Oil Question

[mauric3]

Hi.. I've been lurking bitog for awhile and just decided to join in since i need some insights from the experts

My question would be regarding 0w20/30 , 5w20/30 and 10w20/30

From what ive read.. 0w flows better during the winter but would using 0w all year round be a good idea?

We have 2 cars.. an 8th gen civic r18 and 2009 4.0l town and country minivan..

the 8thgen r18 oil cap requires 5w20.. so would 0w20 be alright all year round or just winter or just stick with 5w20 all year round? i just did my oil change today and decided to try the amsoil signature series 0w20.. what do you guys think?

On our minivan the oil cap requires 10w30... but i decided to try the amsoil signature series 0w30 today as well.. was it the right move or i should have stick with 10w30 since its the recommended oil on the oil cap?

Planning to run both of the amsoil signature series for around 10k kms before doing my next oil change.. i know amsoil has the 25k miles/15kmiles intervals but i think that might be too long and id rather be safe.. so i think 10k kms wouldn't be a bad idea for an oil change interval with the amsoil signature series?

I live in BC Canada ...

Hope to get some good advice ...

Thanks a lot!

 

[Brent_G]

This of it this way. All oil at is way to thick at startup. So thats where the 0w comes in, and at temp, its still a xx, I dont see a reason not to run a 0 all year, oils dont shear like they use to!

 

[chubbs1]

WOW! Sounds like you have a very good plan and grasp about the whole xxWxx thing. Amsoil 0w20 and 0w30 would be absolutely perfect fits for those vehicles year round no bones about it. If you have the money to afford Amsoil that is a really safe bet. I also think they have a lower cost XL 0w20 now and you could run either XL 5w30 or stick to the 0w30...doesn't matter a bit in your situation.
10w30 is actually kind of obsolete and I can't really think of a situation off of the top of my head where you would need it in a PCMO (calling for 10w30) built in the last 15 years (I am sure someone else will but not in your case). Especially in BC or anywhere up north for that matter.

Great plan, go in peace jedi...lol


BTW I used to live in White Rock BC not too far from Richmond. I love it up there, just not this time of year I get to hit the beach tomorrow.

 

[mauric3]

Thanks for the input! Hope to hear more from others...

@Brent_G and chubbs1 you guys are saying that 0w would be alright to use all year round e.. some people said that 0w is like water... so i guess its too liquid? is that supposed to be bad? One of the guys at at shop said that if i have 0w on my car.. i shouldnt be driving up north since its way colder there.. i think he was saying that the oil will freeze when its super super cold? Is this true?

Well apparently, our minivan which has the 4.0L engine has 10w30 on the oil cap.. but on the newer 3.6 pentastar engine i think dodge/chrysler made it to 5w30...

White Rock is awesome like you said... Thats where my family and i go to if we want to go to walmart since SouthSurrey/WhiteRock has a pretty big and nice walmart

its really getting cold here in BC

Amsoil is not that expensive i think? Its like $8 if you are a PC and its not like im going to be changing oil every 2-3months.. i think if it would be at least 6-7months .. depends on how much driving my family and i do... but the idea is to run it at around 9-10k kms ....

Does thinner oil protect the engine more or wears the engine more? Cause a friend of mine said that 0w might give more engine wear ? The van requires 10w30 and was wondering if going 2 notches down to 0w30 is just safe..since others says going 1 notch down is ok.. not sure about 2 notches down from the oem recommendation... i just dont want to have problems in the long run for both cars...

 

[Garak]

Originally Posted By: mauric3
@Brent_G and chubbs1 you guys are saying that 0w would be alright to use all year round e.. some people said that 0w is like water... so i guess its too liquid? is that supposed to be bad? One of the guys at at shop said that if i have 0w on my car.. i shouldnt be driving up north since its way colder there.. i think he was saying that the oil will freeze when its super super cold? Is this true?


No, it's not like water. No, it's not too liquid, and no, it won't freeze. In fact, it's advantages shine more the colder the climate is. I've heard shops [falsely] claim that 0w-XX oils are too thin at high temperatures. This is the first time I've heard anyone claim they're inappropriate for colder temperatures. That is, after all, what they were designed for.

Check out the Petro-Canada site for my favourite example. At operating temperatures, their 0w-30 synthetic is actually thicker than their 5w-30 synthetic. To be honest, I'm surprised that Chrysler bothered specifying a 10w-30 in such a recent vehicle. I'm a bit on the thick/conventional side of the oil spectrum, but I avoid 10w-30 unless there's an overriding reason to do so (like my signature truck, which had a recent rebuild and the GSGB 10w-30 was $9.88 for five litres, great for a short OCI or two after a rebuild - even that should be getting at least a 5w-xx all year).

 

[mauric3]

Originally Posted By: Garak
Originally Posted By: mauric3
@Brent_G and chubbs1 you guys are saying that 0w would be alright to use all year round e.. some people said that 0w is like water... so i guess its too liquid? is that supposed to be bad? One of the guys at at shop said that if i have 0w on my car.. i shouldnt be driving up north since its way colder there.. i think he was saying that the oil will freeze when its super super cold? Is this true?


No, it's not like water. No, it's not too liquid, and no, it won't freeze. In fact, it's advantages shine more the colder the climate is. I've heard shops [falsely] claim that 0w-XX oils are too thin at high temperatures. This is the first time I've heard anyone claim they're inappropriate for colder temperatures. That is, after all, what they were designed for.

Check out the Petro-Canada site for my favourite example. At operating temperatures, their 0w-30 synthetic is actually thicker than their 5w-30 synthetic. To be honest, I'm surprised that Chrysler bothered specifying a 10w-30 in such a recent vehicle. I'm a bit on the thick/conventional side of the oil spectrum, but I avoid 10w-30 unless there's an overriding reason to do so (like my signature truck, which had a recent rebuild and the GSGB 10w-30 was $9.88 for five litres, great for a short OCI or two after a rebuild - even that should be getting at least a 5w-xx all year).


Thanks for the input! So would u say that it will be safe running 0w20 on my r18 and 0w30 on my town and country minivan all year round even during summer?

 

[Brent_G]

Wont hurt a thing!

 

[Garak]

Originally Posted By: mauric3
Thanks for the input! So would u say that it will be safe running 0w20 on my r18 and 0w30 on my town and country minivan all year round even during summer?


Personally, I'd stick with what is specified (within reason of course). What was the R18 speced for? If it's 5w-20, I'd use 0w-20 with no concerns whatsoever. With the Town and Country, which you noted is speced for 10w-30, I'd see no problems going down to the 0w-30. The only possible concerns are warranty and manual wording, and that can be rather hypothetical.

10w-30 is a fine oil and I've used many hundreds of bottles of QS conventional 10w-30. However, it's 2011, not 1985 anymore. Even for my vehicles that allowed it or specified it, I find there are better choices, even among conventional oils. For the Audi, the 10w-30 is too thick in the cold and too thin at operating temperatures, which means it's not very helpful at all. In my old truck, 5w-30 is far better than 10w-30, considering it's primarily used in the winter; there's nothing wrong with 5w-30 in it in the summer, either.

I think the PC 0w-30 is a fine oil. Perhaps when my warranty expires and if I choose to extend OCIs, I may give it a try.

 

[mauric3]

So Brent_G and Garak .. you two are saying that it would be alright for me to use 0w20 for the honda civic r18 and 0w30 for the minivan all year round? Would it actually be bad for the engine if i go down to 0w20/30? Cause u said something about warranty... would dealership even now that that you used the wrong oil unless you specifically told them that you were using this kind of oil ?

 

[Garak]

Originally Posted By: mauric3
So Brent_G and Garak .. you two are saying that it would be alright for me to use 0w20 for the honda civic r18 and 0w30 for the minivan all year round? Would it actually be bad for the engine if i go down to 0w20/30? Cause u said something about warranty... would dealership even now that that you used the wrong oil unless you specifically told them that you were using this kind of oil ?


With the Civic, you should be fine. Honda backspeced 0w-20 for Civics back to 2001. Here is a chart that I've found on the websites of several Honda dealers. The GX is the only exception, and I'm assuming your R18 isn't a GX. Therefore, 0w-20 is fully acceptable for your Honda under warranty.

For the Town and Country, it depends on what the manual indicates. If 10w-30 is only recommended, or they offer other viscosity choices, you should be good to go. If they absolutely require 10w-30 under all conditions, which is doubtful, then there might be a problem.

As others have pointed out on this site, a 0w-20 exceeds all the requirements of a 5w-20, and a 0w-30 exceeds all the requirements of a 5w-30 and a 10w-30. It seems to be quite acceptable to Honda to use 0w-20. It shouldn't be an issue with Chrysler, either. Aside from that, those viscosities would be absolutely acceptable (and even optimal) to use all year round.

For me, there's really only one thing stopping me from using 0w-30 in my G37. I'm not paying synthetic oil prices while constrained with warranty-driven OCIs of 3750 miles. As for how would a dealer know? If something went south in the engine and it were oil related and a warranty issue, they could ask for your receipts and service records.

For what it's worth, the Mobil 1's site oil selector chooses various 5w-30s and 0w-30 for your van:

Quote:
Also consider Mobil 1 0W-30 Advanced Fuel Economy, an advanced full synthetic motor oil, for vehicles where a SAE 0W-30, 5W-30 or 10W-30 oil is recommended. Mobil 1 0W-30 Advanced Fuel Economy is engineered to deliver outstanding engine protection and a potential 2% fuel economy improvement based on a comparison versus those grades most commonly used. Actual fuel economy improvement is dependent upon vehicle/engine type, outside temperature, driving conditions and your current engine oil viscosity.


Obviously, Exxon Mobil doesn't see a problem.

 

[mauric3]

Originally Posted By: Garak
Originally Posted By: mauric3
So Brent_G and Garak .. you two are saying that it would be alright for me to use 0w20 for the honda civic r18 and 0w30 for the minivan all year round? Would it actually be bad for the engine if i go down to 0w20/30? Cause u said something about warranty... would dealership even now that that you used the wrong oil unless you specifically told them that you were using this kind of oil ?


With the Civic, you should be fine. Honda backspeced 0w-20 for Civics back to 2001. Here is a chart that I've found on the websites of several Honda dealers. The GX is the only exception, and I'm assuming your R18 isn't a GX. Therefore, 0w-20 is fully acceptable for your Honda under warranty.

For the Town and Country, it depends on what the manual indicates. If 10w-30 is only recommended, or they offer other viscosity choices, you should be good to go. If they absolutely require 10w-30 under all conditions, which is doubtful, then there might be a problem.

As others have pointed out on this site, a 0w-20 exceeds all the requirements of a 5w-20, and a 0w-30 exceeds all the requirements of a 5w-30 and a 10w-30. It seems to be quite acceptable to Honda to use 0w-20. It shouldn't be an issue with Chrysler, either. Aside from that, those viscosities would be absolutely acceptable (and even optimal) to use all year round.

For me, there's really only one thing stopping me from using 0w-30 in my G37. I'm not paying synthetic oil prices while constrained with warranty-driven OCIs of 3750 miles. As for how would a dealer know? If something went south in the engine and it were oil related and a warranty issue, they could ask for your receipts and service records.

For what it's worth, the Mobil 1's site oil selector chooses various 5w-30s and 0w-30 for your van:

Quote:
Also consider Mobil 1 0W-30 Advanced Fuel Economy, an advanced full synthetic motor oil, for vehicles where a SAE 0W-30, 5W-30 or 10W-30 oil is recommended. Mobil 1 0W-30 Advanced Fuel Economy is engineered to deliver outstanding engine protection and a potential 2% fuel economy improvement based on a comparison versus those grades most commonly used. Actual fuel economy improvement is dependent upon vehicle/engine type, outside temperature, driving conditions and your current engine oil viscosity.


Obviously, Exxon Mobil doesn't see a problem.


Thanks!

i guess i can run 0w20 all year round for the civic then.. when you say exceeds all requiremts.. do you mean that the 0w20/30 is the best oil to use when compared to 5w and 10w?

Would running the amsoil signature series 0w20/30 for 10k kms be alright ? Thats what im planning to do on my oil change interval..

 

[Garak]

Originally Posted By: mauric3
Thanks!

i guess i can run 0w20 all year round for the civic then.. when you say exceeds all requiremts.. do you mean that the 0w20/30 is the best oil to use when compared to 5w and 10w?

Would running the amsoil signature series 0w20/30 for 10k kms be alright ? Thats what im planning to do on my oil change interval..


Well, "best" is always up for debate. The 0w-XX grades tend to have better performance, particularly upon cold starts. They still maintain the needed thickness at hotter temperatures. Personally, I prefer conventional because of the cost. So, from that standpoint, conventional is "better" but there are lots of ways to define that word. The 0w-XX will definitely perform better in unaided starts on the coldest days of the year, and provide better "cold" protection at most temperatures, or that matter.

I'm not very familiar with the Amsoil line. Pablo would be able to provide you with better information on your 10,000 km OCI plan. Generally speaking, in a non-sludger without fuel dilution issues and outside of warranty (unless warranty OCIs happen to be long), 10,000 km should not be a problem on synthetic oil, particularly Amsoil. Heck, in the 1980s to 1990s I was running conventional for 10,000 km OCIs in the fleet. But, they were non-sludgers, fuel dilution didn't exist (LPG cars), and there were no cold starts.

 

[Patman]

I just posted a used oil analysis report from my R18 Civic running Toyota's 0w20 and the wear numbers were excellent! This interval was through the hot summer months too, so it proves this 0w20 can handle the heat very well, and I know it's going to handle the winter very well. So it's easily an oil that can be used all year round!

 

[Clevy]

Originally Posted By: mauric3
Originally Posted By: Garak
Originally Posted By: mauric3
So Brent_G and Garak .. you two are saying that it would be alright for me to use 0w20 for the honda civic r18 and 0w30 for the minivan all year round? Would it actually be bad for the engine if i go down to 0w20/30? Cause u said something about warranty... would dealership even now that that you used the wrong oil unless you specifically told them that you were using this kind of oil ?


With the Civic, you should be fine. Honda backspeced 0w-20 for Civics back to 2001. Here is a chart that I've found on the websites of several Honda dealers. The GX is the only
exception, and I'm assuming your R18 isn't a GX. Therefore, 0w-20 is fully acceptable for your Honda under warranty.

For the Town and Country, it depends on what the manual indicates. If 10w-30 is only recommended, or they offer other viscosity choices, you should be good to go. If they absolutely require 10w-30 under all conditions, which is doubtful, then there might be a
problem.

As others have pointed out on this site, a 0w-20 exceeds all the requirements of a 5w-20, and a 0w-30 exceeds all the requirements of a 5w-30 and a 10w-30. It seems to be quite acceptable to Honda to use 0w-20. It shouldn't be an issue with Chrysler, either. Aside from that, those viscosities would be absolutely acceptable (and even optimal) to use all year round

For me, there's really only one thing stopping me from using 0w-30 in my G37. I'm not paying synthetic oil prices while constrained with warranty-driven OCIs of 3750 miles. As for how would a dealer know? If something went south in the engine and it were oil related and a warranty issue, they could ask for your receipts and service records.

For what it's worth, the Mobil 1's site oil selector chooses various 5w-30s and 0w-30
for your van:

Quote:
Also consider Mobil 1 0W-30 Advanced Fuel Economy, an advanced full synthetic motor oil, for vehicles where a SAE 0W-30, 5W-30 or 10W-30 oil is recommended. Mobil 1 0W-30 Advanced Fuel Economy is engineered to deliver outstanding engine protection and a potential 2% fuel economy improvement based on a comparison versus those grades most commonly used. Actual fuel economy improvement is dependent upon vehicle/engine type, outside temperature, driving
conditions and your current engine oil viscosity.


Obviously, Exxon Mobil doesn't see a problem.


Thanks!

i guess i can run 0w20 all year round for the civic then.. when you say exceeds all requiremts.. do you mean that the 0w20/30 is the best oil to use when compared to 5w and 10w?

Would running the amsoil signature series 0w20/30 for 10k kms be alright ? Thats what im planning to do on my oil change interval..


Running amsoil SSO for 10000 kms is only wasting your money. It will go the full 25000 but change the filter at 12500. If it worries you take a small sample at 7500 kms and send it in for a used oil analysis. They will tell you how much life is left in the oil and then you will know how long you can stretch out the oil change interval. Then you will also know for future reference how long you can go. No point throwing money away and it takes all tge guesswork out of it. The SSO line is a top of the line product. If you have a napa auto parts go get a bottle of liqui-moly Mo2s. Your mileage will increase. It's great stuff and the best 10 bucks you can spend. It will pay for itself in fuel savings. Do a search on molybdenum disulfide. Great stuff

 

[jmsjags]

since you are in canada i would definitely recommend the 0w's during the winter. they will definitely help you when it gets colder. for the summer if you can find a 0w for the same price as a 5w i would use it then too. if not, a 5w won't hurt anything. but the short answer is a 0w can do everything a 5w or 10w can, plus more! it is always beneficial to use a 0w if u can find one!

like someone else said, the 10w is obsolete. i would not use that.

 

[Quest]

LOL! Richmond, BeeCee never goes beyond -10C, speaking about cold?!!

5W is fine down to -30C, so no need to go fancy on 0W.

Q.

 

[Garak]

Originally Posted By: Clevy
Running amsoil SSO for 10000 kms is only wasting your money. It will go the full 25000 but change the filter at 12500. If it worries you take a small sample at 7500 kms and send it in for a used oil analysis.


That's why I suggested he ask Pablo. I have no idea which lines of Amsoil are best for longer OCIs. Thanks for the help with clearing that up.

 

[Garak]

Originally Posted By: Quest
LOL! Richmond, BeeCee never goes beyond -10C, speaking about cold?!!

5W is fine down to -30C, so no need to go fancy on 0W.


No, but if he's buying synthetic, there's no reason not to. People in BC should be relegated to straight weights anyhow, out of principle.

 

[mauric3]

Thanks for all the replies

From what ive been reading 0w should be able to perform the same as 5w and 10w but has a benefit for colder start .. so +1 to that...

I know amsoil has their SSO series up to 25k miles or 15k miles but im not too sure if that would be actually good even though there's people with used oil analysis that proves that it can go be used that long.. My thinking is 25k miles is too long even though its recommended by amsoil but id rather do oil change twice a year with the Signature series and have a more peace of mind in the long run rather than have some problems down the road...im not saying that changing oil once a year with the Signature series would cause any problem but id rather have a cleaner oil running on the engine so that i think the car would run better in the future....

Well.. 0w is still better than 5w during winter i think... When you look at the 9th gen honda civic r18(1.8L).. the oil cap requires 0w20 on their engine... i have an 8th gen and it requires 5w20.. so whats the difference between a 9th gen r18 and 8th gen r18.. i dont think theres a difference.. honda just wants to push better mileage from what ive been reading... Also, one of the previous post has the engine oil application chart from honda and it says that 0w20 is acceptable for 06 - 11 civics and 0w20 is also acceptable on other honda that has a 5w20 oil requirement too...

I have another question, since amsoil recommends 25k miles/once a year or 15k miles/once a year oil change.. so if you look at the oil at 10k kms.... would it look super dirty already ? Ive read most people that had oil analysis on the amsoil signature series normally have enough additives to run it longer than 10k kms.. so basically im just asking, even though the oil quality is dirty but there's still a good amount of life on the oil... then it would still be ok to use the oil? so its not how the oil looks but the actual life of the oil still has that determines if it can still be driven?

 

[Garak]

Originally Posted By: mauric3
so its not how the oil looks but the actual life of the oil still has that determines if it can still be driven?


Correct.