Bob is the "Synthetic" oil guy

[RoadRaceJosh]

Here's a reason:

• NISSAN recommends the use of Genuine NISSAN Ester Oil, available at a NISSAN dealer.

That's their official word for every V6 Frontier. For the 4 cylinder they state:

• As an alternative to this recommended oil, SAE 5w30 or SAE 10w30 conventional petroleum based oils may be used and meet all specifications and requirements necessary to maintain the New Vehicle Limited Warranty

 

[geekster]

I only buy synthetic because it makes me feel better. Does it matter to my car? Probably not. I like choices. It's no different than when I give money to the same homeless man that sits by the McDonalds by my work. It makes me feel better. Does it make his life better? Probably not. I don't know. I do it because of how I feel when I do it.

 

[KGMtech]

BITOG is largely a collection of OCD car owners, my kind of group ) If it's overkill to check, change, analyse, argue, preach about engine oils, have at it ~ at this place.

As to conventional vs the new stuff:

My 2004 Passat 1.8T requires synthetic, has had Kendall GT1 Full Synthetic 5w40 since new and it has no sludge issues. Change it 2x per year.

I use PP 5w30 in my Maxima, and PP 5w20 in my wife's Flex. Don't need it in these cars, but when PP goes on sale it's not too much more money per change, so why not?

 

[SilverC6]

I like synthetic oil because the bottles have more numbers and stuff on them.

Particularly the euro synthetics.

Honestly, I'm surprised that the labels synthetic and conventional are still being used today.

Probably more important to the marketing department than anyone else.

I believe that in the near future, engine oils will just meet a manufacturer's specification with no reference to base stock composition.

 

[Skittles]

Originally Posted By: ExMachina
Originally Posted By: Skittles

LMAO, cause we all drive our cars like the 24 hour lemans. Apples to oranges. Pull your head out.

You're still unable to see the real point of discussing technology in oil. Yes, you can run on SE oil (old stock on Ebay for You! Go get it!) if you'd like. Its just not interesting. And, you're right, cylinder wall temperatures in a Corolla are only 40 degC, so why even bother with any oil that might be better? Its all about max performance. If you want to use the worst oil you can find and then write about it on a forum, yeah, thats fun.


I don't know how I missed it but you are absolutely right. So tell me, what is this all powerful oil that provides "Max Performance" as you say?

 

[HTSS_TR]

Originally Posted By: wemay
Some of the misconceptions:

-Synthetic undoubtedly protects better than conventional at any OCI. In other words, if you want your vehicle to reach 300K miles, its not even a question.

I use conventional oil in my 30+k miles more than half its life, the OCI with dino was/is 7-10k/6mo and 15-20k/12mo with synthetic. I switch between dino and syn depended on what I bought on sale at that time.

Clearly in my case, dino was/is good in an excellent Toyota V8 engine, even the OCI can be as long as 10k miles, probably because weather in So Cal is not severe.

 

[4wheeldog]

Originally Posted By: ExMachina
Originally Posted By: Skittles

LMAO, cause we all drive our cars like the 24 hour lemans. Apples to oranges. Pull your head out.

You're still unable to see the real point of discussing technology in oil. Yes, you can run on SE oil (old stock on Ebay for You! Go get it!) if you'd like. Its just not interesting. And, you're right, cylinder wall temperatures in a Corolla are only 40 degC, so why even bother with any oil that might be better? Its all about max performance. If you want to use the worst oil you can find and then write about it on a forum, yeah, thats fun.


It is also about the progression of economics. When good conventional was $1 a quart, synthetic was $4 or $5. The gap has narrowed, to the point that inexpensive synthetic is the same price as name brand conventional. Mobil 1 only costs a buck or so a quart more than run of the mill conventional. Why would I change my oil 3k sooner, for a buck a quart?

 

[Justin251]

I keep finding synthetics for less than $3 a quart. Sometimes a little as a $1 a quart.

I still have a few jugs of vwb in my stash. They'll get used. But i have no reason to seek out conventional because with just a minimal amount of effort I purchased synthetic for cheaper.

On the contrary though this forum has taught me to not ignore conventional as its better than I thought it was.

 

[stchman]

As far as using synthetic oil, since GM requires me to use an oil that meets their dexos1 spec, the decision is made for me.

Before the requirement, I used synthetic oil for many years before as it was only marginally more expensive and allowed me to extend my drain intervals. In the end synthetic oil ended up being less expensive.

With all this being said, I tell people to save themselves some money and use synthetic oil unless their car is a big leaker/burner.

 

[KitaCam]

^^^^ This ^^^^ I don't even shop for oil...
I just pick up a few jugs of synthetic when I read of a sale here and haven't spent more than $2.75 for PPPP since coming here 3 years ago and now have 3 years' stash on hand now. Simple.

As for the NEED...I drive mostly around town, short 10-20 minute runs, (I'd bet the typical definition of a 'daily driver') and Kitacam seems to like the synthetic.

 

[Rojack]

Most of the Ram dealerships in this area are using Pennzoil synthetic blend so it must be Pennzoil Gold. My Truck OLM seems to be based on exactly 10,000 miles for an oil change. Every step of the way the % vs mileage stays true to those numbers.

While some conventionals could do that under certain driving conditions I feel that going with synthetic adds a little more of a comfort zone to go that distance, especially since I do not plan on having any UOAs. I also live in an area that can have some very cold days and synthetic does flow better in extreme cold.

I have seriously considered the conventional vs synthetic and in the end I made my own choice based on certain factors according to how I see the overall picture. Everyone is entitled to their opinion and the world would be a boring place if we all had the same thoughts, opinions and tastes.

The forum is a source of reference but ultimately the choice is up to each individual as to what oil they think will best meet their needs according to their situations. The oil companies themselves rave about synthetics being better but as with some other things in life, paying more for something that is supposed to be a lot better according to specifications doesn't always provide as much as a difference in the end as was advertised.

 

[Branson304]

Newer conventional oils are great & I recommend them in some instances, but overall I just prefer synthetic blends & full synthetics. I regularly recommend conventional, blends & full synthetics one just as much as the others when people ask me for advice on oil. It all depends on your vehicle and circumstances. Synthetics are still superior & still the best for your engine (in most cases) regardless, but that doesn't mean conventionals are bad. Synthetic oils can be had for just a little more money than conventional while providing superior protection & much longer change intervals. The cost pays off. My Fusion used conventionals all its life over 100,000 miles before I decided to switch to full synthetic. I kept the conventional changed every 4,000-5,000 & that's perfectly fine. But now I am paying more per oil change but I can go almost twice as far before changing it. I'm saving money & providing better protection. Synthetic = superior

 

[aquariuscsm]

I wonder if the gap was wider back when conventionals were mineral oil and synthetics were esters and pao's? Now conventionals and synthetics are both mineral oils,unless you buy the exotics like Redline,Motul,etc. Has this closed the gap perhaps?

 

[Solarent]

I love a good quality conventional oil. But if you look at the direction that the specs are going (more focus on volatility, oxidation resistance,low saps, deposit formation and fuel economy), its pretty clear that OEM's and the industry in general are favoring Group III and PAO based oils. I would be willing to bet that there will be a continued shift towards synthetics as the new category upgrades come online.

who knows maybe conventional vs synthetic conversations will go away because all oils are synthetic or synthetic blend at least.

 

[userfriendly]

I think that the 4-season engine oil made the synthetic factory fill a necessity.
A vehicle leaving the assembly line may end up in Texas or Alaska, so a one-size-fits-all engine oil would be another "must have".
I do seasonal oil changes, so the above requirements don't apply to me.
I save the so called synthetics for winter, when cold start and flow performance trumps all other attributes.
More important to me than the base oil composition is the additive package, seasonal viscosity, cost and consumption.
Vehicle maintenance when all goes well, is performed at my leisure.

If you are including group IIIs intro the "synthetic" discussion, remember that they are very light weight base oils, perfect for the new light weight engine oils, ATFs and hydraulic fluids.

 

[SirTanon]

Originally Posted By: wemay
Sometimes i wonder how much of an oil website Bob's truly is. Sure, there are those on here who vehemently defended the capabilities of Conventional oil like Dnewton3, Dave1251 and a few others, but for the most part it seems conventional oils are seen in a very poor light by a large number of bitogers...

.......

In celebrating the benefits of synthetics where they are needed (and there clearly are benefits), many members attempt to knock down the usefulness of conventional oils to the point where if you didn't know better, you'd think that only synthetics are getting all the R&D and improvements and "dino" has been frozen in time since 1975.


I'm not sure I agree with this sentiment as a whole.

A lot of people on here espouse the use of Dino oils, but from my experience, they generally qualify their statements in regards to OCI, etc..



My take is - The right oil for your particular application.

Conventional Dino oil that's avaailable today (via reputable channels, that is. No gas station 'MaxiGuard' stuff) is excellent oil, but I would never run it for a 15,000 mile OCI, not even for 100% highway runs in temperate climates. It's just not made for that. You run a good long-drain full-synth for that.

I WOULD, however, have no problem running SuperTech dino for a 5000 (and possibly even 7500) mile OCI, given the above conditions, provided the engine it was going in was in good shape.

On the other hand, for a person running 3000 mile OCIs, even in Phoenix in August, I would not recommend running a full synth. It's unnecessary and wasteful.

Just my $.02

 

[userfriendly]

Good points Sir. Which brings me to this scenario;

A person buys a new vehicle that is specified for 0W20 SN GF-5 engine oil.
The manufacture knows that oil consumption will be approximately one liter per 1,600 km (1 US quart/1000 miles).
Annoyed by the need to constantly add engine oil, the owner switches to 5W30, stops the oil consumption, but does not adjust the OCI.

With the 0W20 engine oil, the additive package was being refreshed during the OCI. The true age of the engine oil was younger with 0W20 after 1000 miles than with the 5W30.

At the 7,000 mile mark, there is no comparison.

For me, I only have to consider the price of the engine oil, and determine an OCI based on that.
If I had an engine that consumed oil, that would be a factor.
If I had to pay for labour (ha!) or if down-time equated to a loss of use, that would be a factor too.

 

[4wheeldog]

Way to many negative assumptions in your model to make me consider using inferior oil, when the cost between synthetic and conventional is so close.

That said, if I had an old beater that went through a lot of oil (As in your new engine example) I might consider using conventional, in it.

As it is, nothing in my fleet, even the one with 250k miles on it, uses any discernable oil. I would like to keep it that way. So....I will use synthetic.

 

[RoadRaceJosh]

My new pickup needs to adhere to a 5k OCI for warranty purposes and the owners manual states:

• As an alternative to this recommended oil (Nissan's ester-based synthetic), SAE 5w30 or SAE 10w30 conventional petroleum based oils may be used and meet all specifications and requirements necessary to maintain the New Vehicle Limited Warranty

So the pickup is lightly driven and gets new conventional oil every 5k. The dealer put in bulk Mobil Clean 5000 when I got my free oil change. I used regular Penzoil when I changed it the last time and as Havoline was on sale recently that's what will go in next.

For the wife's '04 Corolla and my '97 BMW which both have to lifted for oil service (the truck can stay on the ground so the labor is less) I have extended the OCI to 10k and use Mobil 1. The Corolla gets a Fram Ultraguard filter. The BMW has a canister filter with a relatively huge element.

 

[Merkava_4]

Are people still using conventional oil? I didn't think anybody used that stuff anymore.