Can synthetic cause camshaft damage?

[mcne]

I own a 1987 Ford F-150 with a 300/4.9L straight six. An employee at Clifford Performance (they specialize in high performance six cylinders) told me that synthetic oil should never be used in my engine. He said the camshaft is lubricated and cooled down from oil, oil that is splashed up from the crankshaft. Synthetic oil will not stick to the camshaft and doesn't splash as well. Running synthetic will cause camshaft damage as well as damage the cam bearings. This sounds crazy to me.

I will be rebuilding my 300 (mild build) at the end of this month. I want to protect my investment and would like extended OCI's. What should I do?

 

[moribundman]

You shouldn't listen to the crazies.

 

[Blue99]

quote:

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Synthetic oil will not stick to the camshaft and doesn't splash as well. Running synthetic will cause camshaft damage as well as damage the cam bearings. This sounds crazy to me.

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Sounds crazy because it is crazy.

Synthetic motor oils generally have better flow characteristics than conventional(dino) oils.

Synthetics also have a higher film strength.

And any current motor oil on the shelf, dino or synthetic, with a GF-4/SM rating, has passed the Sequence IIIG test, which is run for 100 hrs @ 300F in a GM 3.8 V6 engine. This test includes a camshaft/lifter wear spec of not to exceed 60 microns.

So synthetic oils should pose no problems, you probably will want to run a higher level of ZDDP 1000 ppm or more - the current SM oils are 800ppm max.

 

[Shannow]

Clifford know a lot about 6s (was reading some stuff on them only this week), but know SFA about oil by the sound of it.

 

[mcne]

I guess I will stop listening to crazy people.

10w30 is the origianl weight Ford recommended for this engine. My temperature range can be from 5 degrees F to 110 F. Should I change to a 5w30 weight since that is the newer technology? I am amfraid I will hurt my new motor.

What do you guys recommend for a synthetic 10w30 or 5w30 that has high levels of zddp and zinc?

 

[Russ300H]

The 300-6 is one of the best engines Ford ever made. If you're using synthetic and want the best that is generally available, I would use the 5W30 or 5W40 M1 Truck & SUV. Second choice Group III Rotella Syn. Personally, I would use the 5W40 as the 300-6 as it is an older design engine and doesn't have the ultra close internal tolerences that newer engines have. Use a good filter like the Motorcraft and do a UOA at 6K, I would bet you can go 10K.

 

[Titan]

5-30, 0-30. All good if rated appropriately.

 

[55Test]

I had an 87 F150 back about 8 years ago (man do I EVER regret selling it) and I ran QS 4x4 synthetic blend for a few (2, IIRC) short OCI's. Never had any cam trouble, although I did have a rear main seal leak that left a trail of oil on the underside of the truck. I also seemed to have a slight miss on one cylinder, if I pulled the plug wire off that one particular cylinder, it didn't really make any difference in how it idled. I know oil didn't cause that.

 

[Rickey]

"I also seemed to have a slight miss on one cylinder, if I pulled the plug wire off that one particular cylinder, it didn't really make any difference in how it idled. I know oil didn't cause that." I hate to point this out,but I just couldn't resist. A worn out cam lobe will cause a misfire. Rickey.

 

[55Test]

True, but it didn't seem like a complete misfire. When I revved the engine up, the misfire went away. Maybe it was a burned exhaust valve?

 

[Rickey]

55 yes that and other things are possible too. But given the topic of this thread I just couldn't resist LOL ! Incdentially the shade tree test for bad cam lobe(s) is to run the engine for a short period of time, cut it off, then pull the dipstick and run a good magnet across the oil clinging to it. Any metal slivers sticking to the magnet is bad ! While this test probably won't catch all bad cams, the presence of metal on the magnet proves trouble. Good luck Rickey.

 

[Rickey]

The "synthetic ruins cams" "synthetic is bad for diesels" "synthetic is too slick" etc. rumours have been bantied about for some time. Probably there are some coincidence failures that happened right after a change to synthetic was made. This could be the basis for most of the rumours in my opinion. I am however concerned with the add pack changes for SM and running a flat tappet cam with high spring rates and rocker ratios. Narrow application for sure. OK sorry to beat this to death. Ya'll have fun ! Rickey.

 

[Terry]

Urban legend that is promoted today by people who should know better. Even Smokey Yunick, *** Rest his soul, ( a genius I wish had mentored me) incorrectly blamed "synthetic" as a upper engine wear causal.

The problem that most are describing ( including your engine building folks) was that early popular syn based oils used less EP/AW adds because the formulators thought that they either didn't need them or cost controllers needed to keep price competitive with .59c motor oil offered then.

The base oil then was not the problem, the total formulation was the issue.

Most products now marketed have enough EP/AW in the syn oils to protect very well, some are better than others in really high stress valve and cam designs.

Another wrench in the formulating soup is the deceasing ZDDP loads for API cert oils. If the formulator is good and his managment does not undercut him, there are plenty of effective non metallic adds and additive chemistries that can do the job very well.

Watching the oil add levels in Spectro analysis posted here you see that taking place.

For the 300 6 pick a good oil that can go the distance and back your choice up with Analysis.

Contact Specialty formulations for his formulas, they are made to protect and can go longer drains. He is out of El Dorado Ks, just west of you!

Terry

 

[Johnny]

Since when is oil splashed up to the cam bearings. I thought it was pumped up, at least it is on my cars. The only splashing going on is inside my 5 hp Briggs.

 

[Ray H]

Hey, c'mon Johnny - we're talking about the hallowed enterprise of "Clifford Performance", here. (They specialize in high performance six cylinders.

) Oil pumps? D'ey don' need no sting-keeng oil pomps...

 

[Johnny]

 

[mcne]

I have been told to to run higher levels of zinc and phos. because of the flat tappet design. I'm also adding a higher lift cam and stronger valve springs. Shell Rotella T 5w40 seems too thick for a nice tight engine, but it does have good stuff in it for the price.

What other specific oils have high levels of zinc and phos?

 

[Brons2]

If you can find one of the Xw30 diesel oils, that would be a good choice in a 30wt.

Amsoil, Redline and other boutique oils also have very high additives in 0w30/5w30

 

[ToyotaNSaturn]

lyco5555 wrote: "old wives tales linger greatly on this site."

I believe the opposite is true: new members bring the beliefs that most of us have prior to looking at trended data apart from all the marketing hype and "what my mechanic said" stuff. In time, those old wives tales die off, leading to a person who's more informed on oil than most others.

I wish that I had all this BITOG knowledge back when I worked Ford parts. I could have given better advice to customers.

 

[mcne]

What about these I found in the virgin oil samples?

Chevron 300 10w30 -89 Mo/1141 P/ 1254 Zn

Cenex superlube TMS 10w30 -1094 P/1182 Zn

Valvoline MaxLife 5w30 -255 Mo/ 821 P/924 Zn

Mobil 1 EP 5w30 - 84 Mo/ 955 P/ 1070 Zn

How important is Mo? Some have it and some don't.

Should I run dino oil for the first few oil changes while the engine breaks in, then switch to synthetic?