Snake oil or not, they're doing something right....as evidenced by the shiny new $50M dragstrip built across the road from the Charlotte motor speedway.
(500th post!)
(500th post!)
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Is Z-Max worth a [censored]?
- Thread starter Shooff82
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new video loaded
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j0cv6sfTYU0
the bad news is i made a video before this one with 1K miles of use with zmax and when transferring to PC to load i accidentally deleted it and it was full of sludge like the bottom of this one had. I had stored this filter for a few weeks before i was able to cut it open and the sludge had settled to the bottom and surprised me when i moved my hand.
I dont plan on adding zmax on this OCI and will post that filter when i change it.
based on what i have seen first hand zmax does dissolve sludge. dont know if it actually lubricates any better than regular oil but i know it will dissolve sludge.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j0cv6sfTYU0
the bad news is i made a video before this one with 1K miles of use with zmax and when transferring to PC to load i accidentally deleted it and it was full of sludge like the bottom of this one had. I had stored this filter for a few weeks before i was able to cut it open and the sludge had settled to the bottom and surprised me when i moved my hand.
I dont plan on adding zmax on this OCI and will post that filter when i change it.
based on what i have seen first hand zmax does dissolve sludge. dont know if it actually lubricates any better than regular oil but i know it will dissolve sludge.
Originally Posted By: Arctic388
new video loaded
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j0cv6sfTYU0
the bad news is i made a video before this one with 1K miles of use with zmax and when transferring to PC to load i accidentally deleted it and it was full of sludge like the bottom of this one had. I had stored this filter for a few weeks before i was able to cut it open and the sludge had settled to the bottom and surprised me when i moved my hand.
I dont plan on adding zmax on this OCI and will post that filter when i change it.
based on what i have seen first hand zmax does dissolve sludge. dont know if it actually lubricates any better than regular oil but i know it will dissolve sludge.
Thats some nasty stuff in there. I wonder how the inside of the engine looks?
new video loaded
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j0cv6sfTYU0
the bad news is i made a video before this one with 1K miles of use with zmax and when transferring to PC to load i accidentally deleted it and it was full of sludge like the bottom of this one had. I had stored this filter for a few weeks before i was able to cut it open and the sludge had settled to the bottom and surprised me when i moved my hand.
I dont plan on adding zmax on this OCI and will post that filter when i change it.
based on what i have seen first hand zmax does dissolve sludge. dont know if it actually lubricates any better than regular oil but i know it will dissolve sludge.
Thats some nasty stuff in there. I wonder how the inside of the engine looks?
I wonder what it looks like also but just couldn't bring myself to removing the valve covers cause it does not leak and if i did open it i would end up doing a complete tear down to manually clean it all which would lead to a 383 stroker kit and i want a new body style Tahoe before i start modding the engine.
i'm just going to keep on experimenting with it and see what happens
i'm just going to keep on experimenting with it and see what happens
It's been about a month, any new info/results?
So from all the zmax threads and YouTube vids posted I'm convinced zmax is great for cleaning sludge.
Other than that I don't believe it's a friction modifier nor anti-wear agent and therefore not an asset in anything that has had decent maintenance.
Other than that I don't believe it's a friction modifier nor anti-wear agent and therefore not an asset in anything that has had decent maintenance.
Originally Posted By: websterdan
It's been about a month, any new info/results?
weather permitting i plan to possibly change oil this weekend. i have ordered some microguard filters and eager to put them on so i can cut them open. I didnt use z-max this OCI. i want to see what the first microguard looks like then might use it again on the second microguard i have to try and prove it really does help in removing the build up.
It's been about a month, any new info/results?
weather permitting i plan to possibly change oil this weekend. i have ordered some microguard filters and eager to put them on so i can cut them open. I didnt use z-max this OCI. i want to see what the first microguard looks like then might use it again on the second microguard i have to try and prove it really does help in removing the build up.
Originally Posted By: Clevy
So from all the zmax threads and YouTube vids posted I'm convinced zmax is great for cleaning sludge.
Other than that I don't believe it's a friction modifier nor anti-wear agent and therefore not an asset in anything that has had decent maintenance.
There is a guy on the diesel forums that is adamant zmax in the oil improves his MPGs. Whether that would be from just cleaning or improved friction reduction, I do not know.
So from all the zmax threads and YouTube vids posted I'm convinced zmax is great for cleaning sludge.
Other than that I don't believe it's a friction modifier nor anti-wear agent and therefore not an asset in anything that has had decent maintenance.
There is a guy on the diesel forums that is adamant zmax in the oil improves his MPGs. Whether that would be from just cleaning or improved friction reduction, I do not know.
The problem here though is that you don't know if there is or was "sludge" in your engine to start with. Nor do you know if the stuff are finding in the filter is something that is being removed or cleaned from the engine. All you are seeing is something in the filer but you have to agree you really don't know where it is coming from.
It could be "stuff" from the engine that is being cleaned out. But it could also be a coolant leak that is gelling the oil. It could be the zMAX itself causing the deposits. I'm not saying it is, so don't get me wrong. But you don't know, do you?
Originally Posted By: Arctic388
I wonder what it looks like also but just couldn't bring myself to removing the valve covers cause it does not leak and if i did open it i would end up doing a complete tear down to manually clean it all which would lead to a 383 stroker kit and i want a new body style Tahoe before i start modding the engine.
i'm just going to keep on experimenting with it and see what happens
It could be "stuff" from the engine that is being cleaned out. But it could also be a coolant leak that is gelling the oil. It could be the zMAX itself causing the deposits. I'm not saying it is, so don't get me wrong. But you don't know, do you?
Originally Posted By: Arctic388
I wonder what it looks like also but just couldn't bring myself to removing the valve covers cause it does not leak and if i did open it i would end up doing a complete tear down to manually clean it all which would lead to a 383 stroker kit and i want a new body style Tahoe before i start modding the engine.
i'm just going to keep on experimenting with it and see what happens
Originally Posted By: kschachn
The problem here though is that you don't know if there is or was "sludge" in your engine to start with. Nor do you know if the stuff are finding in the filter is something that is being removed or cleaned from the engine. All you are seeing is something in the filer but you have to agree you really don't know where it is coming from.
It could be "stuff" from the engine that is being cleaned out. But it could also be a coolant leak that is gelling the oil. It could be the zMAX itself causing the deposits. I'm not saying it is, so don't get me wrong. But you don't know, do you?
Originally Posted By: Arctic388
I wonder what it looks like also but just couldn't bring myself to removing the valve covers cause it does not leak and if i did open it i would end up doing a complete tear down to manually clean it all which would lead to a 383 stroker kit and i want a new body style Tahoe before i start modding the engine.
i'm just going to keep on experimenting with it and see what happens
to be honest with you i really think a magical fairy comes each night and sprinkles carbon flakes in my oil fill hole just to give me a surprise when i cut open my filter.
The problem here though is that you don't know if there is or was "sludge" in your engine to start with. Nor do you know if the stuff are finding in the filter is something that is being removed or cleaned from the engine. All you are seeing is something in the filer but you have to agree you really don't know where it is coming from.
It could be "stuff" from the engine that is being cleaned out. But it could also be a coolant leak that is gelling the oil. It could be the zMAX itself causing the deposits. I'm not saying it is, so don't get me wrong. But you don't know, do you?
Originally Posted By: Arctic388
I wonder what it looks like also but just couldn't bring myself to removing the valve covers cause it does not leak and if i did open it i would end up doing a complete tear down to manually clean it all which would lead to a 383 stroker kit and i want a new body style Tahoe before i start modding the engine.
i'm just going to keep on experimenting with it and see what happens
to be honest with you i really think a magical fairy comes each night and sprinkles carbon flakes in my oil fill hole just to give me a surprise when i cut open my filter.
Why do additive threads get defensive and spiral into nonsense posts? I don't think my question was out of line nor do I think it was trivial. If you believe in something, stand up for it, address comments and concerns that others have, and above all be open to constructive criticism. Coming back to a legitimate question with a nonsensical answer isn't helping your cause nor is it helping anything.
Bottom line is you don't know because you haven't looked. Even you yourself said you wanted to look yet you haven't.
Originally Posted By: Arctic388
Originally Posted By: kschachn
The problem here though is that you don't know if there is or was "sludge" in your engine to start with. Nor do you know if the stuff are finding in the filter is something that is being removed or cleaned from the engine. All you are seeing is something in the filer but you have to agree you really don't know where it is coming from.
It could be "stuff" from the engine that is being cleaned out. But it could also be a coolant leak that is gelling the oil. It could be the zMAX itself causing the deposits. I'm not saying it is, so don't get me wrong. But you don't know, do you?
Originally Posted By: Arctic388
I wonder what it looks like also but just couldn't bring myself to removing the valve covers cause it does not leak and if i did open it i would end up doing a complete tear down to manually clean it all which would lead to a 383 stroker kit and i want a new body style Tahoe before i start modding the engine.
i'm just going to keep on experimenting with it and see what happens
to be honest with you i really think a magical fairy comes each night and sprinkles carbon flakes in my oil fill hole just to give me a surprise when i cut open my filter.
Bottom line is you don't know because you haven't looked. Even you yourself said you wanted to look yet you haven't.
Originally Posted By: Arctic388
Originally Posted By: kschachn
The problem here though is that you don't know if there is or was "sludge" in your engine to start with. Nor do you know if the stuff are finding in the filter is something that is being removed or cleaned from the engine. All you are seeing is something in the filer but you have to agree you really don't know where it is coming from.
It could be "stuff" from the engine that is being cleaned out. But it could also be a coolant leak that is gelling the oil. It could be the zMAX itself causing the deposits. I'm not saying it is, so don't get me wrong. But you don't know, do you?
Originally Posted By: Arctic388
I wonder what it looks like also but just couldn't bring myself to removing the valve covers cause it does not leak and if i did open it i would end up doing a complete tear down to manually clean it all which would lead to a 383 stroker kit and i want a new body style Tahoe before i start modding the engine.
i'm just going to keep on experimenting with it and see what happens
to be honest with you i really think a magical fairy comes each night and sprinkles carbon flakes in my oil fill hole just to give me a surprise when i cut open my filter.
MolaKule
Staff member
Quote:
The unique ability of zMAX to soak into metal and reduce engine deposits results in...:
zMAX does not replace your regular oil, and using zMAX will not overfill your normal oil level because it soaks into metal...
Soooo, all 12 oz. will soak into the metal? And once mixed with the oil's molecules, how does this stuff come out of the oil and find it's way into the metal?
If anyone out there can explain a physio-chemical process why this should be true then I will reconsider my past comments.
The unique ability of zMAX to soak into metal and reduce engine deposits results in...:
zMAX does not replace your regular oil, and using zMAX will not overfill your normal oil level because it soaks into metal...
Soooo, all 12 oz. will soak into the metal? And once mixed with the oil's molecules, how does this stuff come out of the oil and find it's way into the metal?
If anyone out there can explain a physio-chemical process why this should be true then I will reconsider my past comments.
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If you are expecting the OP to comment, I think he has left the building.
Originally Posted By: MolaKule
Quote:
The unique ability of zMAX to soak into metal and reduce engine deposits results in...:
zMAX does not replace your regular oil, and using zMAX will not overfill your normal oil level because it soaks into metal...
Soooo, all 12 oz. will soak into the metal? And once mixed with the oil's molecules, how does this stuff come out of the oil and find it's way into the metal?
If anyone out there can explain a physio-chemical process why this should be true then I will reconsider my past comments.
Originally Posted By: MolaKule
Quote:
The unique ability of zMAX to soak into metal and reduce engine deposits results in...:
zMAX does not replace your regular oil, and using zMAX will not overfill your normal oil level because it soaks into metal...
Soooo, all 12 oz. will soak into the metal? And once mixed with the oil's molecules, how does this stuff come out of the oil and find it's way into the metal?
If anyone out there can explain a physio-chemical process why this should be true then I will reconsider my past comments.
The "soaking in" claim has always made me laugh. ALL oil "soaks" into the metal "pores" because the oil molecules are so much smaller than the surface asperities.
Oil molecules are around 25 angstroms.
https://classesv2.yale.edu/wiki/site/chem124_f08/franklin%27s_experiment.html
http://www.newton.dep.anl.gov/askasci/gen01/gen01973.htm
Grinding typically will show a best finish of .1 micrometers (1000 angstroms).
http://www.engineershandbook.com/Tables/surfaceroughness.htm
And that level of finishing may not actually be achieved on automotive components. (Anyone know?)
So a typical oil molecule is 40 times smaller than the surface roughness of a precision ground metal surface.
Oil molecules are around 25 angstroms.
https://classesv2.yale.edu/wiki/site/chem124_f08/franklin%27s_experiment.html
http://www.newton.dep.anl.gov/askasci/gen01/gen01973.htm
Grinding typically will show a best finish of .1 micrometers (1000 angstroms).
http://www.engineershandbook.com/Tables/surfaceroughness.htm
And that level of finishing may not actually be achieved on automotive components. (Anyone know?)
So a typical oil molecule is 40 times smaller than the surface roughness of a precision ground metal surface.
MolaKule
Staff member
Here is the dimensional analysis I did to answer the "soak into metal" question.
Oil Molecules and Iron Interstitial Structure
And we must remember that "soaking-into metals," porosity, surface finish, and asperity valleys, are four entirely different topics in materials science.
Oil Molecules and Iron Interstitial Structure
And we must remember that "soaking-into metals," porosity, surface finish, and asperity valleys, are four entirely different topics in materials science.
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Originally Posted By: MolaKule
And we must remember that "soaking-into metals," porosity, surface finish, and asperity valleys, are four entirely different topics in materials science.
No doubt Mola, just trying to bring some sense of scale to this discussion. I'm sure you guys with them there fancy chemistry and physics degrees on the wall know more about such things than I.
Though I'm not sure that surface finish and asperity size are unrelated.
And we must remember that "soaking-into metals," porosity, surface finish, and asperity valleys, are four entirely different topics in materials science.
No doubt Mola, just trying to bring some sense of scale to this discussion. I'm sure you guys with them there fancy chemistry and physics degrees on the wall know more about such things than I.
Though I'm not sure that surface finish and asperity size are unrelated.
MolaKule
Staff member
Originally Posted By: Tempest
Originally Posted By: MolaKule
And we must remember that "soaking-into metals," porosity, surface finish, and asperity valleys, are four entirely different topics in materials science.
No doubt Mola, just trying to bring some sense of scale to this discussion. I'm sure you guys with them there fancy chemistry and physics degrees on the wall know more about such things than I.
Though I'm not sure that surface finish and asperity size are unrelated.
They are related in the sense that surface finish determines asperity geometries.
What I was trying to convey is that in terms of oil molecules and material science there are different scales of geometry. I think maybe we are saying the same thing.
Originally Posted By: MolaKule
And we must remember that "soaking-into metals," porosity, surface finish, and asperity valleys, are four entirely different topics in materials science.
No doubt Mola, just trying to bring some sense of scale to this discussion. I'm sure you guys with them there fancy chemistry and physics degrees on the wall know more about such things than I.
Though I'm not sure that surface finish and asperity size are unrelated.
They are related in the sense that surface finish determines asperity geometries.
What I was trying to convey is that in terms of oil molecules and material science there are different scales of geometry. I think maybe we are saying the same thing.
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I am not a molecular scientist but i play one on the internet. lol
i dont know about soaking into the metal but i think it helps soften up the sludge.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=joMYbTz4AlQ&list=UUXJa_IXSznknc0d1SBEOa-g
i think my previous 2 uses of z-max is helping soften and therefore filtering of sludge.
i dont know about soaking into the metal but i think it helps soften up the sludge.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=joMYbTz4AlQ&list=UUXJa_IXSznknc0d1SBEOa-g
i think my previous 2 uses of z-max is helping soften and therefore filtering of sludge.
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MolaKule
Staff member
An 10 weight oil even a cheap 10 weight SA would soften sludge.
Doesn't prove anything.
Doesn't prove anything.
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