Need legal advice.
- Thread starter GreeCguy
- Start date
- Status
If you need legal advice, you really should go to a local attorney.
Having said that, my recommendation is to stay out of it. I don't know Florida law but I did work as a police officer for a few years between stints in the Army. In my jurisdiction, you would get the apology that it is a civil and not criminal matter. Because it is a civil matter.
They did not steal your son's property. He left it there. They could even make a strong claim that he abandoned it there. Heck, they could then give you a bill for $250 per month for storage and security fees. Payable upon receipt and before any property is returned. X-Box? Nope, he didn't leave one here. Do you have a signed inventory receipt proving he left it here? No? Good bye!
If he really wants it back, contact a local attorney and start paying those fees. Heck, if you go over there, things could escalate and someone could get shot in self defense. In this case, the home owner has the stronger hand because of the castle doctrine in Florida. All I can say is that if you came to my house to ask for stuff, I will tell you to get off my property and you had better do it real quick. Sorry, but your hand is really weak here.
Having said that, my recommendation is to stay out of it. I don't know Florida law but I did work as a police officer for a few years between stints in the Army. In my jurisdiction, you would get the apology that it is a civil and not criminal matter. Because it is a civil matter.
They did not steal your son's property. He left it there. They could even make a strong claim that he abandoned it there. Heck, they could then give you a bill for $250 per month for storage and security fees. Payable upon receipt and before any property is returned. X-Box? Nope, he didn't leave one here. Do you have a signed inventory receipt proving he left it here? No? Good bye!
If he really wants it back, contact a local attorney and start paying those fees. Heck, if you go over there, things could escalate and someone could get shot in self defense. In this case, the home owner has the stronger hand because of the castle doctrine in Florida. All I can say is that if you came to my house to ask for stuff, I will tell you to get off my property and you had better do it real quick. Sorry, but your hand is really weak here.
- Joined
- Aug 28, 2006
- Messages
- 2,326
Just give it up and move on.
Clothes? Fashion change. Clothes fade and become tattered and replaced. Let them keep them. The X can sniff his tighty whiteys when she misses him.
X-Box? Really? He's supposed to be a man and soldier. Read a book, go to school, the gym, charity work. Stupid video games rotting his mind. Who cares about a stupid video game? Tell the X to enjoy it.
The only real issue is the "strong box". Ask again for that. If they don't respond, give it up. You're obviously not dealing with rational, mature people. Really, who cares? What are they going to do? ID theft is blown out of proportion. Close/change the accounts, apply for a new birth certificate, etc. It's not hard to do and will have assistance in the military. Your son isn't Bill Gates, what are they going to get?
Move on.
Clothes? Fashion change. Clothes fade and become tattered and replaced. Let them keep them. The X can sniff his tighty whiteys when she misses him.
X-Box? Really? He's supposed to be a man and soldier. Read a book, go to school, the gym, charity work. Stupid video games rotting his mind. Who cares about a stupid video game? Tell the X to enjoy it.
The only real issue is the "strong box". Ask again for that. If they don't respond, give it up. You're obviously not dealing with rational, mature people. Really, who cares? What are they going to do? ID theft is blown out of proportion. Close/change the accounts, apply for a new birth certificate, etc. It's not hard to do and will have assistance in the military. Your son isn't Bill Gates, what are they going to get?
Move on.
- Joined
- Aug 28, 2006
- Messages
- 2,326
Amen! Learn, move on, and don't make that mistake again.
Originally Posted By: bvance554
Whatever happened to common decency? This family sucks. Moral of the story is its probably best that the relationship ended so that your son didn't end up spending a lifetime with such horrible people. I might sacrifice an xbox and bank documents to be done with that.
Originally Posted By: bvance554
Whatever happened to common decency? This family sucks. Moral of the story is its probably best that the relationship ended so that your son didn't end up spending a lifetime with such horrible people. I might sacrifice an xbox and bank documents to be done with that.
- Joined
- Aug 28, 2006
- Messages
- 2,326
Wait 'til he goes overseas and "falls in love" and brings her and eventually her family back to the land of the big PX. You should be spending your time talking about those things instead of dealing with irrational people over stuff that is tantamount to trash.
Living with a partner out of wedlock offers you no recourse in small claims court. Unless he has proof he paid rent or contributed to his living arrangements a judge won't have sympathy and he likely will never see his possessions again. For the record him giving them cash for rent or buying groceries he also used is not proof...if the other parties deny it he has no recourse.
I agree with the others that even though this may be a tough lesson for your son it will be a good lesson to learn for him now. Just be thankful they don't Have a child together and his life is still on track...clothes and an xbox can be replaced. You may definitely have luck in judge ordering they return his personal documents. Good luck.
I agree with the others that even though this may be a tough lesson for your son it will be a good lesson to learn for him now. Just be thankful they don't Have a child together and his life is still on track...clothes and an xbox can be replaced. You may definitely have luck in judge ordering they return his personal documents. Good luck.
Last edited:
Stay out of it. I could write a book on this subject. Been there done that. Not knowing your son and all. I suspect you have done much for him. Its time for him to man up. I am 69 years old with 2 grown kids....I have seen a lot.
Contact your son. Tell him you tried. Tell him its not worth all the legal ramifications. He needs to close accounts. Hopefully he has closed credit cards.
That will be $500 for my legal advice please. Your son can go to small claims court without a lawyer for 25 bucks.
Contact your son. Tell him you tried. Tell him its not worth all the legal ramifications. He needs to close accounts. Hopefully he has closed credit cards.
That will be $500 for my legal advice please. Your son can go to small claims court without a lawyer for 25 bucks.
Last edited:
Originally Posted By: spackard
When you send the demand, send two copies, one "certified mail, return receipt", the other "first class". Some people won't sign the first one, but you can argue to the judge you've tried to contact the other party using both methods, and the first-class letter did not come back undeliverable.
Great information, an attorney told me the same thing. People typically refuse to sign anything especially in situations like this. I would also inform them via text about the letter, and save the text. It would be real hard to weasel out of all of that should it end up in court.
Honestly if it is just a matter of closing all his accounts, and chalking it up to one of life's lessons that might be the easiest thing and smartest thing to do.
When you send the demand, send two copies, one "certified mail, return receipt", the other "first class". Some people won't sign the first one, but you can argue to the judge you've tried to contact the other party using both methods, and the first-class letter did not come back undeliverable.
Great information, an attorney told me the same thing. People typically refuse to sign anything especially in situations like this. I would also inform them via text about the letter, and save the text. It would be real hard to weasel out of all of that should it end up in court.
Honestly if it is just a matter of closing all his accounts, and chalking it up to one of life's lessons that might be the easiest thing and smartest thing to do.
Wow! Great, great, great advice from everybody - thank you all for wisdom and input.
Just returned from a visit to local Police department. Here's what they will do. They will go with me for a total of two "visits" for a total of ten minutes each. In other words, I schedule an appointment with the police. We meet at the parents house. I knock on the door. If they do not respond, the police will knock on the door. If no response in ten minutes, the police leave, (and, for reasons stated by others in this thread, they told me when they leave, I should leave). At another time, I schedule another appointment with the police and the same thing happens.
If I return a third time without the police, then the parents or ex can call the police and request I be escorted off the property. If this happens and I refuse to leave, I will be arrested for trespassing. If on the third visit, I am escorted off the property and then return a fourth time and the ex/parents call the police, I will be automatically arrested when the police arrive because I had been "warned" during the previous visit.
They suggested that if I'm going to go this route, I should call/text/email and send a registered letter informing the parents and ex that if they do not respond I am going to contact the police department, etc. They said sometimes that "scares" people into being cooperative.
But on the flip side of the coin, they also said if they know the system, (the very things pointed out on this thread, i.e. it's a civil matter, there's no proof of ownership of items, they can totally deny they have said items, etc.), then chances are a police visit will do nothing.
The officers I spoke with were very nice and sympathetic but said there really is very little they can do.
This has been a real learning experience for me.
Just returned from a visit to local Police department. Here's what they will do. They will go with me for a total of two "visits" for a total of ten minutes each. In other words, I schedule an appointment with the police. We meet at the parents house. I knock on the door. If they do not respond, the police will knock on the door. If no response in ten minutes, the police leave, (and, for reasons stated by others in this thread, they told me when they leave, I should leave). At another time, I schedule another appointment with the police and the same thing happens.
If I return a third time without the police, then the parents or ex can call the police and request I be escorted off the property. If this happens and I refuse to leave, I will be arrested for trespassing. If on the third visit, I am escorted off the property and then return a fourth time and the ex/parents call the police, I will be automatically arrested when the police arrive because I had been "warned" during the previous visit.
They suggested that if I'm going to go this route, I should call/text/email and send a registered letter informing the parents and ex that if they do not respond I am going to contact the police department, etc. They said sometimes that "scares" people into being cooperative.
But on the flip side of the coin, they also said if they know the system, (the very things pointed out on this thread, i.e. it's a civil matter, there's no proof of ownership of items, they can totally deny they have said items, etc.), then chances are a police visit will do nothing.
The officers I spoke with were very nice and sympathetic but said there really is very little they can do.
This has been a real learning experience for me.
Maybe you could try a bit of social justice too, make sure you take someone along with you to record the whole incident and put it out on the internet. Something like Fox investigative reports.
They will probably deny having any property belonging to your son. Just stay calm, what we don't do for our kids.
They will probably deny having any property belonging to your son. Just stay calm, what we don't do for our kids.
Originally Posted By: GreeCguy
Wow! Great, great, great advice from everybody - thank you all for wisdom and input.
Just returned from a visit to local Police department. Here's what they will do. They will go with me for a total of two "visits" for a total of ten minutes each. In other words, I schedule an appointment with the police. We meet at the parents house. I knock on the door. If they do not respond, the police will knock on the door. If no response in ten minutes, the police leave, (and, for reasons stated by others in this thread, they told me when they leave, I should leave). At another time, I schedule another appointment with the police and the same thing happens.
If I return a third time without the police, then the parents or ex can call the police and request I be escorted off the property. If this happens and I refuse to leave, I will be arrested for trespassing. If on the third visit, I am escorted off the property and then return a fourth time and the ex/parents call the police, I will be automatically arrested when the police arrive because I had been "warned" during the previous visit.
They suggested that if I'm going to go this route, I should call/text/email and send a registered letter informing the parents and ex that if they do not respond I am going to contact the police department, etc. They said sometimes that "scares" people into being cooperative.
But on the flip side of the coin, they also said if they know the system, (the very things pointed out on this thread, i.e. it's a civil matter, there's no proof of ownership of items, they can totally deny they have said items, etc.), then chances are a police visit will do nothing.
The officers I spoke with were very nice and sympathetic but said there really is very little they can do.
This has been a real learning experience for me.
That's good news, I would take them up on it, and follow what they said to the letter. Good luck!
Wow! Great, great, great advice from everybody - thank you all for wisdom and input.
Just returned from a visit to local Police department. Here's what they will do. They will go with me for a total of two "visits" for a total of ten minutes each. In other words, I schedule an appointment with the police. We meet at the parents house. I knock on the door. If they do not respond, the police will knock on the door. If no response in ten minutes, the police leave, (and, for reasons stated by others in this thread, they told me when they leave, I should leave). At another time, I schedule another appointment with the police and the same thing happens.
If I return a third time without the police, then the parents or ex can call the police and request I be escorted off the property. If this happens and I refuse to leave, I will be arrested for trespassing. If on the third visit, I am escorted off the property and then return a fourth time and the ex/parents call the police, I will be automatically arrested when the police arrive because I had been "warned" during the previous visit.
They suggested that if I'm going to go this route, I should call/text/email and send a registered letter informing the parents and ex that if they do not respond I am going to contact the police department, etc. They said sometimes that "scares" people into being cooperative.
But on the flip side of the coin, they also said if they know the system, (the very things pointed out on this thread, i.e. it's a civil matter, there's no proof of ownership of items, they can totally deny they have said items, etc.), then chances are a police visit will do nothing.
The officers I spoke with were very nice and sympathetic but said there really is very little they can do.
This has been a real learning experience for me.
That's good news, I would take them up on it, and follow what they said to the letter. Good luck!
Originally Posted By: philipp10
A box of tacks thrown in thier driveway...lol...just kidding
Screws and roofing nails work better.
LOL
A box of tacks thrown in thier driveway...lol...just kidding
Screws and roofing nails work better.
JHZR2
Staff member
Did he get mail there? Bills? Are any still on record at this address? Can you get usps to do a change of address then get those bills? At least then there is some proof he resided there.
At this point really nothing the cops can legally do.
Can't search her residence for missing items.
Can't search her residence for missing items.
Update: Yesterday, the ex girlfriend's father called my wife's cell phone while she was at work. He left no message, but she was able to tell from her calls received he had called.
As things have progressed, I believe this is some kind of ploy, since he knows she is a school teacher and does not have her phone on during the day while she is teaching. I think he was hoping she would answer it while she was in the classroom surrounded by little kids, (she teaches 3rd grade) and he would then "jack her up" and try to get her to loose her temper in a classroom setting and thus, get her in trouble.
I am further convinced of this as she returned his call twice yesterday evening and on her break today.
She tried calling this evening with no results, (Mom, Dad and Ex).
She also sent three text messages, (one to each, Mom, Dad and Ex), only to discover she has been "blocked" by all three.
On my end, I spoke with a lawyer today who informed me what they are doing constitutes identity theft since they have the "strong box" containing his personal information. He told me he would write a letter to them on office letterhead free of charge informing them if items are not returned, we are going to take legal action.
I told him what I would like to do is take it in steps. I will first write a letter and send it registered mail requesting return of my son's property or we will involve both the local police department and an attorney and that court proceedings would follow any refusal to return said property. If that doesn't work, I will visit the house with a police escort. If that doesn't work, I will have my new lawyer buddy draft and mail a letter.
Hopefully, they'll call and be decent and mature before we have to go through all this.
I know some will say this is entirely too much trouble for the return of my son's possessions. But it's gotten to the point it's a "principle" thing for me. They can either be adults about all this or they can be dragged through the system with me leading the way.
As they say, never a dull moment.
Thanks again guys for the wisdom and ideas - I'll let you know what happens.
As things have progressed, I believe this is some kind of ploy, since he knows she is a school teacher and does not have her phone on during the day while she is teaching. I think he was hoping she would answer it while she was in the classroom surrounded by little kids, (she teaches 3rd grade) and he would then "jack her up" and try to get her to loose her temper in a classroom setting and thus, get her in trouble.
I am further convinced of this as she returned his call twice yesterday evening and on her break today.
She tried calling this evening with no results, (Mom, Dad and Ex).
She also sent three text messages, (one to each, Mom, Dad and Ex), only to discover she has been "blocked" by all three.
On my end, I spoke with a lawyer today who informed me what they are doing constitutes identity theft since they have the "strong box" containing his personal information. He told me he would write a letter to them on office letterhead free of charge informing them if items are not returned, we are going to take legal action.
I told him what I would like to do is take it in steps. I will first write a letter and send it registered mail requesting return of my son's property or we will involve both the local police department and an attorney and that court proceedings would follow any refusal to return said property. If that doesn't work, I will visit the house with a police escort. If that doesn't work, I will have my new lawyer buddy draft and mail a letter.
Hopefully, they'll call and be decent and mature before we have to go through all this.
I know some will say this is entirely too much trouble for the return of my son's possessions. But it's gotten to the point it's a "principle" thing for me. They can either be adults about all this or they can be dragged through the system with me leading the way.
As they say, never a dull moment.
Thanks again guys for the wisdom and ideas - I'll let you know what happens.
I can see your point, but is it about principle or do you just want to "win"? Above seem like reasonable measures, and with the registered letter and first class letter, any future identity issues could possibly be attributed to them. Don't let it become and obsession and at some point cancel accounts, report to financial institutions that his data may been compromised and drop it. You might report the x box stolen, in case it ever shows up in a pawn shop.
Also consider if they know you well and your interest in this site, via your son, they could very well be reading these posts.
Also consider if they know you well and your interest in this site, via your son, they could very well be reading these posts.
Last edited:
Originally Posted By: Mr Nice
At this point really nothing the cops can legally do.
Can't search her residence for missing items.
I disagree, you will be surprised what a soft spoken police man/woman can do to help ya. It does not hurt to ask.
At this point really nothing the cops can legally do.
Can't search her residence for missing items.
I disagree, you will be surprised what a soft spoken police man/woman can do to help ya. It does not hurt to ask.
Originally Posted By: spasm3
I can see your point, but is it about principle or do you just want to "win"? Above seem like reasonable measures, and with the registered letter and first class letter, any future identity issues could possibly be attributed to them. Don't let it become and obsession and at some point cancel accounts, report to financial institutions that his data may been compromised and drop it. You might report the x box stolen, in case it ever shows up in a pawn shop.
Also consider if they know you well and your interest in this site, via your son, they could very well be reading these posts.
x2, but I say take them to civil court and post the video online, social justice...
I can see your point, but is it about principle or do you just want to "win"? Above seem like reasonable measures, and with the registered letter and first class letter, any future identity issues could possibly be attributed to them. Don't let it become and obsession and at some point cancel accounts, report to financial institutions that his data may been compromised and drop it. You might report the x box stolen, in case it ever shows up in a pawn shop.
Also consider if they know you well and your interest in this site, via your son, they could very well be reading these posts.
x2, but I say take them to civil court and post the video online, social justice...
Originally Posted By: spasm3
Also consider if they know you well and your interest in this site, via your son, they could very well be reading these posts.
Good point, but we never really "bonded" with the parents. We had supper with them one time but never really "hung out" together as their interests and ours are vastly different, (i.e. he likes to golf, I despise the game - things like that. The ex girlfriend's mom and my wife are very different from each other. My wife wouldn't say a curse word to save her life, the ex's mother seems to enjoy using four letter words).
And even if they were reading this site, all they could really pick up is what I'm going to do, which, in the course of time, they will find out anyway.
Excellent point though.
Also consider if they know you well and your interest in this site, via your son, they could very well be reading these posts.
Good point, but we never really "bonded" with the parents. We had supper with them one time but never really "hung out" together as their interests and ours are vastly different, (i.e. he likes to golf, I despise the game - things like that. The ex girlfriend's mom and my wife are very different from each other. My wife wouldn't say a curse word to save her life, the ex's mother seems to enjoy using four letter words).
And even if they were reading this site, all they could really pick up is what I'm going to do, which, in the course of time, they will find out anyway.
Excellent point though.
- Status
