If GM declined an engine warranty claim it would be all over the internet. All I ever see is people crying about cracked dashes in 10 year old pickup trucks. Usually it's the same 10, posting on GM & Chev both USA & Canadian sites, and on Mary Barra's time line.
GM recommendation: 15w50 for track driving
- Thread starter dparm
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Sounds good, but what does the actual written warranty from Chevy say about either oil used or track use?
Track use is generally disqualifying for any engine warranty from any maker of any car.
Believe what you see in writing from the manufacturer and their lawyers, not what some gonzo development guys post someplace.
Their claim that M1 0W-40 was unavailable when they "validated these engines", whatever that's supposed to mean should be your first clue that these guys don't have one.
Track use is generally disqualifying for any engine warranty from any maker of any car.
Believe what you see in writing from the manufacturer and their lawyers, not what some gonzo development guys post someplace.
Their claim that M1 0W-40 was unavailable when they "validated these engines", whatever that's supposed to mean should be your first clue that these guys don't have one.
Ok, you race the thing, it blows up and GM says you own it. For under $10k you're back on the track a week later lapping it up.
Or better yet, it's 7L crate motor time for $20K. Rebuild the original for a few large and now you have a spare engine.
Or better yet, it's 7L crate motor time for $20K. Rebuild the original for a few large and now you have a spare engine.
Originally Posted By: fdcg27
Sounds good, but what does the actual written warranty from Chevy say about either oil used or track use?
Track use is generally disqualifying for any engine warranty from any maker of any car.
Believe what you see in writing from the manufacturer and their lawyers, not what some gonzo development guys post someplace.
Their claim that M1 0W-40 was unavailable when they "validated these engines", whatever that's supposed to mean should be your first clue that these guys don't have one.
Tadge Juechter is the chief engineer of the Corvette platform.
http://www.automobilemag.com/news/2014-man-of-the-year-tadge-juechter/
It's very possible that M1 0w40 was undergoing a formulation change right as they were testing.
Sounds good, but what does the actual written warranty from Chevy say about either oil used or track use?
Track use is generally disqualifying for any engine warranty from any maker of any car.
Believe what you see in writing from the manufacturer and their lawyers, not what some gonzo development guys post someplace.
Their claim that M1 0W-40 was unavailable when they "validated these engines", whatever that's supposed to mean should be your first clue that these guys don't have one.
Tadge Juechter is the chief engineer of the Corvette platform.
http://www.automobilemag.com/news/2014-man-of-the-year-tadge-juechter/
It's very possible that M1 0w40 was undergoing a formulation change right as they were testing.
Originally Posted By: SR5
- we could not reach a compromise with 0W-40 and so are avoiding that issue.
And they forgot all about dexos2 which would give them enhanced HTHS and still reduced phosphorus.
- we could not reach a compromise with 0W-40 and so are avoiding that issue.
And they forgot all about dexos2 which would give them enhanced HTHS and still reduced phosphorus.
What is the HTHS of the latest 'n greatest M1 0w40, 3.7? Is Dexos 5W30 HTHS >3.5?
What would the post permanent shear of 5W30 Dexos vs 0W40 M1 be?
To find out, run both engine oils in sonic shear (ASTM ?) for X minutes to simulate aged oil, then test HTHS.
Note: Pressure will not rise with thicker engine oils with variable oil pumps.
Now do the same test with 15W50, and compare the results of all 3 engine oils.
Oil companies and blenders test, but do not publish post sonic shear.
What would the post permanent shear of 5W30 Dexos vs 0W40 M1 be?
To find out, run both engine oils in sonic shear (ASTM ?) for X minutes to simulate aged oil, then test HTHS.
Note: Pressure will not rise with thicker engine oils with variable oil pumps.
Now do the same test with 15W50, and compare the results of all 3 engine oils.
Oil companies and blenders test, but do not publish post sonic shear.
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The dexos2 5w-30 would have an HTHS of 3.5 or greater. The dexos1 version sure as heck won't.
Right, Pet-Can shows >3.3 and >3.2 for their Dexos PCMO and >3.5 for their 5w30 CJ-4/SN HDEO, which may morph into Dexos II one day.
www.lubricants.Petro-Canada.ca
www.lubricants.Petro-Canada.ca
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Well, it shows 3.2 for their Supreme Synthetic 5w-30, which is fairly typical of an ILSAC 5w-30. The Duron could morph into that, if Petro-Canada wants to play. There aren't a lot of dexos2 lubricants in North America simply because there are only like two vehicles that take the product so far. Some already have used similar products to that Duron in ACEA C3 type applications.
The XL Dexos is 3.30. What do owners of 2.8L Diesel Canyons 'n Colorado use? 5W30 Delvac something, and 15W50 on track days?
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I thought "thicker oil protects better" is a myth? At least that's what I've read on here for years
Originally Posted By: userfriendly
What do owners of 2.8L Diesel Canyons 'n Colorado use? 5W30 Delvac something, and 15W50 on track days?
Maybe they have to find a 50 grade with a modern diesel spec.
What do owners of 2.8L Diesel Canyons 'n Colorado use? 5W30 Delvac something, and 15W50 on track days?
Maybe they have to find a 50 grade with a modern diesel spec.
Originally Posted By: oil_film_movies
Sticky wicket warranty issues. So here is the plan: Run the best 5w30 dexos1 oil you can find (M1 EP 5w30), and document your oil changes for warranty claims.
Get a Fumoto valve for your drain plug (optional step).
The day before you go the track, drain out 1 quart, or just enough to get the level down from full by 1 quart.
Put in 1 quart of Mobil1 0w50 Racing Oil for your track usage, as that boosts ZDDP, moly levels, and HTHS.
Almost like magic.
Sticky wicket warranty issues. So here is the plan: Run the best 5w30 dexos1 oil you can find (M1 EP 5w30), and document your oil changes for warranty claims.
Get a Fumoto valve for your drain plug (optional step).
The day before you go the track, drain out 1 quart, or just enough to get the level down from full by 1 quart.
Put in 1 quart of Mobil1 0w50 Racing Oil for your track usage, as that boosts ZDDP, moly levels, and HTHS.
Almost like magic.
Originally Posted By: aquariuscsm
I thought "thicker oil protects better" is a myth? At least that's what I've read on here for years
LOL, I think that's a very broad generalization.
Anyway, to the other questions above: vanilla M1 5w30 is NOT a high-HTHS oil. It is considered resoure-conserving but I would still characterize it as a pretty stout oil.
Back to the original question though: is a 260 F oil temp on the track cause for concern? It's certainly hotter than the street, but far from the 300+ number that people seem to think is dangerous. My M3 (running 10w60) saw the same 260 peak temps at the same track.
I thought "thicker oil protects better" is a myth? At least that's what I've read on here for years
LOL, I think that's a very broad generalization.
Anyway, to the other questions above: vanilla M1 5w30 is NOT a high-HTHS oil. It is considered resoure-conserving but I would still characterize it as a pretty stout oil.
Back to the original question though: is a 260 F oil temp on the track cause for concern? It's certainly hotter than the street, but far from the 300+ number that people seem to think is dangerous. My M3 (running 10w60) saw the same 260 peak temps at the same track.
Originally Posted By: CT8
Originally Posted By: aquariuscsm
I thought "thicker oil protects better" is a myth? At least that's what I've read on here for years
just because you read something doesn't mean it is true.
Originally Posted By: aquariuscsm
I thought "thicker oil protects better" is a myth? At least that's what I've read on here for years
just because you read something doesn't mean it is true.
Originally Posted By: dparm
GM has some verbiage in the Corvette owners manual saying you should switch to Mobil 1 15w50 for track driving and then go back to Mobil 1 5w30 for the street. Logistically that is a headache and financially that is...unpleasant.
Hmmmm....when I go to the track, my bills look like::
You sign up for a day at the track: $250 track fees
You drive to the track $20-$50 gas
You use up 1/2 a set of rotors: somewhere in the $200-$400 range
You use up 1/2 a set of pads: somewhere in the $100-$200 range
You use up 1/4 a set of tires somewhere in the $250-$350 range
You use up $80 gas at track
You drive back from track $20-$50 gas
You have to eat $20 twice $20 again
You buy bottled water $3
Optional:
stay overnight in motel: $100
Eat a nice diner $80
have a few drinks: $20
And you are worried about another $100 in oil !?!
GM has some verbiage in the Corvette owners manual saying you should switch to Mobil 1 15w50 for track driving and then go back to Mobil 1 5w30 for the street. Logistically that is a headache and financially that is...unpleasant.
Hmmmm....when I go to the track, my bills look like::
You sign up for a day at the track: $250 track fees
You drive to the track $20-$50 gas
You use up 1/2 a set of rotors: somewhere in the $200-$400 range
You use up 1/2 a set of pads: somewhere in the $100-$200 range
You use up 1/4 a set of tires somewhere in the $250-$350 range
You use up $80 gas at track
You drive back from track $20-$50 gas
You have to eat $20 twice $20 again
You buy bottled water $3
Optional:
stay overnight in motel: $100
Eat a nice diner $80
have a few drinks: $20
And you are worried about another $100 in oil !?!
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Originally Posted By: Mitch Alsup
And you are worried about another $100 in oil !?!
It's way more than $100. The sump is gigantic and you have to replace it with 5w30 once you are done on the track, so you are effectively paying for two full oil changes. Also, there is the simple logistical problem of going to the dealer twice.
I agree that it's "cheap insurance".
And you are worried about another $100 in oil !?!
It's way more than $100. The sump is gigantic and you have to replace it with 5w30 once you are done on the track, so you are effectively paying for two full oil changes. Also, there is the simple logistical problem of going to the dealer twice.
I agree that it's "cheap insurance".
Originally Posted By: dparm
Originally Posted By: Mitch Alsup
And you are worried about another $100 in oil !?!
It's way more than $100. The sump is gigantic and you have to replace it with 5w30 once you are done on the track, so you are effectively paying for two full oil changes. Also, there is the simple logistical problem of going to the dealer twice.
I agree that it's "cheap insurance".
Would getting a drill powered extractor, a 20l pail, and then save it work with a dry sump? Should be pretty fast and painless if it works.
Originally Posted By: Mitch Alsup
And you are worried about another $100 in oil !?!
It's way more than $100. The sump is gigantic and you have to replace it with 5w30 once you are done on the track, so you are effectively paying for two full oil changes. Also, there is the simple logistical problem of going to the dealer twice.
I agree that it's "cheap insurance".
Would getting a drill powered extractor, a 20l pail, and then save it work with a dry sump? Should be pretty fast and painless if it works.
Originally Posted By: IndyIan
Originally Posted By: dparm
Originally Posted By: Mitch Alsup
And you are worried about another $100 in oil !?!
It's way more than $100. The sump is gigantic and you have to replace it with 5w30 once you are done on the track, so you are effectively paying for two full oil changes. Also, there is the simple logistical problem of going to the dealer twice.
I agree that it's "cheap insurance".
Would getting a drill powered extractor, a 20l pail, and then save it work with a dry sump? Should be pretty fast and painless if it works.
Not sure. It's a dry sump system. The owner's manual has a very rudimentary overview of how to do it:
1. Remove the two drain plugs. One is for the external oil tank (via oil transfer supply line) and the other is for the crankcase sump.
2. Remove the filter
3. Reinstall drain plugs
4. Replace filter.
5. Add oil.
6. Run the engine for 15 seconds, turn it off, and check the level.
Also, that's a gray area with the warranty: GM could say "how do we know you did that every time"?
Originally Posted By: dparm
Originally Posted By: Mitch Alsup
And you are worried about another $100 in oil !?!
It's way more than $100. The sump is gigantic and you have to replace it with 5w30 once you are done on the track, so you are effectively paying for two full oil changes. Also, there is the simple logistical problem of going to the dealer twice.
I agree that it's "cheap insurance".
Would getting a drill powered extractor, a 20l pail, and then save it work with a dry sump? Should be pretty fast and painless if it works.
Not sure. It's a dry sump system. The owner's manual has a very rudimentary overview of how to do it:
1. Remove the two drain plugs. One is for the external oil tank (via oil transfer supply line) and the other is for the crankcase sump.
2. Remove the filter
3. Reinstall drain plugs
4. Replace filter.
5. Add oil.
6. Run the engine for 15 seconds, turn it off, and check the level.
Also, that's a gray area with the warranty: GM could say "how do we know you did that every time"?
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