PUREONE PL14610 CUT OPEN -- PICTURES

[ZeeOSix]

Originally Posted By: kender
Sorry, I don't have your "know-It-All" wisdom. And my untrained eyes can't conclude for sure everything you can from one off angle pic.


I'm not going by the photo like you are ... I'm going from experience. Since you can't "conclude" anything from the photo (your position), then I guess it's a moot point.

 

[sunfire]

Originally Posted By: barlowc
Yeah, I don't know what to say to the doubters. As I write this, I'm looking at the leaf spring. It is not deformed in any way, shape, or form. Rather it's perfect in every way, shape, and form.


Take my challenge and push down on the leaf spring bypass/relief valve. Don't just look at it. Visually the leaf spring looks like it allows the bypass valve to open and close.

I'm not saying your filter looks bad. But I'm trying to prove to you that Purolator's bypass is a scam. It doesn't even open.

 

[kender]

I'm not trying to "conclude" anything. It's just an observation based on an off angle pic. What don't you get? I'm not saying it's open, or closed.

 

[ZeeOSix]

Originally Posted By: sunfire
Originally Posted By: barlowc
Yeah, I don't know what to say to the doubters. As I write this, I'm looking at the leaf spring. It is not deformed in any way, shape, or form. Rather it's perfect in every way, shape, and form.


Take my challenge and push down on the leaf spring bypass/relief valve. Don't just look at it. Visually the leaf spring looks like it allows the bypass valve to open and close.


The "leaf spring" has nothing to do with the bypass valve. Cut one open to get familiar with how they are designed and work. The bypass valve spring is that flat spiral looking thing that is riveted to a flat valve that seals against a lip formed around the hole in the center of the end cap.

And yes, the bypass valve opens when you press down on that center rivet with your finger.

 

[ZeeOSix]

Originally Posted By: kender
I'm not trying to "conclude" anything. It's just an observation based on an off angle pic. What don't you get? I'm not saying it's open, or closed.


Yeah, as you and I have agreed ... you can't conclude anything from the photo, so your comment/observation/inputs are a moot point.

I'll bet it's not open from seeing these things first hand. The only way it could be "stuck open" is if that flat spiral shaped spring deformed permanently, and that won't happen because it's made out of spring steel.

 

[kender]

Could it happen under normal conditions? probably not. When I cut one open I took a screwdriver and pushed on it. It took some force to open it. Then I pushed harder. I distorted the spring and it did not close all the way. I'm not saying that's the case here. Or that this could happen while on an engine. It's just an "observation" LOL
BTW, I'll still use them.

 

[sunfire]

Originally Posted By: ZeeOSix
The "leaf spring" has nothing to do with the bypass valve. Cut one open to get familiar with how they are designed and work. The bypass valve spring is that flat spiral looking thing that is riveted to a flat valve that seals against a lip formed around the hole in the center of the end cap.

And yes, the bypass valve opens when you press down on that center rivet with your finger.


When I say leaf spring I am referring to the black "flat spiral looking thing".

I'm going to call your bluff... I don't think you've ever pushed down on the center rivet of a Purolator. Otherwise you'd know exactly what I'm talking about.

I have cut open the old blue P1 and old Puro Prem Plus.

 

[ZeeOSix]

Originally Posted By: sunfire
Originally Posted By: ZeeOSix
The "leaf spring" has nothing to do with the bypass valve. Cut one open to get familiar with how they are designed and work. The bypass valve spring is that flat spiral looking thing that is riveted to a flat valve that seals against a lip formed around the hole in the center of the end cap.

And yes, the bypass valve opens when you press down on that center rivet with your finger.


When I say leaf spring I am referring to the black "flat spiral looking thing".

I'm going to call your bluff... I don't think you've ever pushed down on the center rivet of a Purolator. Otherwise you'd know exactly what I'm talking about.

... "calling my bluff"; whatever - yeah, I've never cut open a Purolator with this bypass design.

Listen, there is another metal piece in the filter that most people would refer to as the "leaf spring". I think I made it pretty clear what I was calling what.

 

[ZeeOSix]

Originally Posted By: kender
Could it happen under normal conditions? probably not. When I cut one open I took a screwdriver and pushed on it. It took some force to open it. Then I pushed harder. I distorted the spring and it did not close all the way.


So how far open did you force it? I doubt it opens any more than 1 millimeter when in real use. A 1 mm gap around that large hole will flow a lot of oil and keep the PSID at the bypass level.

Do you guys think Purolator designed this bypass valve and never tested it? Just wiped it out on paper and said "let's manufacture this thing ... it looks like from our visual observation that it will work fine".

 

[kender]

Yep, you're right again. Everything made on a high speed, production line always works just fine. Never any defects. Again, not saying that's the case here.

 

[sunfire]

Originally Posted By: ZeeOSix
Originally Posted By: sunfire
Originally Posted By: ZeeOSix
The "leaf spring" has nothing to do with the bypass valve. Cut one open to get familiar with how they are designed and work. The bypass valve spring is that flat spiral looking thing that is riveted to a flat valve that seals against a lip formed around the hole in the center of the end cap.

And yes, the bypass valve opens when you press down on that center rivet with your finger.


When I say leaf spring I am referring to the black "flat spiral looking thing".

I'm going to call your bluff... I don't think you've ever pushed down on the center rivet of a Purolator. Otherwise you'd know exactly what I'm talking about.

... "calling my bluff"; whatever - yeah, I've never cut open a Purolator with this bypass design.

Listen, there is another metal piece in the filter that most people would refer to as the "leaf spring". I think I made it pretty clear what I was calling what.


I didn't say you never cut open a Purolator... I said you never tested the bypass by pressing down on it. As I have here... pushing hard with a screwdriver on a Puro Prem Plus and a Bosch. The bypass valve does not move not even 1 mm. It's as good as permanently sealed.

 

[ZeeOSix]

Originally Posted By: sunfire
I didn't say you never cut open a Purolator... I said you never tested the bypass by pressing down on it.


Well I have pushed down on this style of bypass valve and it moved just fine for me.

Originally Posted By: sunfire
As I have here... pushing hard with a screwdriver on a Puro Prem Plus and a Bosch. The bypass valve does not move not even 1 mm. It's as good as permanently sealed.


It must have moved some distance with force applied. Did you record the force vs. the linear deflection of the bypass valve?

If I recall, that bypass valve disc is about 1/2" in diameter. If that's the case, then its area is A=(pi x D^2)/4 = 0.2 in^2. If the bypass setting was 14 psi, that means in order to make it start to move, it should take 0.2 x 14 = 2.8 lbs. 2.8 lbs doesn't seem like a lot, but it's hard to determine how hard you're pushing with a finger or hand.

It may be that it's designed to only move 1/2 mm (0.020") maximum. Like I said, it wouldn't take much opening distance with that diameter hole to flow quite a bit of oil and keep the PSID near the bypass setting. Only Purolator knows the exact design parameters ... but from what I'm seeing I'm give you my best "observations".

 

[ZeeOSix]

Originally Posted By: kender
Yep, you're right again. Everything made on a high speed, production line always works just fine. Never any defects. Again, not saying that's the case here.


I didn't elude to that ... but I did elude to the fact that you probably pushed it way beyond the distance it's designed to move, and therefore permanently damaged the spring. Just the very fact that they use a flat spring tells you that it's maximum design deflection is not much at all.

 

[sunfire]

There is no reason for me to post fraudulent information. Besides this can be easily verified by other members with a puro filter. I'm pushing down with at least 10-15 lbs concentrated on the tip of the screwdriver.

If the OP and a few other would take a few minutes to test the bypass. I might have a case.

 

[ZeeOSix]

Originally Posted By: sunfire
There is no reason for me to post fraudulent information. Besides this can be easily verified by other members with a puro filter. I'm pushing down with at least 10-15 lbs concentrated on the tip of the screwdriver.


Who said your observation was "fraudulent"?

But do you have recorded data from a scale verifying that's the case - 10 to 15 lbs is pretty hard to believe. And also instrumentation saying the bypass valve never moved at all?

You still have one of these around? What's the diameter of that flat bypass valve plate. The force is dependent on the area of the valve and the bypass setting.

Maybe the OP can measure the diameter of the bypass valve hole and let us know.

 

[ZeeOSix]

Originally Posted By: sunfire
There is no reason for me to post fraudulent information. Besides this can be easily verified by other members with a puro filter. I'm pushing down with at least 10-15 lbs concentrated on the tip of the screwdriver.


Well, I have a couple of new PL14610s here so I looked down the center tube and a rough measurement says the bypass valve is about 1" in diameter.

A 1" dia = 0.786 sq-in. If the bypass valve was set to open at 14 psi, then it will take 14 x .0786 = 11.0 lbs to make it move. Looks like the force you were guessing is right there in the ball park.

I'm betting it was moving some for you ... it's just hard to detect. I had the same issue, and had to look very closely to see its movement.

 

[webfors]

I've tested the bypass on several Purolators that I've cut open and they all opened. They DO require a good amount of pressure though.

ZeeOSix is right in that the bypass valve that opens is the whole 1" diameter metal plug that seals the bottom of the filter. It's possible that some are expecting just the center rivet to open which is not the case.

Does anyone want me to cut open a PL14612 that just came off my Subaru to prove they work just fine? I've been wanting a reason to cut it open

 

[barlowc]

OP update and clarification after further carefully examining the filter...

1) The silver leaf spring that sits in the dome of the filter is NOT deformed in any way, shape, or form.

2) The bypass is NOT stuck open.

3) The bypass DOES open and close as I would expect when you apply a little bit of force to the rivet on the bottom of the filter that you can see in the eight picture in the original post.

Just like the DENSO filter that I cut open back in April, the PureONE appears to be a well manufactured filter that had no problem holding up and performing during the 6,000 mile that it was used. Based on what I've seen with my own eyes, I will continue to use them on my vehicles without hesitation.

 

[kender]

Thank's for the update!!!

 

[wgtoys]

What a nicely made filter. I'm glad I just ordered fifteen more of them to cover various needs using Advance Auto's $5 sale and some coupon codes, which get my cost down to around $3.25 each. What a screaming bargain. The codes, etc. are posted on the deals section of BITOG.

Purolator's bypass design is actually very elegant. Look at home much less space it takes up in the can (basically none!) compared to the clumsy Wix bypass gadget which they stick in the can below the filter.