Subaru AWD

[Al]

Pretty much decided to get a Subaru Forrester in the very near future. I am having difficulty in deciding between Auto and Manual.

The manual is a very simple system that uses a center differential with viscous clutches that shifts load from the front or rear wheels. Normally it is a 50/50 split. In the auto 90% of the torque normally is directed to the front and the computer shifts the output as required.

My question..what is the reliability/repair frequency for the auto vs the manual. Also is there any limited slip between the right and left wheels.?

 

[Brogy]

My dads 2003 outback auto is doing fine, just keep an eye on the fluid level, he has to top off every so often. 25,000 miles most <1 mile.

 

[Chris142]

I'd disreguard alot of the trans and axle problems you hear about. Lotta folks/kids are racing them and sidestepping the clutch @ 6000 rpm.

 

[sprintman]

Al I have a 2000 Outback 2.5 manual. I've personally had 26 vehicles and the Sube is better than the rest put together. Sube wins the annual quality survey here every year. But a qualifier we have Japanese built vehicles. the amount of problems compared to U.S built are minimal Reading all the Sube forums.

 

[Titan]

I've had both auto and manual Subarus. If you don't abuse the manual, its fine. Some WRX thrashers are reporting second gear problems, but, it could easily be driver error contributing to that...just look at the power of that engine, as well as the average WRX driver...that combo has "trouble" written all over it! B~)

IF you cruise down the highway, the Manual did give me better mpg, by over 10%, even though the EPA estimate was essentially the same. Automatics are more efficient than they used to be, but, the manuals still give better mpg, at least, they do the way I drive them, city or hwy, I always get better mpg with a manual.

I currently have a Forester and a Legacy, both auto's. Combined 72000 miles in the past 1.5 years, zero trouble. No rattles. Excellent cars thus far. Forester gets just under 30 mpg highway, Legacy gets just over 30 mpg, but, I Forester is going just under 75 mph, the Legacy just over 75 mph. Oh, the Forester is geared a little lower...so, it has much better quickness around town, in case that matters. You may already know the crash ratings are 5 star.

Solid cars. Solid design.

 

[meep]

older outback ATs could exhibit awd shudder in tight turns. sometimes dealer could remedy, sometimes not. our 5spd awd was terrific...completely mechanical design with no electronics. consistent, reliable, great handling car.

(97 2.2L legacy)

 

[rjundi]

The LSD is usually on the rear set of wheels only but depends on the specific Forester model your interested in. I believe the base models do without this while turbo models include this.

I own to two manual tranny turbo Subaru wagons and prefer the simplicity.

My family own about 10 Subaru's(New England car

) with AWD. Half auto and none with any AWD problems and they keep till around 200k miles.

 

[Merkurwwu]

I was just under the sister-in-laws 2005 Legacy GT this weekend diagnosing a clunking in the front end. The control arm bushings are totally shot at 65k miles.

I got a call from her yesterday and Subaru is not honoring thier own extended warranty to fix the problem. They want $800 to fix it, saying the car has been abused- which is simply not true. Its a tool for business, you don't abuse your tools...

I've never seen a POWERFUL AWD car that wasn't hard on the front bushings or ball joints. With her accelerated durability testing on her car, I bet this problem will start coming up alot in the future with these latest generation Subarus. The Forrester, with most suspension travel and softer shocks could be better... Or worse...

Her car in particular has always had alot of steering wheel shudder. It's an automatic. My neighbors with thier Outback with a manual don't complain about that particular problem.

If you don't go for the XT Forrester, maybe you won't have front end trouble but with the turbo-engine'd models, I bet its going to start coming up more often...

 

[rjundi]

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I was just under the sister-in-laws 2005 Legacy GT this weekend diagnosing a clunking in the front end. The control arm bushings are totally shot at 65k miles.

I got a call from her yesterday and Subaru is not honoring thier own extended warranty to fix the problem. They want $800 to fix it, saying the car has been abused- which is simply not true. Its a tool for business, you don't abuse your tools...

I've never seen a POWERFUL AWD car that wasn't hard on the front bushings or ball joints. With her accelerated durability testing on her car, I bet this problem will start coming up alot in the future with these latest generation Subarus. The Forrester, with most suspension travel and softer shocks could be better... Or worse...

Her car in particular has always had alot of steering wheel shudder. It's an automatic. My neighbors with thier Outback with a manual don't complain about that particular problem.

If you don't go for the XT Forrester, maybe you won't have front end trouble but with the turbo-engine'd models, I bet its going to start coming up more often...

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A few things..

Your sister's car is a single car out there not all of them.

Your turbo comment is pulled out the air in reference. The Subaru WRX/STI do not have this as a common issue whatsoever and are turbo cars and sold in great numbers and many above 100k with few issues. Furthermore the Impreza/WRX/STI(2002-2007) and Forester(previous - 2008) all share the same platform so the comment trying to relate the 2005+ Legacy to a Forester is not applicable. Legacy uses a completely different platform from the Forester.

 

[Bill in Utah]

Al,

I went to the dealership to buy a manual forester and ended up taking home a Outback Auto.

We liked the forester but loved the auto-stick on the Outback. Once I did the math with both auto vs manual vs forester vs outback and drove each of the cars (both stick and auto of both outback and forester) be liked the total package of the Outback.

And it was about $200 cheaper than the Forester (auto vs auto) with the Outback having better ride, more room and better transmission.

Close to 10k on it and so far, very happy with the car. The Auto-stick is the ONLY way I'd have a automatic trans (love being able to keep it in a gear or shift it myself) and love how Subaru puts a drain plug in EVERYTHING. Also love their spin on transmission filter (same size and type as the engine)

Just let the engine cool way down before getting on the oil filter.

Take care, bill

 

[Merkurwwu]

[quote
A few things..

Your sister's car is a single car out there not all of them.

Your turbo comment is pulled out the air in reference. The Subaru WRX/STI do not have this as a common issue whatsoever and are turbo cars and sold in great numbers and many above 100k with few issues. Furthermore the Impreza/WRX/STI(2002-2007) and Forester(previous - 2008) all share the same platform so the comment trying to relate the 2005+ Legacy to a Forester is not applicable. Legacy uses a completely different platform from the Forester.

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I hear what you're saying (I alalways thought the Forester and the Legacy shared a platform, not the Forester and the Impreza). However, I'm willing to bet that those cars with over 100k miles, being only 5 years old, are not seeing the constant hard city stop-and-start miles that a car used for real estate is going to see.

Also, the sister-in-law's car's design has not been around all that long and I'm sure few of them have accumulated as many hard miles as this car. Yes this is ONLY one car, but in today's manufacturing world, if one car has this problem, many, MANY others are going to have this problem. We'll see when most of these turbo cars get to 60k normal miles in a few years who is right. Since Subaru is stonewalling so hard on this, and with Alex being such a good customer over the years buying another car every three years, I'm willing to bet *I* am...

And if you think my engine comment was out of line, talk to just about any older Audi, Passat, late 80's early 90's 325iX owner, etc. I'm a Volvo fan and know of a couple early AWD versions with ball joint/control arm issues- one I ride to work in for a carpool every third week...

If nothing else its a sign of Subie's customer service not wanting to deal with this...

 

[rjundi]

Talk to anyone in the Subaru community about ball joints/control arms and its not a known issue. There are others but that one no. Subaru has significantly more AWD vehicles sold than VW, Audi, Volvo, and BMW combined in the US.

 

[Master ACiD]

my dads got 180K on a lagacy outback, original suspention. no control arm or balljoint issues.

 

[Kernel Potter]

I have a friend with a 2005 WRX STI. He doesn't beat on it but he will drive it at times as what would be intended for a car like this. At about 25,000 miles he started getting the classic rear pinion wear/out of spec sounds. I went and tested some things out with him and it almost pointed for certain with something in the ring and pinion.

He started going to the dealer and they'd chase him away, so to speak. After about 3 or 4 trips to the dealer by 4x,xxx miles and a absolutely horrible sounding metallic rap when he starts off - they still turn him away. One of the visits I asked him about, they said he was the 3rd person that came in that day for that problem. No lie

Now, I'm sure the dealer would gladly do the work for the $$ if they knew Subaru would compensate them. So between having a car built in Japan that most obviously has a quality control problem on a major component and Subaru simply not backing up their products; I'd take Subaru off my list.

 

[Al]

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Al,

I went to the dealership to buy a manual forester and ended up taking home a Outback Auto.

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Your post was about 6 hours too late.

I got the Auto Forrester 2.5X. Only options were Tailpipe Cover, and Auto dimmer/compass. I pick it up tomorrow. Its the Topaz Gold. Daughter bought the same thing about 3 weeks ago (Silver)

Thanks again.
Al

 

[rjundi]

Congrats on your Subie purchase. Enjoy your new car.

 

[Bill in Utah]

Photos Al!

Show it off.

Congrads on the new car.

What oil are you going to run?

I've done 2 UOAs so far on my Outback with great results I think.

Take care, bill

 

[Al]

Quote:

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Photos Al!

What oil are you going to run?

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O.K....give me a bit.

I am not sure what oil I will use Bill. Do you keep that stupid plastic panel over the plug and filter? I see that the longer filter will be pretty close to the exhaust. I did buy 2 Subie filters. I noticed they tell you in the manual that any auto tranny oil except Subaru will cause problems on the tranny.

 

[Bill in Utah]

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Quote:

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Photos Al!

What oil are you going to run?

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O.K....give me a bit.

I am not sure what oil I will use Bill. Do you keep that stupid plastic panel over the plug and filter? I see that the longer filter will be pretty close to the exhaust. I did buy 2 Subie filters. I noticed they tell you in the manual that any auto tranny oil except Subaru will cause problems on the tranny.

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Mine is a basic so nothing under the engine. So the fumoto and filter is clear.




(if I had the "skid pan" it would be off)

I have a longer filter on it right now and its close to the header. The Supertech 6607 is a better fit over the Pureone/purolator.

I have not seen a wix to see how long they are. The 7317 WILL get too close to the headers. (less than 1/4 inch)

I will say that my subaru is REAL picky with fuel. Pings below 40 mph with same brand of fuel. So I'm not sure if its the age of the fuel or what. But its pinging is the norm.

Take care, bill

 

[Al]

This is mine. Not really a skid pan..its all plastic. The cleaner piece with the arrow on it has 7 plastic quick removal screws that are removed and allow the thing to pivot out of the way. PITA. For now I'll leave it there. Probably improves gas mileage.

BTW mine is the bottom line version. Auto Tranny, dimming mirror/electronic compass (which is pretty neat), and splash guards.