Downsides to bypass filters
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No downside. Don't drop oil pressure because of bypassed route.
Some think the downside is that they cost some money.
Others think the downside is that oil analysis costs money, and they don't know if they should change their $5-45 worth of oil without an analysis.
Others think the downside is that oil analysis costs money, and they don't know if they should change their $5-45 worth of oil without an analysis.
**** in Falls Church,could the blotter test be admissible evidence in a court case for a warranty claim?
Seve S: Uu-ungh? (a la Tim the Toolman). I mean, how did we go from bypass pros/cons to court evidence and warranty claims?
Sounds like you have some asserted fact or hidden agenda. Maybe it would be clearer if you just said what you are trying to imply right up front.
Sounds like you have some asserted fact or hidden agenda. Maybe it would be clearer if you just said what you are trying to imply right up front.
To the best of my knowledge, there is no ASTM number for a blotter test, and I expect it wouldn't be reproducable.
Doubt you'd find any judge or lawyer who would try to use it in court.
Doubt you'd find any judge or lawyer who would try to use it in court.
It's been mentioned here. One guy was denied warranty repair because the bypass filter could not be ruled out as contributing to the failure of his engine. This could be considered as a "downside".
Other downsides:
Other downsides:
- It's more complex, more stuff to go wrong and more to have to think about
- A greater chance of getting a leak or breaking a hydraulic line.
- Possibly a false sense of security. If you install it and forget it, some other problem could arise, and you wouldn't know it because you don't check/change your oil as often
- If using a Dual Remote Bypass, you increase the backpressure in your system, resulting in a lower effective pressure relief valve setting
- If you don't keep your car long enough, you do not see the benefit
Yes, I read that thread a long time ago. But these guys are talking about ASTM numbers and lawyer mumbo jumbo like it is some big secret or existential knowledge only be obtained through reading Amsoil literature.
Couple of jokers, if you ask me. The original poster just wanted info on bypass pros and cons and these guys act like it is some sort of privileged information.
Couple of jokers, if you ask me. The original poster just wanted info on bypass pros and cons and these guys act like it is some sort of privileged information.
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acewiza
Happy New Year, pal!!
Happy New Year, pal!!
acewiza, yes ,my agenda is not hidden . Read the Amsoil literature.
Same to you Gary!!!
As far as the bypass downsides are concerned, Slalom covered it pretty well, I think.
Anyone who is considering warranty and legalese issues as bypass downsides is not thinking straight. DUH - Of course those type modifications could be issues in those cases!
If you wanted to install a bypass on a new car, you should be intending to keep it past the warranty in the first place. The smart person would then simply un-install the bypass prior to any warranty work, as necessary. If it's going to the dealer for regular servicing, well then you have other issues and should probably not be considering a bypass filter.
Sound about right?
As far as the bypass downsides are concerned, Slalom covered it pretty well, I think.
Anyone who is considering warranty and legalese issues as bypass downsides is not thinking straight. DUH - Of course those type modifications could be issues in those cases!
If you wanted to install a bypass on a new car, you should be intending to keep it past the warranty in the first place. The smart person would then simply un-install the bypass prior to any warranty work, as necessary. If it's going to the dealer for regular servicing, well then you have other issues and should probably not be considering a bypass filter.
Sound about right?
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Well, it's a tough call. We're kinda all a little gunshy when it comes to warranty issues. We've all encountered the stealership two step ..all of them, at one time or another, attempting to play Pontius Pilate on an issue ..throwing up a "hassle screen" of flak that we eventually yield to on the way to our target.
Most of us would also admit that we've almost never had engine issues. Tune issues, electronic issues, emissions issues (maybe) ..but..in the absense of a true design flaw ..or illconceived maintenance routine ...rarely a lubrication issue.
It is mainly THAT fear (other warranty service problems) that fuels this paranoia.
I would probably not be using the dealer for routine maintenance if I had a bypass filter. I would surely subscribe to the MAX OCI spec'd in my owners manual and retain the appropriate receipts if such a warranty event occured.
That's not to say that dealer service is a bad choice at all. For routine maintenance it's not much more expensive then other sources. You get the advantage of the techs snagging any TSB's while they're there just to add to their paycheck. As with any outfit, a bunch depends on the shop and how it's run.
You're correct, though. Anyone who has a TP filter probably services it themselves ..so there's little need for the dealership to get involved unless you've got a warranty issue. A cheaper, more convenient, service provider can do the other things that you need.
Most of us would also admit that we've almost never had engine issues. Tune issues, electronic issues, emissions issues (maybe) ..but..in the absense of a true design flaw ..or illconceived maintenance routine ...rarely a lubrication issue.
It is mainly THAT fear (other warranty service problems) that fuels this paranoia.
I would probably not be using the dealer for routine maintenance if I had a bypass filter. I would surely subscribe to the MAX OCI spec'd in my owners manual and retain the appropriate receipts if such a warranty event occured.
That's not to say that dealer service is a bad choice at all. For routine maintenance it's not much more expensive then other sources. You get the advantage of the techs snagging any TSB's while they're there just to add to their paycheck. As with any outfit, a bunch depends on the shop and how it's run.
You're correct, though. Anyone who has a TP filter probably services it themselves ..so there's little need for the dealership to get involved unless you've got a warranty issue. A cheaper, more convenient, service provider can do the other things that you need.
The Downside is... The element gets dirty.
Bummer.. But on the other hand the element is doing its job..
Bummer.. But on the other hand the element is doing its job..
Well,
I was serious enough to get a full bypass kit for my 2003 TDI, sold by an AMSOIL dealer. 150$
Two things happened:
1. could not get any ASE certified mechanic or anyone at the TDI get togethers to install it.
2. when I ran the economics numbers, IT DOES NOT PAY! no matter how long you keep the car. (I plan on 400K+ for my diesel.)
3. with no payback and no certified mechanics wanting to touch it, the issue of warrentee never made it up to the level where I considered it.
more details at http://sterkel.org/tdi
I was serious enough to get a full bypass kit for my 2003 TDI, sold by an AMSOIL dealer. 150$
Two things happened:
1. could not get any ASE certified mechanic or anyone at the TDI get togethers to install it.
2. when I ran the economics numbers, IT DOES NOT PAY! no matter how long you keep the car. (I plan on 400K+ for my diesel.)
3. with no payback and no certified mechanics wanting to touch it, the issue of warrentee never made it up to the level where I considered it.
more details at http://sterkel.org/tdi
What do you mean by "it does not pay" ? I'm not being silly, I just don't understand what you are trying to say.
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He's saying that recouping the $150 in oil savings takes forever and a day. He's forgotten the lack of downtime for routine oil changes. That's a real cost in a commercial vehicle ..nebulous of an individual that may or may not do it themselves.
It ignores the benefit of the system from it performing its function. There's no way to measure how finer filtration equates to $ and cents.
It ignores the benefit of the system from it performing its function. There's no way to measure how finer filtration equates to $ and cents.
Originally posted by 63Avanti:
If you insist on getting it installed by a certified mechanic or the dealer, I suggest that you do not have it installed. I beleive that by installing it yourself, you understand how it works, how it could potentially fail, and how to service it. And by paying someone else to install and possibly service it, you are whittling away at the potential savings and you are more likely to have a problem with the system.
You can't find a mechanic that is willing to do something mechanical to make money? Is it possible that you expect them to take responsibility for it to function properly? Yeah, I'd deny that too.
You plan on getting 400K+ miles on a turbodiesel without a bypass system? And you don't have the mechanical aptitude to install a bypass system yourself?
Oh, now you Plan on getting 400k+ miles. On another theread you said,
What you mean to say is: In Your Opinion it does not pay. Well, you're entitled to your opinion. Ralph has proof that you're wrong, and it's not just his opinion.
If you insist on getting it installed by a certified mechanic or the dealer, I suggest that you do not have it installed. I beleive that by installing it yourself, you understand how it works, how it could potentially fail, and how to service it. And by paying someone else to install and possibly service it, you are whittling away at the potential savings and you are more likely to have a problem with the system.
You can't find a mechanic that is willing to do something mechanical to make money? Is it possible that you expect them to take responsibility for it to function properly? Yeah, I'd deny that too.
You plan on getting 400K+ miles on a turbodiesel without a bypass system? And you don't have the mechanical aptitude to install a bypass system yourself?
I never ran the numbers on an Amsoil unit, but the TP filters in my vehicles will be payed for in a little over 4 years of service. I have (3)engine oil TP filters in use for almost 2 years now, and haven't changed the oil on any of the vehicles. That's about 13 oil changes that I didn't have to do!
Downside to a bypass would be the extra capacity if you are a short tripper. If not a short tripper, then I don't see the extra capacity as a bad thing.
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