Castrol 10W60 Shearing Quickly

[JohnAnthony]

The Car/Engine
2001
BMW
M5
V8 7Liter Capacity


Oil used from New:
Likely BMW 5W30

Oil used after 48K-ish Miles:
Castrol 10W60

no yet relevant, but
Oil used once during Winter:
Mobil 1 0W40

CURRENT FILL:
Castrol 10W60

USE:
daily commuter
errand runner
weekend toy


the UOA reports
3,000 MILES: (UOA in question) Castrol 10W60
1,973 MILES: Castrol 10W60
2,851 MILES: Castrol 10W60
1,845 MILES: Mobil 1 0W40


http://www.m5board.com/vbulletin/members/johnanthony-albums-random-photos-picture10442-uoa.html

 

[oggb]

It's a 10w-60... of course it's going to shear. Anything with that large of a spread will shear.

 

[Quattro Pete]

Yeah, you haven't really discovered sliced bread here.

But welcome to BITOG nonetheless!

Nice car!

 

[RF Overlord]

Not trying to re-start the thick vs. thin war, but if BMW specs 5W-30 for this motor, and I believe BMW knows a thing or two about performance engines, why on earth are you running 10W-60?

 

[JohnAnthony]

i wouldn't have been surprised if it stopped at 18cSt, but 2 whole grades - looking back I wonder if there is more to it


the new intervals are going to be 5000 miles and i don't burn any oil so am thinking how thin is it going to get

 

[OVERKILL]

Originally Posted By: RF Overlord
Not trying to re-start the thick vs. thin war, but if BMW specs 5W-30 for this motor, and I believe BMW knows a thing or two about performance engines, why on earth are you running 10W-60?



BMW spec's 10w60 for this engine as well. It's a huge range.

 

[JohnAnthony]

Originally Posted By: RF Overlord
Not trying to re-start the thick vs. thin war, but if BMW specs 5W-30 for this motor, and I believe BMW knows a thing or two about performance engines, why on earth are you running 10W-60?






not anymore... everyone from E36 M3 owners to Mclaren F1 owners are recommended 10W60

and i know the politics behind it but i really can't find anything that i like that is significantly cheaper

 

[oggb]

Run 15w-40 during the summer and 5w-40 during the winter. Does the engine seriously need 10w-60?

 

[dparm]

Yes, it does. The oil was designed specially for that motor. It's one of the few engines ever to have a specialty oil made for it.

We know the 10w60 shears a bit but once it stabilizes it is a very good oil.

 

[Doug Hillary]

Hi,
dparm - Castrol 10W-60 has been around for several decades. It was not especuially made for BMW. Sauber-Mercedes used it during their 1989 & 1990 WSCC wins and when winning at LeMans in 1989. It was used in Lotus Cosworth F1 engines and has a track record in race gearboxes (ZF etc)

Two versions are sold - a PAO and ester. BMW use/sell the "original" ester version which had its foundation in 1970s as Castrol R Synthetic 15W-50. How do I know? - I was extensively involved in its development in the late 1970s-early 1980s in petrol and diesel engines.

It is widely used as a race oil in Europe - mainly to cover fuel dilution issues

At the Nurburgring 24hr race last year many BMW engines were racing on 0W-20 concoctions - I was there and spent time with the Castrol and FUCHs Engineers involved

 

[JohnAnthony]

Originally Posted By: dparm

We know the 10w60 shears a bit but once it stabilizes it is a very good oil.


that's kinda the question? how far would it go? what causes it in one engine and not the other? there's other's who run theirs 7000 miles and report the oil remains 18.XX cSt @ 100^C


my car doesn't burn oil... well haven't run it long enough to find out, but at this rate it seems like it would hit a 30 weight by 4000 miles

 

[dparm]

I thought the Castrol TWS 10w60 was a BMW M-specific oil?

 

[JohnAnthony]

Originally Posted By: Doug Hillary
BMW use/sell the "original" ester version which had its foundation in 1970s as Castrol R Synthetic 15W-50. How do I know? - I was extensively involved in its development in the late 1970s-early 1980s in petrol and diesel engines.



off topic now, but why the 2 oils?

BMW TWS (outside the U.S. it's AKA Castrol Edge 10W60/TWS)
API SJ/CF


CASTROL 10W60 EDGE SPORT
ACEA A3/B3/B4
API SL/CF

 

[JohnAnthony]

Originally Posted By: JRed
Run 15w-40 during the summer and 5w-40 during the winter. Does the engine seriously need 10w-60?



no...



i wanted to switch to lubro moly but they don't have a 50w
i was considering a 40w (M1 0W40 or LubroMoly 0W40)
why would i want to use a 15W instead of a 5W/0W?

 

[Doug Hillary]

Hi,
JohnAnthony - I can't explain the two lubricants but I expect it to be Marketing and the non-ester version to be a product of the BP buyout of Burmah. The Castrol/BMW Technical liaison arrangement is at least as complete as is the Audi-VW one. If I was a BMW Engineer I would have chosen the ester version too! Of course much of BMW's engine development is also hidden behind private organisations. Complex Commercial relationships exist

During my last visit to the Nurburgring this issue arose and I was told by the Castrol Engineer involved that I am one of the very few persons still around that were involved in the original Formula R ester lubricant's development! The same applies to Castrol's wonderful ATF Transmax Z

BP's rearrangement of the old Burmah Groups product is sad but no doubt built on Commercial reality

My advice to you is to follow what BMW recommends for you car

 

[edhackett]

It's clear from the additive package that the oil in the current UOA is not the same oil as the previous UOAs on Castrol 10W-60. Are you sure that is what was put in? Blackstone mix up the samples?

Ed

 

[JohnAnthony]

Originally Posted By: edhackett
It's clear from the additive package that the oil in the current UOA is not the same oil as the previous UOAs on Castrol 10W-60. Are you sure that is what was put in? Blackstone mix up the samples?

Ed


the concern was with the OLDEST sample dated 7/12/2010

the most recent (4/02/2011) sample WAS a 40 weight (M1 0W40)

ALL other samples where CASTROL TWS (unmistakable)


the only plausible reason i've been given was that some BMW 5W30 may have been left in the sump and mixed with the fill sampled 7/12/2010

 

[edhackett]

Got it. Dyslexia strikes again.

Ed

 

[zyxelenator]

Try to run Lubro Moly 10w60, maybe it won't shear so fast. ..

 

[Gene K]

Well modified motors are different than stock. BTW how did you manage to stretch it to 7.0 Liters? I wouldnt have thought it was possible?