Good point Eddie!
Round holes AND louvers! Oh the humanity!
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Originally Posted By: ZeeOSix
Originally Posted By: crazyoildude
if the holes are too small in a filter or not enough of them the oil will be forced through those little openings with more force and it can cause molecular shearing.
What? ... "molecular sheering" of what?
...
Of molecules, of course...
Originally Posted By: crazyoildude
if the holes are too small in a filter or not enough of them the oil will be forced through those little openings with more force and it can cause molecular shearing.
What? ... "molecular sheering" of what?
...
Of molecules, of course...
kschachn when you don't understand something you think it must be made up it seems.. Sorry but you and car 51 seem to think the same way in some ways but its amusing here on my end anyway. I guess we all have our beliefs and are entitled to our opinions but with some it goes way over their heads. It's all good though and it makes me laugh..
https://www.oronite.com/paratone/shearloss.aspx
Breakage of the VII molecules due to perforation size and / or shape in OTS oil filter center tubes?
COD, I just don't see those dimensions as anywhere near the same order of magnitude as that present in bearings and ring faces. But with all your engine experience I'm sure you can give us some numerical values to work with to back up your assertion.
edit - Here's a good comparison chart. How far to the right are apertures of center tube perforations of OTS oil filter center tubes?
https://www.oronite.com/paratone/shearrates.aspx
Breakage of the VII molecules due to perforation size and / or shape in OTS oil filter center tubes?
COD, I just don't see those dimensions as anywhere near the same order of magnitude as that present in bearings and ring faces. But with all your engine experience I'm sure you can give us some numerical values to work with to back up your assertion.
edit - Here's a good comparison chart. How far to the right are apertures of center tube perforations of OTS oil filter center tubes?
https://www.oronite.com/paratone/shearrates.aspx
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Originally Posted By: crazyoildude
I guess we all have our beliefs and are entitled to our opinions but with some it goes way over their heads.
This isn't a place for belief. Do you have evidence that there is oil shearing based upon size of oil filter centre tube holes? This is either a phenomenon or it's not. And, there are several engineers and/or physicists and/or formulators you can ask on this board if you're not sure.
I guess we all have our beliefs and are entitled to our opinions but with some it goes way over their heads.
This isn't a place for belief. Do you have evidence that there is oil shearing based upon size of oil filter centre tube holes? This is either a phenomenon or it's not. And, there are several engineers and/or physicists and/or formulators you can ask on this board if you're not sure.
Originally Posted By: ZeeOSix
Originally Posted By: crazyoildude
if the holes are too small in a filter or not enough of them the oil will be forced through those little openings with more force and it can cause molecular shearing.
What? ... "molecular sheering" of what?
Wow that's a new one.
Originally Posted By: crazyoildude
if the holes are too small in a filter or not enough of them the oil will be forced through those little openings with more force and it can cause molecular shearing.
What? ... "molecular sheering" of what?
Wow that's a new one.
Originally Posted By: ZeeOSix
....You do realize that the average engine is about 15 times MORE restrictive to oil flow than the average oil filter.....
You could post that until you're blue in the face and cod isn't going to catch on. Oh wait, you have.
See that's based on scientific evidence and studies not hearsay and garage talk gossip/rumors so it doesn't register.
Molecular shearing caused by a filter center tube? Ugh. Just when I thought it couldn't get more ridiculous. SMH
....You do realize that the average engine is about 15 times MORE restrictive to oil flow than the average oil filter.....
You could post that until you're blue in the face and cod isn't going to catch on. Oh wait, you have.
See that's based on scientific evidence and studies not hearsay and garage talk gossip/rumors so it doesn't register.
Molecular shearing caused by a filter center tube? Ugh. Just when I thought it couldn't get more ridiculous. SMH
sayjac what scientific anything do you have to offer in this matter?? Bottom line is if the filters are restrictive they don"t flow as well and they are in bypass more often.. Thats the way it works..It seems Some of these filter companies slow the flow so they don"t have to spend more on a better quality media.. Again like i said in my previous post im not a tribologist but i am not stupid either small holes equal less flow in many cases...Period!
I am a certified Engine builder that has been doing that for many years my qualifications speak for themselves.. I have also been involved in many lemon law cases throughout the years and my opinion is respected by many.. So sayjac are you a filter expert>?? Selling filters at wal mart does not count,Sorry..
I am a certified Engine builder that has been doing that for many years my qualifications speak for themselves.. I have also been involved in many lemon law cases throughout the years and my opinion is respected by many.. So sayjac are you a filter expert>?? Selling filters at wal mart does not count,Sorry..
Motorking just curious years ago most filter companies had lots and lots of holes on their center tube why are some filter companies using less oil holes on their center tube these days? Is it For strength of the center tube or another reason?
Garek... No offence intended but did you say this is not a place for beliefs??? ok..
Sayjack should be able to answer that question he seems to knows everything..Help us out sayjack im all ears.
Sayjack should be able to answer that question he seems to knows everything..Help us out sayjack im all ears.
Originally Posted By: crazyoildude
if the holes are too small in a filter or not enough of them the oil will be forced through those little openings with more force and it can cause molecular shearing.
I can understand your fear of louvers, (we've all seen a bad louvered filter here), but this is just insane.
Too small of a louver will cause molecular shearing?
What sort of clearances are in a freshly rebuilt engine? Less than .005 I hope. .003 is the diameter of a hair.
How wide are louvers? Maybe .050?
Does this make sense to anyone? In a recent OT mechanical pencil topic, I was called ignorant by someone who insinuated an engineering background who thought .9mm (.035) was the size of a crayon..
if the holes are too small in a filter or not enough of them the oil will be forced through those little openings with more force and it can cause molecular shearing.
I can understand your fear of louvers, (we've all seen a bad louvered filter here), but this is just insane.
Too small of a louver will cause molecular shearing?
What sort of clearances are in a freshly rebuilt engine? Less than .005 I hope. .003 is the diameter of a hair.
How wide are louvers? Maybe .050?
Does this make sense to anyone? In a recent OT mechanical pencil topic, I was called ignorant by someone who insinuated an engineering background who thought .9mm (.035) was the size of a crayon..
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I think your "obsession" with louvers has hit rock bottom as I have posted some already with louvers and no engines blew apart. What would you say if my fleet at work used filters with louvers? SMH, as you need to seek help for this "louver fiasco"
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Let me ask You a question.. Can you say and be 100% sure that the louvered filters you use on your fleet are always filtering and not in bypass some or most of the time? Don't forget the cold winters and some of the high flow oil pumps..
This is going to be good...
Im not even going to mention the louvers that are not opened all the way or the louvers that go in two directions ..
This is going to be good...
Im not even going to mention the louvers that are not opened all the way or the louvers that go in two directions ..
Originally Posted By: crazyoildude
Let me ask You a question.. Can you say and be 100% sure that the louvered filters you use on your fleet are always filtering and not in bypass some or most of the time? Don't forget the cold winters and some of the high flow oil pumps..
This is going to be good...
Im not even going to mention the louvers that are not opened all the way or the louvers that go in two directions ..
Cold winters and bypass are only an issue during warm up and any filter, regardless of design, would have this issue.
Motorking has mentioned in the past that engineers don't know how often a filter goes into bypass.
Even if a filter goes into bypass, dirty oil is better than no oil. After all, you are the one that preaches flow over filtration.
Let me ask You a question.. Can you say and be 100% sure that the louvered filters you use on your fleet are always filtering and not in bypass some or most of the time? Don't forget the cold winters and some of the high flow oil pumps..
This is going to be good...
Im not even going to mention the louvers that are not opened all the way or the louvers that go in two directions ..
Cold winters and bypass are only an issue during warm up and any filter, regardless of design, would have this issue.
Motorking has mentioned in the past that engineers don't know how often a filter goes into bypass.
Even if a filter goes into bypass, dirty oil is better than no oil. After all, you are the one that preaches flow over filtration.
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LOL! He forgot that I didn't say my work uses or does not use "filters with louvers". Our company may or may not and that's up to higher ups that buy the filters so it's not my problem
Oh Boy!
You think in general that louvers don't make a difference, correct? The old round holes were working fine since before i was born they pretty much proved they worked well over all these years.. Can you answer the question i asked you or not?
You think in general that louvers don't make a difference, correct? The old round holes were working fine since before i was born they pretty much proved they worked well over all these years.. Can you answer the question i asked you or not?
No one can answer that as it would depend if the louvers are correctly punched
happy now??!
happy now??!
Pretend its a perfect world and all the louvers are all punched correctly.. Can you answer the question now?
Then I would say the filter would function correctly and not blow a engine.
If filter was Purolator; then there's 50/50% chance of filter tearin apart LOL!
If filter was Purolator; then there's 50/50% chance of filter tearin apart LOL!
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