (Delvac) HDEO's that DO have dual ratings:
- Delvac 1 ESP 5W-40: SN/CK-4
- Delvac 1 ESP 0W-40: SN/CK-4
- Delvac 1 AS 5W-30: SN/CK-4
- Delvac 1 AFE 5W-30: SN/FA-4
- Delvac Extreme: 15W-40: SM/CK-4
- Delvac 1300 Super 10W-30: SP/CK-4
- Delvac 1300 Super 15W-40: SP/CK-4
- Delvac Super FE 10W-30: SN/FA-4
- Delvac MX F2: SL/CI-4 Plus (wow, old specs!)
Mobil (Delvac) HDEO's that DO NOT have dual ratings:
- Delvac Extreme 10W-30: CK-4
- Delvac Extreme FE 10W-30: FA-4
- Delvac HDEO 10W-30: CK-4
- Delvac HDEO 15W-40: CK-4
I think the limits, which I believe we've now established do not apply to xW-40's that claim SN and CK-4, are a separate discussion from why we have seen a lot of the HDEO's dropping the dual rating.
SP appears to be a different situation. I find some of the language a bit vague on how it applies.
This VOA of Delvac 1 ESP 5W-40 is from 2018 product, so probably SN/CK-4, and shows ~1,200ppm phosphorous:
OAI VOA Mobil Delvac 1 ESP 5w40
I've been running this in 2 unleaded vehicles. It's dual(spark & compression)rated. OAI flags oxidation when it rises 10%. Product Description link
bobistheoilguy.com
However, this blackstone report, which is from 2019 and SN/CK-4, shows ~1,000ppm phosphorous:
Mobil Delvac ESP 5W-40 CK4 (synthetic) VOA
Virgin Oil Analysis just recently completed, CK4 formula purchased a couple months ago. Figured I'd share, an updated VOA from one I saw while lurking last year. On paper, looks decent enough but in the flesh, it's really a nice oil. Actually smells kind of sweet, like candy, and it hushes up...
bobistheoilguy.com
4WD
$50 site donor 2024
I have a buddy who does lots of business at the local Ford dealership - he brings in D1 5W40 ESP …
The SM barks while the techs laugh and pour - and they give him a good trade in …
Mobil lists the MX F2 as a current product, but good luck finding any. It's like trying to find hen's teeth, or frog's hair, or an honest politician.
Rural King used to sell it but clearanced it out like 2 years ago
Maybe your store did this; not mine. My Rural Kings both have pallets of this oil on floor in oil isle. Even store I visited in Ohio this weekend had tons of it.
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