I just recently replaced the 302HO motor in my 20' Shamrock. The motor is a flat tappet cam motor. I broke the cam in with Brad Penn break-in oil. My question is should I use a zinc supplement to the 20w-50w that the owners manual suggests? This is a 1988 boat so the owners manual is dated as far as oil tech goes. Or is just 20-50 Castrol good? Thanks John
Need opinion on oil additive or not?
- Thread starter JW714
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Most 20W/50 oil is old school, still has plenty of ZDDP. Mobil 1 15w/50 would also be an excellent choice.
What I'm concerned with is that I read new oils have less ZDDP and alot of the newer engines are roller cams.I bought the engine from ADT thru Summit.Their tech said use what your manual calls for.He wouldn't make a recommendation.
Originally Posted By: JW714
What I'm concerned with is that I read new oils have less ZDDP and alot of the newer engines are roller cams.I bought the engine from ADT thru Summit.Their tech said use what your manual calls for.He wouldn't make a recommendation.
Like I said in my earlier post, 20W/50 still has ZDDP in amounts that it did 30 years ago. Mobil 1 15W/50 also has plenty.
Maybe you don't understand........Zinc and phosphorous are ZDDP, when combined. These oils have plenty for flat tappet old school motors. Use with confidence.
What I'm concerned with is that I read new oils have less ZDDP and alot of the newer engines are roller cams.I bought the engine from ADT thru Summit.Their tech said use what your manual calls for.He wouldn't make a recommendation.
Like I said in my earlier post, 20W/50 still has ZDDP in amounts that it did 30 years ago. Mobil 1 15W/50 also has plenty.
Maybe you don't understand........Zinc and phosphorous are ZDDP, when combined. These oils have plenty for flat tappet old school motors. Use with confidence.
Originally Posted By: JW714
What I'm concerned with is that I read new oils have less ZDDP and alot of the newer engines are roller cams.I bought the engine from ADT thru Summit.Their tech said use what your manual calls for.He wouldn't make a recommendation.
And the zddp has been replaced with other compounds which replace it,and as far as I'm concerned zddp is yesterday's news. Lack of it is meaningless since the industry uses better stuff to replace it.
So forget adding zddp. If you are going to add anything I suggest a friction modifier instead on an anti-wear agent.
Mos2 made by liqui-moly is my choice. I use it in everything. 7 bucks a can and it returns that investment 10 fold in increased fuel economy.
But the truth of the matter is today's oils don't really "need" anything. They are formulated by people who know what they are doing. Randomly adding stuff affects the balance the formulator engineered into the oil and can potentially do more harm than good.
I use mos2 because in my experience it works as advertised which is an anomaly in the snake oil,I mean additive market.
I would add anything but oil til the engine has 5000 miles though. And 20w-50 is great in an air cooled motorcycle but is way overkill in an engine today.
In that engine I'd use an hdeo in the 30 grade flavour. Either a conventional 10w-30 or if available devlac elite 222 in the 0w-40 flavour.
Then monitor. If consumption presents itself I suggest going up to a 40 grade. Either a conventional 15w-40 or a synthetic 0w-40.
Any brand will work. They are all of good quality however I'm really liking the devlac line based on how it performs in our forklift running 500 hour intervals.
What I'm concerned with is that I read new oils have less ZDDP and alot of the newer engines are roller cams.I bought the engine from ADT thru Summit.Their tech said use what your manual calls for.He wouldn't make a recommendation.
And the zddp has been replaced with other compounds which replace it,and as far as I'm concerned zddp is yesterday's news. Lack of it is meaningless since the industry uses better stuff to replace it.
So forget adding zddp. If you are going to add anything I suggest a friction modifier instead on an anti-wear agent.
Mos2 made by liqui-moly is my choice. I use it in everything. 7 bucks a can and it returns that investment 10 fold in increased fuel economy.
But the truth of the matter is today's oils don't really "need" anything. They are formulated by people who know what they are doing. Randomly adding stuff affects the balance the formulator engineered into the oil and can potentially do more harm than good.
I use mos2 because in my experience it works as advertised which is an anomaly in the snake oil,I mean additive market.
I would add anything but oil til the engine has 5000 miles though. And 20w-50 is great in an air cooled motorcycle but is way overkill in an engine today.
In that engine I'd use an hdeo in the 30 grade flavour. Either a conventional 10w-30 or if available devlac elite 222 in the 0w-40 flavour.
Then monitor. If consumption presents itself I suggest going up to a 40 grade. Either a conventional 15w-40 or a synthetic 0w-40.
Any brand will work. They are all of good quality however I'm really liking the devlac line based on how it performs in our forklift running 500 hour intervals.
Any name brand oil with reasonable OCI(Oil Change Interval) will protect your engine(s) for long long time.
Example, my 1994 LS400 with 370+k miles had many different oil brands, both dino and syn, at reasonable OCI of 6mos/7-9k miles with dino and 1 year/16-18k miles with syn. Oil filters are nothing fancier than Motorcraft FL400S and some cheap free after rebate filters such as Pep Boys(I don't remember the name) and filters were changed once a year.
The engine is running very well after 21 years without any repair, the valve cover gaskets are original.
Just don't do 10-15k miles or longer OCI's with dino oil without an oil analysis.
Example, my 1994 LS400 with 370+k miles had many different oil brands, both dino and syn, at reasonable OCI of 6mos/7-9k miles with dino and 1 year/16-18k miles with syn. Oil filters are nothing fancier than Motorcraft FL400S and some cheap free after rebate filters such as Pep Boys(I don't remember the name) and filters were changed once a year.
The engine is running very well after 21 years without any repair, the valve cover gaskets are original.
Just don't do 10-15k miles or longer OCI's with dino oil without an oil analysis.
Thanks guys for explaining that for me. I didn't understand that new oils have additives that replace the zinc. Thanks again John
JW714, you're probably OK with no additives as others have said. Moly, boron and calcium-based anti-wear adds have taken the place of large doses of ZDDP in modern oils.
But, if you want that extra insurance, this additive has provided some of the best UOAs I have ever seen:
http://www.schaefferoil.com/engine-oil-treatment.html
But, if you want that extra insurance, this additive has provided some of the best UOAs I have ever seen:
http://www.schaefferoil.com/engine-oil-treatment.html
The ideology that zinc no longer matters would seem to be contradicted by the high amounts of zinc in cj-4 oils, and break in oils designed for flat tappet engines.
I personally have seen enough wiped out cams that I won't be running a low zinc oil in a flat tappet engine any time soon.
You should also examine your engine and camshaft warranty. Some specifically void your warranty if a low zinc oil is used.
I'd suggest letting someone else's engine being the guinea pig of using low zinc oil in a flat tappet engine.
I personally have seen enough wiped out cams that I won't be running a low zinc oil in a flat tappet engine any time soon.
You should also examine your engine and camshaft warranty. Some specifically void your warranty if a low zinc oil is used.
I'd suggest letting someone else's engine being the guinea pig of using low zinc oil in a flat tappet engine.
Originally Posted By: JW714
I just recently replaced the 302HO motor in my 20' Shamrock. The motor is a flat tappet cam motor. I broke the cam in with Brad Penn break-in oil. My question is should I use a zinc supplement to the 20w-50w that the owners manual suggests? This is a 1988 boat so the owners manual is dated as far as oil tech goes. Or is just 20-50 Castrol good? Thanks John
Get some Brad Penn 20w50 racing oil. You'll never look back.
I just recently replaced the 302HO motor in my 20' Shamrock. The motor is a flat tappet cam motor. I broke the cam in with Brad Penn break-in oil. My question is should I use a zinc supplement to the 20w-50w that the owners manual suggests? This is a 1988 boat so the owners manual is dated as far as oil tech goes. Or is just 20-50 Castrol good? Thanks John
Get some Brad Penn 20w50 racing oil. You'll never look back.
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