Kia Sedona Sludge

[jcartwright99]

Originally Posted by 02SE
Originally Posted by jcartwright99
There are a few cars that I would never buy used unless they had the maintenance records. Kia, lower end Nissan, and lower end FCA products. Why you ask? These manufactures usually pray on subprime buyers and have the lowest priced cars available. In my experience, these subprime buyers tend to not do the recommended maintenance. They can just afford the car payments and gas. This is what you get. Sure, I know not every subprime buyer neglects their car but why risk it?


People of all socioeconomic classes neglect cars.

That was the case when I was working on consumer cars, and according to friends and former colleagues who still work on consumer cars, that is still true.


Oh, I am sure. However, if it becomes eat or get my oil changed. I am going to say that eating wins 99.9% of the time.

 

[writes123]

Thanks for all the responses and suggestions! The mechanic cleaned what he could from both valve covers and used brake cleaner as well. The valve covers were cleabed by engine degreaser, brake cleaner and a strong pressure washer before being allowed to dry prior to reinstall.

The mechanic didn't note any contamination so the offcolor photo may have been due to lighting. A thick layer of crud had to be debrided from the valve covers.

I did note that the oil change after the flush was a tad watery and feel it may have been to the cleaner used for the cleaning. The second flush had some less discoloration but I reckon the initial layer might be dealt with.

I've been debating on wether to add seafoam or MMO to a cheaper oil and filter and run it for a few hundred miles before using a flush like lubegard prior to another drain and refill. The idea of solvents doesn't bring the most confidence however i wonder with an extremely short oci of less than 1k miles if its worthwhile. I think lower oil viscosity and lubrication is the main concern when dealing with those products.

At 10 per filter and 20 per oil refill and 10 per flush product, it's 40 for materials per change.

I know for minivans the toyota sienna is bulletproof but the premium on the used marketplace for them is a tad much. The sedona has a higher depreciation and has had average to near top reliability per consumer reports. Only Honda, Toyota, Kia, Dodge and Chrysler make minivans currently.

The main fault was the selection of this neglected Kia. I've put in 400 for labor and maybe 300 in parts to bring the gaskets, coolant, atf, spark plugs, ac refrigerant up to par.

The car itself was a little over 9k before taxes and dmv so it was a solid deal before investing in a needed tuneup. I've driven the car maybe 300 miles with no issues or warning lights. My mpg was averaging around 21. No indication of engine sludge except when i took out the filter.

The mechanic only suggested two motor flushed due to the amount of sludge. He is a trustworthy guy and encouraged me to do them myself. The rear plugs and valve cover are quite a chore and i am glad that i had someone else handle it.

So i suppose my question is how short of an oci do you guys recommend? Any MMO or other products besides a flush from Lubegard or Liqui Moly prior to an oil change? I read some on the forum using 1-1.5 oz of engine flush per quart of oil and changing it after 100 miles. A cheaper filter is ok with the shortened oci? Also cheaper oil like Supertech? High mileage or regular? Conventional or synthetic? Slight concern about hdeo is the talk of issues with cat converters. I think they hold paeticulate better but with a short oci is that worth it? Oil changes are extremely simple thankfully. Done in less than 10 mins.

Thanks again!

 

[nthach]

Originally Posted by writes123
Also cheaper oil like Supertech? High mileage or regular? Conventional or synthetic? Slight concern about hdeo is the talk of issues with cat converters. I think they hold paeticulate better but with a short oci is that worth it? Oil changes are extremely simple thankfully. Done in less than 10 mins.

Thanks again!

Once you nip the sludge in the bud, stick to any good synthetic oil with the Dexos1, Generation 2 approval. Supertech and the major brands in synthetic are D1G2 approved. It's an oil standard authored by GM that builds on top of ILSAC GF-6 and API SN/SN Plus. It would be good for your engine with direct injection.

 

[writes123]

Originally Posted by nthach
Originally Posted by writes123
Also cheaper oil like Supertech? High mileage or regular? Conventional or synthetic? Slight concern about hdeo is the talk of issues with cat converters. I think they hold paeticulate better but with a short oci is that worth it? Oil changes are extremely simple thankfully. Done in less than 10 mins.

Thanks again!

Once you nip the sludge in the bud, stick to any good synthetic oil with the Dexos1, Generation 2 approval. Supertech and the major brands in synthetic are D1G2 approved. It's an oil standard authored by GM that builds on top of ILSAC GF-6 and API SN/SN Plus. It would be good for your engine with direct injection.


Thanks! I've been thinking about Quaker State full syn before encountering the sludge issue. PUP 10w30 has great noack but is maybe 8 more per 5 quarts.

Incidentally severe oci per Kia is 3750 and regular is 7500. I'll be sticking with the severe schedule. southern california traffic and all.

 

[Urshurak776]

Use the Supertech Full Synthetic HM stuff @ manuals severe OCI. Do it for 3-4 cycles, then pop the engine cover off and see how she looks.

 

[Supersonic]

I would suggest that you could look at the dipstick to determine an oil change interval, as soon as it starts looking dirty again, change it. It might be 100 miles, might be 1000 miles.

 

[clinebarger]

Have you priced out a good/low mileage used engine? Let's be real here.....That neglect didn't do the Timing Chains & VVT system any favors.

Some engines are really cheap......Supply & Demand drives the prices! I recently bought a 2013 Nissan Altima 2.5L engine that had 40,000 on it for $375., The wrecking yards are caulk full of them! Demand is low & Supply is high!
Now take a Ford 3V 5.4L.....Demand is sky high & the price reflects that.

 

[supton]

Originally Posted by writes123
At 10 per filter and 20 per oil refill and 10 per flush product, it's 40 for materials per change.

I wonder if the cheapest oil filters you can find would work good here--oil is getting short changed thus no need for long life.

Have you shopped online for filters? I buy OEM Toyota filters in a box of ten for $40. I wonder if you could find a similar deal and drive the price down.

I'm not sure how long I'd leave the oil in... They say oil color is not an indicator of anything, but I dare say, in this case it would mean something! Maybe a couple of changes after some insanely short level, as that light brown sludge I think would clean up pretty fast. Maybe a couple of changes after 500 miles? How hard is it to pull that front valve cover so as to monitor progress?

I have to wonder if, instead of letting the oil stay in for weeks at a time, if letting it idle to get up to temp would be good--if your daily driving habits is more stop and go that is. Get the oil warm, like a long highway drive, so as to help it do its job. Not saying this needs to be done for the next few years, just for the next few oil changes--make sure the engine is "always" getting up to temp.

 

[mattd]

Honesty if I had a vehicle that the engine was like that I wouldn't even waste my time I'd look for a used engine in much better condition, especially if I planned on keeping it. As Cline mentioned even if you get it clean, you are bound to have timing problems due to VVT and or chain issues because of the lack of maintenance.

 

[1978elcamino]

Who wants to see him cut open the filter????????????????????????????

 

[nthach]

Originally Posted by writes123


Incidentally severe oci per Kia is 3750 and regular is 7500. I'll be sticking with the severe schedule. southern california traffic and all.

With synthetics, even off the shelf Group III "synthetics" from the store 3750 miles isn't much. 5K seems to be a good compromise and it's what I stick to even with NorCal traffic.

 

[Silverado12]

Just run it. If it blows up it blows up. Then get a junkyard engine.

 

[SatinSilver]

Originally Posted by Silverado12
Just run it. If it blows up it blows up. Then get a junkyard engine.


+1, exactly. Plus an engine for this van prob isn't too cheap esp with labor. All those Altima engines are prob available for cheap because the cvt trans croaked.

 

[writes123]

I'm leaning towards doing shorter OCI's with MMO and conventional ST HM 10W-40. Since MMO is being added, I think a slightly higher viscosity oil might be prudent though outside of US, the same engine calls for 30w or 40w oil. Oil capacity is just around 6.1 quarts, so MMO 1 quart and the rest with oil paired with a new filter. Planning on monitoring the oil color and condition every 100 miles or so with a maximum of 1k miles. Before the next oil change, thinking of either a Berryman Oil change flush which is solvent free (6 USD) or Liqui Moly Engine flush for 12 USD.

 

[SatinSilver]

Originally Posted by writes123
I'm leaning towards doing shorter OCI's with MMO and conventional ST HM 10W-40. Since MMO is being added, I think a slightly higher viscosity oil might be prudent though outside of US, the same engine calls for 30w or 40w oil. Oil capacity is just around 6.1 quarts, so MMO 1 quart and the rest with oil paired with a new filter. Planning on monitoring the oil color and condition every 100 miles or so with a maximum of 1k miles. Before the next oil change, thinking of either a Berryman Oil change flush which is solvent free (6 USD) or Liqui Moly Engine flush for 12 USD.


Sounds like a good plan. Prob go with the Berryman flush. After that you could prob go to 4k oil changes if you wish. Esp with some ST synthetic.

 

[Reggaemon]

Yeah , it looks bad but I don't see any wear on the cam lobes. 5000 mile oil changes and it will last another 100,000 miles.

 

[tiger862]

5k Synthetic oil change is what I would do. Run until it quits.

 

[Mad_Hatter]

Get that engine cleaned up as best you can before you have a warranty issue or you could very well find yourself on the bad side of a claim.

-Deee Nied-

 

[Reggaemon]

Warranty on a 100,000 mile Kia? I don't think so.

 

[Mad_Hatter]

Originally Posted by Reggaemon
Warranty on a 100,000 mile Kia? I don't think so.

I didn't notice that..oops. in that case, motor medic the crape out of that engine.. just be prepared, you could spring a leak. Odds are sludge is plugging a leak or two.