The death of the auto enthusiast.

[Rmay635703]

Many hobbies including old games, old computers, old cars, even old TV sets have gotten extraordinarily expensive in the last 3 years, that keeps many kids out of the hobby as it used to be nearly free to get into obsolete electronics and now can be thousands of dollars just for old gaming systems + games, let alone 10’s of thousands for old worn out beater projects

I am betting that with all the youtube channels and podcasts that sure some are popular but many are not.
Quantity doesn't equal viewership.

Peak YouTube has happened twice.

The reality is a ton of folks found they were able to earn a lower to upper middle class wage YouTubing in the pandemic era, this included every topic known to man.

Advertising revenue has fallen off a cliff while viewership has also dropped meaning now lots of long term YouTubers (big g channels) are having the I’m going to be getting partime job and reducing content conversation with viewers.

The retro-computing topic had a boom and now is busting.

Many of the long time I like are on record as saying that YouTube revenue is only $50-150 a month, they are poor folks that have a passion so the downturn doesn’t affect them as much.

For every truly interesting car person out there, there are 100 of these dudes. I think it has turned people off. It certainly has me.

Not to mention when a $40,000 Tesla outperforms nearly every other road car it’s hard to get that excited anymore.

Yeah got two of them across the street and other at the end of the block, one guy drives his muffler less 80’s ricer into work at 10pm and the other comes back at 4 am , always got to idle and rev 10 minutes before they leave.

 

[Exhaustgases]

Problem with being a car enthusiast is not just all the normal things mentioned here, but the wonderful restrictions.
Pretty much everything to do with cars has some wonderful restriction to it.
Funny the same restrictions don't apply to the 6000 plus airliners in the us skys at any one moment, dumping fuel etc.

 

[Carmudgeon]

I remember the days when I looked forward to receiving my Car and Driver, Motor Trend and Road and Track magazines in the mail. Seems like ancient history.

Effective with the March issue-Motor Trend magazine has gone to a quarterly publication. They have been pretty thin each month the last year or so-and the type has gotten smaller, page count lower.

In recent years, I've maintained a C/D subscription because it was cheap ($5/yr) and it's nice just to have something around to peruse.

It's expiring soon, and in lieu of any similar deals, I'll probably let it lapse, more so since I can see the number of issues shrinking again as well.

Somewhat recently, the circulation figures for C/D, which used to ~1 million, took a dive and lost 2/3rds of that number.

In general, media has changed, and hobbies have changed; it's not just print magazines or topics like cars. Times change.

Many things are responsible, and the internet has played a big role, some may say negatively.

But knowing what it was like before computers and internet, even though hobbies have shrunk, and retreated into niches, having the internet still makes it much eaiser to find the like-minded who maintain the enthusiasm for a particularly subject.

 

[Torrid]

In recent years, I've maintained a C/D subscription because it was cheap ($5/yr) and it's nice just to have something around to peruse.

It's expiring soon, and in lieu of any similar deals, I'll probably let it lapse, more so since I can see the number of issues shrinking again as well.

Somewhat recently, the circulation figures for C/D, which used to ~1 million, took a dive and lost 2/3rds of that number.

In general, media has changed, and hobbies have changed; it's not just print magazines or topics like cars. Times change.

Many things are responsible, and the internet has played a big role, some may say negatively.

But knowing what it was like before computers and internet, even though hobbies have shrunk, and retreated into niches, having the internet still makes it much eaiser to find the like-minded who maintain the enthusiasm for a particularly subject.

C/D can be that cheap these days? I remember feeling like I was stealing it for like $12 a year a long time ago.

 

[pnwTD6]

I think the housing crisis for younger folks contributes. When I think about my 68 cougar, the cost in parts and tools over they years hasn’t been too bad, but I’ve often had to store it at relatives or try to find storage when working around the country. That had a much bigger impact on my wrench time.

 

[TimeFlies]

Most people age 15 to 35 nowadays don't really care about cars.
When I ask my friends, cousins, and those in that age group, if they even have a license to drive af all, they don't know how to open the hood of a car, and they don't care to learn. The car has less appeal than their washing machine does.

Look at this very forum we are on, many of you will claim to be car enthusiasts, but your posts do not reflect that.
A new thread starts asking for a car recommendation, and i read a bunch of posts saying toyota tin. Toyota is the anti car enthusiast brand if ever there was one.
Then someone else says what new minivan is good, and again i see some say toyota. Yesterday I drove a sienna to see what all this hype was about, and all the sienna could do for me was make me glad I didn't buy one.
They had a low km used 2022 camry on the lot, I took it for a drive to, and thank God I was not in a depressed mood, because it would have made me want to kill myself if I was.
Someone on here, and no i don't recall who, called the Honda Fit a penalty box. Having driven Fits ( plural ) thousands of kms, and been a passenger in them thousands more, what the Fit really does is engage the driver. Handling, road feedback, rowing through the gears, and fun to drive factor that should have it priced 10 times higher. Because it doesn't have dull steering, cvt, and no road feel, they call it harsh. I guess the large volume knob, and easy to decipher HVAC controls are also bad to some.

I don't see people on this forum recommending the Golf R, Civic R, Mustang GT stick, Cayman GTS, Ram TRX, or other fun vehicles.

So yes it seems auto enthusiasm is all but dead.

 

[BMWTurboDzl]

Ten years ago the Autos section at Yahoo was one of their top four subjects.

Today autos doesn't even rank in the top 50 for most media conglomerates. Nobody cares. It's as if the entire field of automotive journalism has turned into a hopeless morass of search engine optimization and industry shills.

You love cars? Want to preach to that congregation?Tough luck! My colleagues, many of whom have been at it for decades, are faced with offering 50 shades of bias confirmation for an audience whose love for cars usually begins and ends with an infotainment system.

I write a lot of articles about cars and it's brutally heartbreaking to realize that what was once a pure joy of the open road for tens of millions of Americans has turned into a blip of content that caters to an audience that no longer cares.

I guess the real question is whether cars have become nothing more than a rolling appliance for most owners. Has the boredom of daily driving killed America's live of cars. Or are cars just too expensive these days.

Perhaps it's due to the growth of social media influencers on YT (ex, Chris Harris, Doug Demuro(sp?)) and automakers realizing they benefit more from this type of advertising vs print. YT is flooded with all sorts of auto-centric reviews and meaningless comparisons.

The other issue is that there has been a substantial narrowing of the performance and reliability gap. EV's almost make the entire concept moot. In-cabin features are the only thing which sifferienates one automakers from another. There's nothing special about that.

 

[TimeFlies]

Forgot an important thing, so posting again.

Automobile reviewers have also become boring for the most part. These sloth like creatures call themselves reviewers, and go drive around in a vehicle, then write, or youtube about it. But they almost always make it boring, and aren't true enthusiasts. There used to be a good car enthusiast tv show on, it had 3 British guys, they were funny, had cool cars, fun guests, and knew how to drive.
They would put a car through its paces, and do so in a humorous way. Well seems that the shows producers had a disagreement with the old guy, and fired him, but he was the shows glue, and its since fallen apart. Occasionally Matt Leblanc is on it now, and he does an okay job, but he doesn't come close to the old guys level of making it cool.

Reviewers are more concerned about their super big gulp fitting in the cup holder, than they are about how fun a car is to drive.
If I was going to be an automobile review writer, I would take the vehicles everywhere possible, including up logging roads, and around a race track.
Then park in some busy store parking lot and invite people to come sit in it, touch it, and give feed back on it, from real people. Have a website where people could sign up to be my co testers, and have 10 or 20 people of varying ages take each vehicle for a drive. I would ride along with them, and ask questions, and take notes, then factor in their feedback. One mans horribly uncomfortable seat, maybe a dream fit for others for example.

 

[SC Maintenance]

Here is a partial list of closed race tracks. I know of several other tracks that have closed around this area, or maybe still exist but haven't hosted an event in years. Cause or affect - don't know. When I was a kid I enjoyed going, but I haven't even looked at going for years.

Category:Defunct motorsport venues in the United States - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[CKN]

Most people age 15 to 35 nowadays don't really care about cars.
When I ask my friends, cousins, and those in that age group, if they even have a license to drive af all, they don't know how to open the hood of a car, and they don't care to learn. The car has less appeal than their washing machine does.

Look at this very forum we are on, many of you will claim to be car enthusiasts, but your posts do not reflect that.
A new thread starts asking for a car recommendation, and i read a bunch of posts saying toyota tin. Toyota is the anti car enthusiast brand if ever there was one.
Then someone else says what new minivan is good, and again i see some say toyota. Yesterday I drove a sienna to see what all this hype was about, and all the sienna could do for me was make me glad I didn't buy one.
They had a low km used 2022 camry on the lot, I took it for a drive to, and thank God I was not in a depressed mood, because it would have made me want to kill myself if I was.
Someone on here, and no i don't recall who, called the Honda Fit a penalty box. Having driven Fits ( plural ) thousands of kms, and been a passenger in them thousands more, what the Fit really does is engage the driver. Handling, road feedback, rowing through the gears, and fun to drive factor that should have it priced 10 times higher. Because it doesn't have dull steering, cvt, and no road feel, they call it harsh. I guess the large volume knob, and easy to decipher HVAC controls are also bad to some.

I don't see people on this forum recommending the Golf R, Civic R, Mustang GT stick, Cayman GTS, Ram TRX, or other fun vehicles.

So yes it seems auto enthusiasm is all but dead.

You have to couple this with vehicles needing less maintenance that ever before, and later model vehicles also being more reliable than they have ever been. The " beater club" will debut this- but it's a fact.

 

[Blackstack]

As for just regular sedans, SUVs and pick up trucks I think as far as bang for your buck performance, safety, handling and practicality I think that peaked around 2005 or so. There really is no need for anything over a 6-speed auto for example. I think side curtain airbags were the last major safety feature we really needed. I know how to drive and think I'm pretty good at it so traction control, stability control, lane warnings, adaptive cruise control is nothing I want to pay for or even want. I want a 8" x 6" screen for a back up camera (which I do like) and maybe navigation. Or, I have a phone for navigation if I need it. I want physical buttons for all radio and HVAC controls. I don't want a touch screen for any of that even if it was free. All this stupid "tech" which isn't really that a lot of the times, is just marketed as such. Touch screens controlling your HVAC is really just a cheaper way of doing it than having physical buttons to do so for example and people are enamored by it even though touch screens have been around for decades. I just don't get it. New vehicles are ridiculously expensive to buy, insure and then to keep longer term. They've really become disposable appliances with no character for people who want to throw their money down a rat hole. My 2005 Impala daily driver was one of the top performers for safety back in the day but doesn't have side impact air bags but the new 2006 model did. My 2012 Taurus SHO is a tank. I feel as safe in that as anything I'd be able to buy for that money today and the newer sedan would be much smaller. So no wonder enthusiasm is down for the crap people buy today just to keep up with the Jonses.

 

[Exhaustgases]

I think main distractors about, the cars from the 90's to now, are the total lack of styling, and the disposable design concept of them all, along with the designed in obsolescence of all the major electronics components they all have.
Pretty much all the budget made main components from engines, transmissions, to the rear axle in awd unit, are built just barely good enough to last to a certain point in time. True quality of those components no longer exists, they are made from materials that are easy to manufacture, and that require less machine work than quality parts of the past. The only modern day cars that will ever be of collector value will be corvettes and camaro's, hell cats etc. yeah cars with a bit of styling. I don't think any of the mini vans or cross overs, ev's etc. will ever be.

 

[PandaBear]

Very true about "you can't do much to cars" today. Lawsuits, emissions, electronics etc will pretty much be all locked down to what you can get and not even stereos are upgradable now aftermarket. Want to go fast? Pretty much EV for drag racing and nobody cares about handling when you can out torque others in a straight line to catch up. It is like, you can just buy your way into power instead of modding.

Driving fast you say? I don't think traffic was this bad when I was a kid and there are way more people on cruise control and now self driving. What are you going to do with a fast car? It is quiet and comfortable and eco friendly and safe, that's pretty much it.

These days even an econobox is 1.8 and 0-60 under 8 seconds. OEM tuned everything and you can't change anything without CEL, and if you are unfortunately with a CVT, slip the belt if you tune it any more than OEM. Don't get me started on those fake engine sound to increase "driving experience". It is just stupid and that probably make people felt cheated and not want to get into the hobby.

 

[CarbonToast]

Trackdays and SCCA autocross is growing. Check your local drag strip. 4WD clubs, UTV clubs.

My perspective is the focus is more about doing things with the car rather than the vehicle itself. I don't know anyone that has a museum piece mindset about cars or bikes. If I own something, it is to be used.

I love wrenching and do maintenence and repair on our fleet and everything at our house. It's fun but at the end of it all it's more manual labor and time away from people.

 

[CarbonToast]

You have to couple this with vehicles needing less maintenance that ever before, and later model vehicles also being more reliable than they have ever been. The " beater club" will debut this- but it's a fact.

Also, new cars are better than ever. Even the cheapest new car needs very little improved.

Looking at cars from the 60s-90s they were junk from the factory compared to anything new right now. You could really improve them by modifying it and get a direct benefit in everyday driving. Buy a 2023 anything, what needs to change?

 

[RooflessVW]

Facebook and other online groups are thriving. There's a community for almost every type of car. People are importing and daily driving all sorts of weird foreign market cars now that cool stuff is hitting the 25yo mark. The BMW scene is booming. The VW scene is as big as it has ever been. There are kinds making 500hp cars in their driveways. There are broccoli-haired high school kids squatting their trucks. Camrys with full wraps and body kits. Gymkhana is a recent thing. (RIP KB!) Half of every Jeep and truck I is are modified or customized. There's a girl I follow on Instagram that spent the Christmas holiday fixing her brother's R32 GTR.

Instagram is huge, Youtube is huge, print has been drying for a decade or more.

Automotive enthusiasm is very much alive. It just isn't what (most of you) are used to. Just because something isn't how it used to be doesn't mean it ceased to exist.

I would say that less people DIY their own maintenance, but cars need less maintenance now.

 

[SC Maintenance]

I have always wanted to attend a rally event. Maybe I will do so this year - seems there is one not too far from me in East TN - but there everywhere.

I had wanted to go to the Z1 motorsports nationals - its just a friendly Nissan thing in Atlanta. I couldn't go this year due to a conflict. Maybe I will try next year.

American Rally Association 2024 Regional Calendars Released

Speedway, Ind. ~ American Rally Association announces 21 events on full schedule for 2024. The ARA Regional Championships are split into three regions: East, Central and West. The regional titles will be contested over all 21 events, including four stand-alone Super Regionals and nine basic...

www.americanrallyassociation.org

 

[fdcg27]

Someone on here, and no i don't recall who, called the Honda Fit a penalty box. Having driven Fits ( plural ) thousands of kms, and been a passenger in them thousands more, what the Fit really does is engage the driver. Handling, road feedback, rowing through the gears, and fun to drive factor that should have it priced 10 times higher. Because it doesn't have dull steering, cvt, and no road feel, they call it harsh. I guess the large volume knob, and easy to decipher HVAC controls are also bad to some.

I've spent some miles driving a Fit and I found it pretty entertaining as well as pretty comfortable.
One of the things we're missing these days are slick little entry-level cars with rev-happy little engines and slick five speed gearboxes.
I'm thinking of old Civics, Tercels, Corollas and even VWs. These cars were not quick by current standards but they were fun to drive on a daily basis. It was a joy to run them through the gears with the occasional redline shift, and many could carve corners in an entertaining way, especially the Civics and VWs. Fuel economy wasn't bad either. They were also offered in a variety of attractive and often innovative shapes. I'm thinking especially of the old tall-boy wagons, which were so practical and useful.

 

[eljefino]

The other issue is that there has been a substantial narrowing of the performance and reliability gap.

IMO modern cars are frustrating in their reliability.

Wife's prius, 90k, doesn't burn a drop of oil. Am thankful for that. But a phantom got into the software keeping her from having heat. HEAT! If one shut the car off and waited two minutes, for the buzz-click under the dash, something rebooted and then heat returned. I followed the codes, changed an actuator, still did it. Changed the "brain", still did it. Then, knock on wood, it seems to have stopped.

This is way, way less satisfying than having a leaking water pump, changing it, filling the radiator, warming it up, and confirming that it doesn't leak anymore. It also compels the owner or driver to wonder WHY they elected to have a computer run something that had manual operation for 100 years. I'm not against change, I'm against change for stoopid reasons.

The hard parts seem reliable enough... piston rings, ball joints. That makes it even more aggravating that ancillary systems are garbage-- you can imagine the stripped, base model of 30 years ago not having these issues. Maybe it's a planned obsolescence thing.

And this is on one of the more reliable brands. I wouldn't want to deal with BMW or Mercedes' wiring network or software driven whatevers just to have the privlege of driving a better sorted out chassis.

 

[Number_35]

One more data point - a few years ago our local broadsheet discontinued its automotive section.

Besides the fluff, it had a good "Ask the Mechanic" column, some good retro reviews, and a occasional story about new technology.

For the last few years it appears the paper has been moving toward being more an instrument of "social justice" than a news source. I suspect the target audience is not interested in cars.