1080p 42" Plasma TVs?

[Quattro Pete]

Originally Posted By: zerosoma
Originally Posted By: greenjp
Originally Posted By: zerosoma
...I would go with LCD - and the 10th time I would more than likely go with an LED.

Uh, an "LED" is an LCD. A "regular" LCD uses a fluorescent backlight, an "LED" uses an LED backlight. They're both liquid crystal displays. LED used to be an upsell/selling point but has rapidly moved downmarket as LED prices have come down. They are more efficient than fluorescent lamps and tend to allow for thinner displays, if those factors matter to you.

At the same price, plasma TVs tend to have superior picture quality and often are available in a larger size to boot. Whether they're still for sale in the future has little bearing on a buyer's decision today.

jeff


LCD = Liquid Crystal Display
LED = Light Emitting Diode

As usual, lots of people saying things that they know nothing about. They are different technologies. But everyone's an expert here, right?

I have to agree with greenjp here. Vast majority of the TVs currently on the market advertised as LED TVs are actually LCD displays that use LED as backlighting. True LED TVs are only starting to pop up, but they are so insanely expensive that most consumers couldn't possibly justify the price.

http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2848171#Post2848171

http://shirroo.hubpages.com/hub/True-LED-TVs-Do-They-Really-Exist

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LED-backlit_LCD_display

 

[zerosoma]

Originally Posted By: KrisZ

You did say that they are becoming a "dinosaur", to me that means only one thing, obsolete, as in old, inferior, outdated etc.


Also, to clarify a bit more and follow up,

I am going to go out on a flammable limb here and say yes, all of the above are true. I was treading lightly to not offend others (I always consider your feelings) but I can't deny several years of salesmanship, experience, and honest customer feedback that all point to the fact that the plasma will die hard, and die hard soon. Many companies will no longer repair their plasmas and send you the pink slip or tell you to buy another model. Firsthand account here. I know there's lots of plasma lovers here in this thread who don't like to hear this and close their ears singing "la la la la" but like it or not, it's being phased out. Plasma = horse and buggy

That's all I'm going to say furthermore on this topic.

 

[Quattro Pete]

It's quite possible that plasma TV technology will soon die off. Sadly, it's not because it's an inferior technology, but mainly because "flashy" is what sells. In a typical brick-and-mortar store, it's easy to put an LCD or (LED-lit LCD) TV in "torch mode" and wow the customer. Unfortunately, having super bright and flashy picture does not equal accurate picture. Unfortunately, most buyers don't care about "accurate". It's similar to audio department and Bose.

This text sums it up well, IMO:
http://www.brisbanetimes.com.au/digital-life/hometech/is-plasma-tv-dead-20120514-1ym2d.html

 

[Lakersguy]

For watching bluray Movies and Sports, the Panny and Sammy plasma's are still better to my eye than any LED/LCD's.

 

[GrtArtiste]

I currently have 2 2010 Samsung LCDs - a 46 1080p and a 32 720p. These are the only HDTVs I've ever had. I've never owned a plasma, only seen them in the store. I've seen some I liked and some I didn't - same with LCD/LED. At the time I went tv shopping, I noticed that every Samsung I saw had an absolutely beautiful picture. The right size - right price - immediate availability resulted in my buying a LCD. I didn't feel the plasma tvs were inferior, I just wasn't wowed by them as I was by the Samsung LCD. After owning them for 2 years, I can still say that I have yet to see another tv of either type or any brand with a better picture. Some are just as good, but none are superior to my eyes.

If I needed another tv I wouldn't ignore plasma entirely, but I've been very happy with LCD and would need a good reason to switch to plasma. If plasma is suffering right now in the marketplace, its because there is no compelling reason to prefer it over LCD/LED and I don't think there will be.

 

[Kestas]

I don't go for flashy or super bright pictures. I like pleasing pictures. I'd hate to see plasma TV technology kicked to the curb.

 

[KrisZ]

Originally Posted By: GrtArtiste
...I noticed that every Samsung I saw had an absolutely beautiful picture. The right size - right price - immediate availability resulted in my buying a LCD. I didn't feel the plasma tvs were inferior, I just wasn't wowed by them as I was by the Samsung LCD. After owning them for 2 years, I can still say that I have yet to see another tv of either type or any brand with a better picture. Some are just as good, but none are superior to my eyes.


Are you sure you're not watching your tv sets in demo mode, or whatever overblown settings that are usually shipped at?
Everybody is different and these modes perhaps look good to a lot of people. For me these settings are simply tiring to look at and if you mix in fast action scenes, I find that high sharpening levels and motion smoothing usually cannot keep up.

 

[GrtArtiste]

Originally Posted By: KrisZ
Originally Posted By: GrtArtiste
...I noticed that every Samsung I saw had an absolutely beautiful picture. The right size - right price - immediate availability resulted in my buying a LCD. I didn't feel the plasma tvs were inferior, I just wasn't wowed by them as I was by the Samsung LCD. After owning them for 2 years, I can still say that I have yet to see another tv of either type or any brand with a better picture. Some are just as good, but none are superior to my eyes.


Are you sure you're not watching your tv sets in demo mode, or whatever overblown settings that are usually shipped at?
Everybody is different and these modes perhaps look good to a lot of people. For me these settings are simply tiring to look at and if you mix in fast action scenes, I find that high sharpening levels and motion smoothing usually cannot keep up.


I just checked the 32 Samsung and it is in STANDARD mode. The other choices are DYNAMIC and MOVIE. I have never changed any of the settings on this tv. It is just like it was when it came out of the box. I will check the other tv later but I have never changed its mode either. We watch a lot of live sports and fast action scenes have never been a problem.

 

[Quattro Pete]

Grt, you may want to look into having it professionally calibrated then. Many times, you can find the settings on-line and do it yourself. What comes out of the box is rarely ever optimal.

 

[GrtArtiste]

Originally Posted By: Quattro Pete
Grt, you may want to look into having it professionally calibrated then. Many times, you can find the settings on-line and do it yourself. What comes out of the box is rarely ever optimal.


Are there benefits to a professional calibration that I'm not aware of? I'm not having any kind of problem with either tv. Both have always had an excellent picture. Maybe the settings aren't optimal according to someone else's specifications but if what I have currently is satisfactory, what will a professional calibration give me that I don't already have? I find it hard to imagine that a calibration will result in an improvement to an already excellent picture.

GrtArtiste

 

[FastGame]

@GrtArtiste

Professional calibration would give you the most natural picture possible that your TV is capable of. If you're use to and like bright over saturated colors then professional calibration would be a waste of money. Your TV comes with presets, the Cinema/Movie mode would more than likely be close to natural. Give that a try and see what you think.

 

[greenjp]

Originally Posted By: zerosoma

LCD = Liquid Crystal Display
LED = Light Emitting Diode

As usual, lots of people saying things that they know nothing about. They are different technologies. But everyone's an expert here, right?

Great acronym lesson. Here's another one for you:
CCFL - cold cathode fluorescent lamp.

Sorry but you don't know anything about these televisions. I don't care if you were a salesman, lots of salesman are know-nothing know-it-alls.

"LED" TVs are simply LCD TVs with LED backlights rather than CCFL backlights. This is a matter of fact, I recommend you do some research:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Backlight

LCD TVs (of both the LED and CCFL backlit type) are composed of a backlight, a color filter (usually red, green, and blue but the Sharp "Quattron" models add an extra yellow one) and the liquid crystal layer which regulates how much light from the backlight is transmitted out.

As Quattro Pete said, there aren't any non-LCD LED displays at this time. LG and Samsung are supposedly ready to deliver OLED (Organic LED, a very different tech) this year but price estimates are in the $10,000 range for a 55" set. I'm assuming you aren't recommending those to anyone. Sony demoed what they called "Crystal" LED at CES last year but it was tech demonstrator and not a product.

jeff

 

[greenjp]

some additional reading on LED/LCD:
CNET's 10 things you should know about LED TVs
Item #1? - "An LED TV is not a new kind of TV...an LED TV is just an LCD TV that's backlit with light-emitting diodes (LEDs) instead of standard cold-cathode fluorescent lights (or CCFLs)."
and
CNET's LED TV primer
This is a good one page summary of LED LCD TVs.
Both are a couple years old but were accurate at the time and remain so.

jeff

 

[Klutch9]

Originally Posted By: zerosoma
Originally Posted By: greenjp
Originally Posted By: zerosoma
...I would go with LCD - and the 10th time I would more than likely go with an LED.

Uh, an "LED" is an LCD. A "regular" LCD uses a fluorescent backlight, an "LED" uses an LED backlight. They're both liquid crystal displays. LED used to be an upsell/selling point but has rapidly moved downmarket as LED prices have come down. They are more efficient than fluorescent lamps and tend to allow for thinner displays, if those factors matter to you.

At the same price, plasma TVs tend to have superior picture quality and often are available in a larger size to boot. Whether they're still for sale in the future has little bearing on a buyer's decision today.

jeff


LCD = Liquid Crystal Display
LED = Light Emitting Diode

As usual, lots of people saying things that they know nothing about. They are different technologies. But everyone's an expert here, right?


In this case, he is an expert. I sell TVs at work, and this is the most common misconception when it comes to TVs. Other than a few insanely expensive models that are very hard to find (we're talking around $10,000 here), there are no LED TVs on the market. Rather, they are LCD TVs with LED lighting. By nature, LCD panels do not illuminate themselves. They need a light source to do that for them. For many years, that light source was fluorescent light. Most TVs nowadays use LED lighting, although you can still find some that use fluorescent - usually the cheaper models.

The only true "LED TVs" are the OLED/AMOLED screens; like some smartphone screens, or the ~$10,000 TVs from LG and Samsung.

I blame advertising for getting people so confused on this topic. Another huge misconception is edge-lit vs. rear-lit LED lighting and which is better, people confusing rear-lit with full-array. AAGGGHHH! Just another day at work...

 

[grndslm]

I understand on a technical forum like this... people like to be as ANALytical as possible.

But it's obviously much easier to say and to type, "LED TV" when one really is speaking/typing about an "LED backlit LCD TV".

All I know is that I *definitely* don't want a plasma TV [or at least not the power bill to come with it]. And I don't even want a non-LED LCD TV [or the power bill to come with it].

What I *do* want is an LED backlit TV. I don't give a [censored] what type of display it is. An "LED TV" uses 1/5th the power of an "LCD TV" of the same size.

When people recommend and inquire about LED TVs... they're asking about how they can get a thin boob tube that doesn't hog electricity for the next 10+ years.

Words are just symbols that point to objects. If you understand the symbol and the intended object, then communication has just taken place. Don't think too hard about why people don't speak your language, and continue feeling sorry for them if necessary. But the acronym K.I.S.S. was invented for the over-analytical.

 

[greenjp]

Maybe so grndslm, but what we had in this thread was a self-identified expert who was simply dead wrong regarding both the words and the objects, and who was spreading that dead-wrongedness (how's that for a word

) to people who may be inclined to believe him.

I'll leave it at that and not quibble with your assertions regarding power consumption

jeff

 

[Quattro Pete]

Originally Posted By: grndslm
All I know is that I *definitely* don't want a plasma TV [or at least not the power bill to come with it]. And I don't even want a non-LED LCD TV [or the power bill to come with it].

Have you looked at modern plasma TVs lately? I was shopping for a new 42" TV a few months ago. I was comparing a new Sony LED-lit LCD and a new Panasonic plasma. It was actually the Panasonic that listed lower energy consumption. Whether that's true in real life, no idea.

 

[P20565R16]

So, what are everyone's favorite 1080p 42" LED-backlit LCD TVs....................

 

[grndslm]

Originally Posted By: Quattro Pete
Have you looked at modern plasma TVs lately? I was shopping for a new 42" TV a few months ago. I was comparing a new Sony LED-lit LCD and a new Panasonic plasma. It was actually the Panasonic that listed lower energy consumption. Whether that's true in real life, no idea.

No, I haven't. Provide us with a make/model number, and Google will tell all.

The best LED-backlit LCD TV is the cheapest one possible. 1080p means that is resolution is going to be standard with a Samsung, Sony, or whatever brand is considered the best.

The ONLY feature that I require is proper aspect ratio zooming. For example, there's a Haier 47" LED my friends were able to get a week before Christmas for $349 shipped. GREAT picture when playing PS3 over HDMI, when viewing analog TV (has all aspect ratio zoom levels available), and when viewing HDTV over HDMI. The ONLY problem is that their digital cable box goes thru the HDMI cable, and not all "digital channels" are HD quality. And when viewing an HDMI picture, you only have two zoom levels, when there should be four. Watching a non-HD signal over HDMI creates a letterbox picture with huge black borders, effectively turning the 47" TV into a 32" TV. Pretty crummy... but at that price, they can live with it.

Just make sure it's LED lit, and make sure it's got plenty of aspect ratio / zoom levels... over both analog and hdmi signals. I'd imagine this Haier might be one of a kind in that regard, but ya never know.

 

[Quattro Pete]

Originally Posted By: grndslm
No, I haven't. Provide us with a make/model number, and Google will tell all.

I must have been looking at the wrong numbers. My bad. Now that I found energy guide for both sets, it shows that the plasma (Panasonic TC-P42S60) has estimated yearly energy cost of $22:
http://shop.panasonic.com/docs/energy-guide/2013/tv/TC-P42S60_Energy_Guide.pdf

While the Sony 42EX440 (which I ended up buying) is at $13:
http://store.sony.com/wcsstore/SonyStyleStorefrontAssetStore/pdf/KDL42EX440.pdf

Still, I personally wouldn't make that small difference in operating cost affect my purchasing decision, but I suppose some people might. I actually somewhat regret not getting the plasma due to its superior black levels.