Artificial Intelligence coming for your job...

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I probably won't live long enough to see how this AI thing ultimately unfolds but I'm relatively sanguine about it.

If anything I'm less worried about the quantum computers & the advanced algorithms than I am about us. Here we sit in 2018, yet so many people's basic attitudes aren't that different from what evolved when we're still fighting for our very existence on the plains of Africa! Simplistic short-termism, greed, an innate need to dominate, a wish to blame others, etc, etc. If we're to take meaningful advantage of this clever new tech, humanity is going to have to evolve with it and I suspect that will mean slaughtering some much cherished sacred cows like concepts of 'ownership', 'the Law's, 'nationhood' and 'competition'.
 
Originally Posted By: DoubleWasp
This assumes that the competition survived.

With their robots (slaves. Robot literally means slave), the human workforce would be worthless and powerless. Lacking alternative for purchase of consumer products, the majority unemployed would be reduced to being a desperate peasant; without any choice of where to shop.

Resources would be moving to the top of the pyramid at an unbelievable rate. The bottom would be way down there in the mud.

North America would basically look like North Korea.


The trick is to avoid wealth concentration at the top as AI is rolled out, and somewhat equal distribution world wide. I assume the nordic countries will have this figured and they will all work less hours or not at all with some on a basic income structure that is livable. If you're good at something then you could work at that and earn whatever you can on top of your basic income.
I think the issue will be corporate greed influencing government policy to not distribute the benefits of AI and automation in a livable way for everyone. AI and automation should make providing the basics of life a fraction of the current costs, that shouldn't be a major drag on the economy. Give some incentives not to have kids and global population will shrink naturally to a more sustainable level.
If most governments throw 1/2 to 3/4 of its citizens under the AI bus, or a couple nations jump way ahead without sharing, then probably we'll have WW3 and we'll all be dead.
 
Originally Posted By: DoubleWasp
Educating people for positions that don't or won't exist is about the hugest scam going on right now.

Followed by educating people for jobs that pay so little, they'll barely break even after years.

Followed by educating people for industries going downhill into the former two categories.


Oh yeah, getting people into debt to learn how to do jobs that already are ceasing to exist is the biggest scam out there.

Some of the jobs that are going to be easiest to replace are some of the last ones that people intuitively think about.

Take doctors for instance...a lot of their year's training is wrote, and then it's application of rules to deduce probably outcomes.

Already, AI with deep learning have been fed thousands and thousands of case files to "learn" or self programme. More advanced than the neural networks when I was teaching machines to see if a Mylanta label was printed right.

These machines absorb data, and build correlations.

When it's learned enough, turn it to disagnosis and it's spot on. The AI has proven the ability to predict mental illness before it happens.

We are literally only years away for a major shake-up in one of our most expensive, and error prone professions. How can you aregue against better, more accurate, 24/7 diagnosis ?

Where are all these programming jobs when the machines self learn and programme themselves ?

In the case of the deep learning MD robot, they would LOVE to know how it can do the mental illness prediction, but they can't. Nobody knows what correlations the AI has made, because nobody programmed that aspect. Even if they WERE to print out the trillions of lines of code, where is it ?

Same applies for tax agents and accountants...
 
Originally Posted By: Snagglefoot
There are several metallurgical coal mines a few hours away. They have the super large coal trucks being driven by folks who make about $60,000 to $80,000 per year. The local community college has a course on getting certified to operate the trucks. The course costs about $4500. Funny thing is, all the newer trucks are equipped to become autonomous, with no drivers. The company is in discussions with the unions about how and when they flip the controls over to the computer. The union is fighting back of course, but it's inevitable. Rumors are, they will start retiring the older drivers, and not re-hire.


Western Oz, truck drivers that you describe are a "fly in fly out" job, and $200k per annum for the privilege.

Now that a "pilot" in the US can fly a Drone in Afghanistan, the mining companies are turning these positions into remote control from an office in a major city...at 1/4 the pay.

Clearly, AI is next.
 
Originally Posted By: Kestas
Originally Posted By: Linctex
Originally Posted By: bmwpowere36m3
You'll still need plenty of people in the meantime to design, build, code and repair robots.

Nope. Only a select few.

What is everyone else going to be doing?

If it gets as bad as you suggest, there will be no market to buy the products built by AI.


that's why "basic universal income" is on the discussion table...need people to buy stuff.
 
Originally Posted By: Shannow
Originally Posted By: Kestas
Originally Posted By: Linctex
Originally Posted By: bmwpowere36m3
You'll still need plenty of people in the meantime to design, build, code and repair robots.

Nope. Only a select few.

What is everyone else going to be doing?

If it gets as bad as you suggest, there will be no market to buy the products built by AI.


that's why "basic universal income" is on the discussion table...need people to buy stuff.


My question is that how's that supposed to be funded? To quote Margaret Thatcher "the problem with socialism is that you eventually run out of other people's money". I think that applies here as well.
 
Originally Posted By: OVERKILL
My question is that how's that supposed to be funded? To quote Margaret Thatcher "the problem with socialism is that you eventually run out of other people's money". I think that applies here as well.


Oh, I agree. But when I use that argument, the Musk fanbois accuse me of "traditional" thinking.

I think you just run the printing presses.
 
AI can have my job. In fact I'd love to see it happen. The illogic and general stupidity I deal with on a daily basis would cause hardware failure in no time.
 
The real test of AI is if it can post on this forum & we'd never know the difference. (Kind of a Turing bitog Test....). Winning the Imitation Game.
 
Originally Posted By: IndyIan
Originally Posted By: DoubleWasp
This assumes that the competition survived.

With their robots (slaves. Robot literally means slave), the human workforce would be worthless and powerless. Lacking alternative for purchase of consumer products, the majority unemployed would be reduced to being a desperate peasant; without any choice of where to shop.

Resources would be moving to the top of the pyramid at an unbelievable rate. The bottom would be way down there in the mud.

North America would basically look like North Korea.


The trick is to avoid wealth concentration at the top as AI is rolled out, and somewhat equal distribution world wide. I assume the nordic countries will have this figured and they will all work less hours or not at all with some on a basic income structure that is livable. If you're good at something then you could work at that and earn whatever you can on top of your basic income.
I think the issue will be corporate greed influencing government policy to not distribute the benefits of AI and automation in a livable way for everyone. AI and automation should make providing the basics of life a fraction of the current costs, that shouldn't be a major drag on the economy. Give some incentives not to have kids and global population will shrink naturally to a more sustainable level.
If most governments throw 1/2 to 3/4 of its citizens under the AI bus, or a couple nations jump way ahead without sharing, then probably we'll have WW3 and we'll all be dead.


Given that we have more people than we have I'm decades who believe that feeding the corporations and taking a load off of them will result in their benevolence, I can hardly see this tragedy being avoidable.

I hate to sound like a pinko, but anyone suggesting that AI should benefit all and not be used by corporations to further gut us is going to be called a pinko.

AI development is going to take serious coin, and capitalism states that the greatest contributor should be the greatest beneficiary.

ASSUMING the AI rollout comes in the form of job elimination, then the masses will stand about as much of a chance as Blockbuster or Radio Shack. It won't really matter what anyone learns. The job application lines will look like food lines in Soviet Russia.

It'll be like a stray dog in a suit showing up to work a nuclear reactor.

Now let's assume that the tech is spread everywhere, evenly. What does it matter when the unemployment rate is the majority?

We don't have to look into the fiction books to know what that looks like. Education will be replaced with animal survival, and we'll have roving gangs, death squads, and funded genocide.

Once the value of the individual human life is lost, the concept of America is dead on the floor.

If there is WW3, I'll give you three guesses what the soldiers representing the government and corporations will look like. Pic was already posted here.
 
Originally Posted By: Shannow
Originally Posted By: DoubleWasp
Educating people for positions that don't or won't exist is about the hugest scam going on right now.

Followed by educating people for jobs that pay so little, they'll barely break even after years.

Followed by educating people for industries going downhill into the former two categories.


Oh yeah, getting people into debt to learn how to do jobs that already are ceasing to exist is the biggest scam out there.

Some of the jobs that are going to be easiest to replace are some of the last ones that people intuitively think about.

Take doctors for instance...a lot of their year's training is wrote, and then it's application of rules to deduce probably outcomes.

Already, AI with deep learning have been fed thousands and thousands of case files to "learn" or self programme. More advanced than the neural networks when I was teaching machines to see if a Mylanta label was printed right.

These machines absorb data, and build correlations.

When it's learned enough, turn it to disagnosis and it's spot on. The AI has proven the ability to predict mental illness before it happens.

We are literally only years away for a major shake-up in one of our most expensive, and error prone professions. How can you aregue against better, more accurate, 24/7 diagnosis ?

Where are all these programming jobs when the machines self learn and programme themselves ?

In the case of the deep learning MD robot, they would LOVE to know how it can do the mental illness prediction, but they can't. Nobody knows what correlations the AI has made, because nobody programmed that aspect. Even if they WERE to print out the trillions of lines of code, where is it ?

Same applies for tax agents and accountants...


The big question is: Once it's out of the bag, what do we do? Give everyone what amounts to pointless busywork to keep everyone fed, or just let the big corps gut the masses like a fish?

The balance of capitalism has always been that the workers could influence receiving a "fair share". What happens when that power is completely removed, and the big money can just walk away with Johnny Five and let him do the job? Bad scene. Bad scene.
 
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